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Author Topic: Rightly Dividing the Bible or Dispensations: Comments  (Read 5351 times)

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ac28

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Re: Rightly Dividing the Bible or Dispensations
« Reply #13 on: January 10, 2019, 08:09:15 am »



27 minutes
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jOqKNBLJdi8




It was a very pleasant surprise to see this video. Thanks, Patrick.

The preacher in the video is EC Moore. He was Acts13. He had a circuit in the 80's, where he traveled mainly in the Mobile/Pensacola area and gave weekly Bible studies. My son, who was about 20 at the time, traveled with him, for about a year, as mainly a gofer and occasional preacher. Before that, my son was attending Ruckman's Baptist college, but was told to leave when Ruckman discovered he was leaning towards mid-Acts.

At the time, my son and I were switching from Ruckman Baptist to mid-Acts and EC was a Godsend. Although I was Ac13 for only a year, or so, I still consider EC the best preacher I've ever heard. No matter what his topic, he always preached the Cross. There are 100s of his videos available, mainly on youtube. I probably averaged 2 of his Bible study tapes each day during that year I was Ac13. EC was my #1 mentor. I could easily pick his distinctive voice out of any crowd today. I prefer his audios, though, since I seem to detect a little self-consciousness in his videos.

I've always trusted my son's spiritual judgment and have basically followed him in the various interpretation systems he has gone through - I still do, although I'm slowly catching up with him. When he was a kid, I taught him how to be smart. When he grew up, he taught me what to be smart about. We next became Ac28 dispensationalists through the tutelage of Arthur Watkins, another Pensacola area preacher. That was 30 years ago and I haven't looked back.

From what I've seen, the Pensacola area is, perhaps, the greatest hotbed of mid-Acts and Ac28 dispensationalism in the country.



« Last Edit: January 10, 2019, 10:26:13 am by ac28 »
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ac28

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Re: Rightly Dividing the Bible or Dispensations
« Reply #14 on: January 14, 2019, 11:00:46 am »
I've seen lists with as many as 16-18 different dispensations. Most people pick 7 because 7 is the number of completion. I see 3, through the present dispensation. More in the future for Israel, starting about 2064.

(1) Anarchy, Giant rule, flood - Gen 1 through Gen 11 - 2000 years
(2) ALL-Israel, NO Gentiles - Gen 12 through Acts 28 - 2000 years
(3) ALL-Gentiles, NO Israel - Eph 1 through 2Tim - 64AD to 2064 - 2000 years
« Last Edit: January 14, 2019, 11:09:07 am by ac28 »
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Bladerunner

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Re: Rightly Dividing the Bible or Dispensations
« Reply #15 on: January 14, 2019, 02:17:28 pm »
I've seen lists with as many as 16-18 different dispensations. Most people pick 7 because 7 is the number of completion. I see 3, through the present dispensation. More in the future for Israel, starting about 2064.

(1) Anarchy, Giant rule, flood - Gen 1 through Gen 11 - 2000 years
(2) ALL-Israel, NO Gentiles - Gen 12 through Acts 28 - 2000 years
(3) ALL-Gentiles, NO Israel - Eph 1 through 2Tim - 64AD to 2064 - 2000 years



ac28...#1 is a personal view of the dispensation periods.  However,

#2.... "NO GENTILES".....Gentiles have been involved from Day 6. Adam and Eve were Gentiles.  Ruth a Moabite Priestess who married Boez and became the ancestry of Jesus Christ. (yes, Another Gentile).

The biggest problem I see, is that you left out the crucifixion of Jesus  in favor of Acts 28. I know your a Mid-Acts person but this is ridiculous. The Period of Grace started when Jesus Christ Died on that Cross and washed away all the sins of the world for those who would believe in HIM.  He spoke of this period (Kingdom of GOD) in early days of Matthew, Mark and Luke. Of course, the apostles did not understand it until those early days of Acts(2:1) when HIS Church was born. 

#3. NO ISRAEL?....God disbursed HIS chosen people throughout the world and partially blinding them so they may not see the truth. Since that time, He has lead them back from being an obscure peoples to a Nation in 1948. Did you know that the day after they declared themselves a sovereign Nation, they were attacked from three sides in an attempt to completely destroy them. While they had a small army it was no match for the other three nations attacking them... Yet, they won quite handily... The WORK of GOD???; I think so! 

For those Jews that have become Christians since that time, It seems you are forgetting them... What about those 3,000 Jews that became Christians in Acts 2. Did you forget them as well????????

It seems you are traveling a dangerous road which leads to anti-Semitism. We saw this in WWII and the Pulpit gets a part of the blame for the six million Jews Hitler killed. Yes, All they had to do was open their mouths and cry out for those poor Jewish souls. Yet, they were of the same mind 95% of the Churches throughout the world are in today.

When you are predicting 2064???? can you expand on that thought... Have not heard of that one before.

We are all in this together. Those who are not a part of HIS Church (Bride) will suffer the same faith as the Jewish People who do not find their Messiah in Jesus Christ.  They both will be swimming together in the Lake of Fire.

So Sad!

Blade


« Last Edit: April 01, 2020, 07:20:50 pm by Bladerunner »
1 Cor 15:3-4.."For I delivered unto you first of all that which I also received, how that Christ died for our sins according to the scriptures; And that he was buried, and that he rose again the third day according to the scriptures:"

Acts 17:11.."These were more noble than those in Thessalonica, in that they received the word with all readiness of mind, and searched the scriptures daily, whether those things were so."
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ac28

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Re: Rightly Dividing the Bible or Dispensations
« Reply #16 on: January 15, 2019, 04:36:15 pm »
I've seen lists with as many as 16-18 different dispensations. Most people pick 7 because 7 is the number of completion. I see 3, through the present dispensation. More in the future for Israel, starting about 2064.

(1) Anarchy, Giant rule, flood - Gen 1 through Gen 11 - 2000 years
(2) ALL-Israel, NO Gentiles - Gen 12 through Acts 28 - 2000 years
(3) ALL-Gentiles, NO Israel - Eph 1 through 2Tim - 64AD to 2064 - 2000 years


ac28...#1 is a personal view of the dispensation periods.  However,

#2.... "NO GENTILES".....Gentiles have been involved from Day 6. Adam and Eve were Gentiles.  Ruth a Moabite Priestess who married Boez and became the ancestry of Jesus Christ. (yes, Another Gentile).

The biggest problem I see, is that you left out the crucifixion of Jesus  in favor of Acts 28. I know your a Mid-Acts person but this is ridiculous. The Period of Grace started when Jesus Christ Died on that Cross and washed away all the sins of the world for those who would believe in HIM.  He spoke of this period (Kingdom of GOD) in early days of Matthew, Mark and Luke. Of course, the apostles did not understand it until those early days of Acts(2:1) when HIS Church was born. 

#3. NO ISRAEL?....God disbursed HIS chosen people throughout the world and partially blinding them so they may not see the truth. Since that time, He has lead them back from being an obscure peoples to a Nation in 1948. Did you know that the day after they declared themselves a sovereign Nation, they were attacked from three sides in an attempt to completely destroy them. While they had a small army it was no match for the other three nations attacking them... Yet, they won quite handily... The WORK of GOD???; I think so! 

For those Jews that have become Christians since that time, It seems you are forgetting them... What about those 3,000 Jews that became Christians in Acts 2. Did you forget them as well????????

It seems you are traveling a dangerous road which leads to anti-Semitism. We saw this in WWII and the Pulpit gets a part of the blame for the six million Jews Hitler killed. Yes, All they had to do was open their mouths and cry out for those poor Jewish souls. Yet, they were of the same mind 95% of the Churches throughout the world are in today.

When you are predicting 2064???? can you expand on that thought... Have not heard of that one before.

We are all in this together. Those who are not a part of HIS Church (Bride) will suffer the same faith as the Jewish People who do not find their Messiah in Jesus Christ.  They both will be swimming together in the Lake of Fire.

So Sad!

Blade

If you knew dispensationalism, you would know I am NOT mid-Acts. For 30 unwavering years, I have been an Acts 28 dispensationalist, the only group in the world that literally obeys 2Tim 2:15 and RIGHTLY divides (Correctly Cuts) God's Word. For 4000 years, God has always treated Israel and Gentiles differently. Except for Christ, I can think of nothing that God ever gave or commanded of Israel that He also gave or commanded of today's Gentiles, The purpose of right division is to cut and remove everything Israel from our personal doctrine that we Gentiles have been falsely taught by the denominational church system belongs to us. Only then will we know our true state and standing before God and our future, About 80-90% of what the average denominational preacher teaches is this Israel stuff that we will never, ever get because none of it was ever given to the Gentiles. No denominational preacher I have ever heard of has the foggiest idea about right division.

There is no nation of Israel today in God's eyes. After having had the blindness curse of Isa 6:9-10 pronounced upon her for the 5th and last time in the Bible, in Ac 28:25-27, the Salvation of God (Jesus Christ) was taken from her in vs 28 and given to the Gentiles. Today, Israel is just another Gentile nation in God's eyes. In Paul's 7 books written after Ac 28, there is no mention of Israel being Active today. EVERYTHING in those books is addressed to Gentiles - Search and See. She is Lo-ammi, not My people, Hosea 1:9. With no temple, it is impossible for her to keep the law.  Her present state is summed up in Hosea 3:4. She will be back after 2 days, 2000 years, about 2064, Hosea 6:2.

From Gen 12 through Acts 28, it was all-Israel, as far as God's Blessings were concerned. The ONLY way Gentiles could be blessed unto God was to become a Jew, a proselyte. Except for a mere handful, like Rahab, the only Gentiles to enjoy ANY blessings were those believers in Acts, starting with Acts 10. However, every saved Gentile in Acts was part of Israel, being grafted into Israel. Every blessing any Gentile had was borrowed  from Israel. The Gentile had absolutely nothing of their own. All in all, Acts was 100% Israel.

Since Gen 12, God has been calling out Saints to ultimately occupy the 3 parts of His Universe.
(1) The nation Israel will inherit the New Earth, as in the Abrahamic promises.
(2) Elite Israel will inherit the New Jerusalem, which is essentially part of the New Heavens, but attaches to the New Earth.  Note there is a gate in the NJ for each tribe. There are no Gentile gates. The Jewish occupants of the NJ will make up the bride.
(3) The present day Gentile church, which is found ONLY in Paul's 7 post-Acts epistles are the ONLY people in the Bible to have a Hope of spending eternity in Heavenly Places, Eph 2:6, Far above the created New Heavens. The place where Christ now sits at the right hand of God, Eph 1:20.

As a summary
(1) Gen 12 thru Acts 9, 2000 years. 100% Israel, as far as ANY blessings of God are concerned,
(2) Acts 10 thru Acts 28. Still all-Israel, since all saved Gentiles were part of Israel's program.
(3) After Acts. 100% Gentiles, since there has been no Israel since 64AD. Jews today are just Gentiles, in God's eyes. The only books of the Bible written TO or ABOUT anyone living today are - Eph, Phil, Col, 1&2Tim, Titus and Philemon. The other 59 books are written TO and ABOUT Israel, PERIOD!!. All of the Bible is written FOR us, FOR our learning, but Paul's 7 post-Acts books are the only books that tell us ANYTHING about our Hope and Calling, and our Future.

I feel very sad for you.

« Last Edit: April 01, 2020, 07:19:59 pm by Bladerunner »
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Bladerunner

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Re: Rightly Dividing the Bible or Dispensations
« Reply #17 on: January 15, 2019, 10:21:05 pm »
I've seen lists with as many as 16-18 different dispensations. Most people pick 7 because 7 is the number of completion. I see 3, through the present dispensation. More in the future for Israel, starting about 2064.

(1) Anarchy, Giant rule, flood - Gen 1 through Gen 11 - 2000 years
(2) ALL-Israel, NO Gentiles - Gen 12 through Acts 28 - 2000 years
(3) ALL-Gentiles, NO Israel - Eph 1 through 2Tim - 64AD to 2064 - 2000 years



ac28...#1 is a personal view of the dispensation periods.  However,

#2.... "NO GENTILES".....Gentiles have been involved from Day 6. Adam and Eve were Gentiles.  Ruth a Moabite Priestess who married Boez and became the ancestry of Jesus Christ. (yes, Another Gentile).

The biggest problem I see, is that you left out the crucifixion of Jesus  in favor of Acts 28. I know your a Mid-Acts person but this is ridiculous. The Period of Grace started when Jesus Christ Died on that Cross and washed away all the sins of the world for those who would believe in HIM.  He spoke of this period (Kingdom of GOD) in early days of Matthew, Mark and Luke. Of course, the apostles did not understand it until those early days of Acts(2:1) when HIS Church was born. 

#3. NO ISRAEL?....God disbursed HIS chosen people throughout the world and partially blinding them so they may not see the truth. Since that time, He has lead them back from being an obscure peoples to a Nation in 1948. Did you know that the day after they declared themselves a sovereign Nation, they were attacked from three sides in an attempt to completely destroy them. While they had a small army it was no match for the other three nations attacking them... Yet, they won quite handily... The WORK of GOD???; I think so! 

For those Jews that have become Christians since that time, It seems you are forgetting them... What about those 3,000 Jews that became Christians in Acts 2. Did you forget them as well????????

It seems you are traveling a dangerous road which leads to anti-Semitism. We saw this in WWII and the Pulpit gets a part of the blame for the six million Jews Hitler killed. Yes, All they had to do was open their mouths and cry out for those poor Jewish souls. Yet, they were of the same mind 95% of the Churches throughout the world are in today.

When you are predicting 2064???? can you expand on that thought... Have not heard of that one before.

We are all in this together. Those who are not a part of HIS Church (Bride) will suffer the same faith as the Jewish People who do not find their Messiah in Jesus Christ.  They both will be swimming together in the Lake of Fire.

So Sad!

Blade

If you knew dispensationalism, you would know I am NOT mid-Acts. For 30 unwavering years, I have been an Acts 28 dispensationalist, the only group in the world that literally obeys 2Tim 2:15 and RIGHTLY divides (Correctly Cuts) God's Word. For 4000 years, God has always treated Israel and Gentiles differently. Except for Christ, I can think of nothing that God ever gave or commanded of Israel that He also gave or commanded of today's Gentiles, The purpose of right division is to cut and remove everything Israel from our personal doctrine that we Gentiles have been falsely taught by the denominational church system belongs to us. Only then will we know our true state and standing before God and our future, About 80-90% of what the average denominational preacher teaches is this Israel stuff that we will never, ever get because none of it was ever given to the Gentiles. No denominational preacher I have ever heard of has the foggiest idea about right division.

There is no nation of Israel today in God's eyes. After having had the blindness curse of Isa 6:9-10 pronounced upon her for the 5th and last time in the Bible, in Ac 28:25-27, the Salvation of God (Jesus Christ) was taken from her in vs 28 and given to the Gentiles. Today, Israel is just another Gentile nation in God's eyes. In Paul's 7 books written after Ac 28, there is no mention of Israel being Active today. EVERYTHING in those books is addressed to Gentiles - Search and See. She is Lo-ammi, not My people, Hosea 1:9. With no temple, it is impossible for her to keep the law.  Her present state is summed up in Hosea 3:4. She will be back after 2 days, 2000 years, about 2064, Hosea 6:2.

From Gen 12 through Acts 28, it was all-Israel, as far as God's Blessings were concerned. The ONLY way Gentiles could be blessed unto God was to become a Jew, a proselyte. Except for a mere handful, like Rahab, the only Gentiles to enjoy ANY blessings were those believers in Acts, starting with Acts 10. However, every saved Gentile in Acts was part of Israel, being grafted into Israel. Every blessing any Gentile had was borrowed  from Israel. The Gentile had absolutely nothing of their own. All in all, Acts was 100% Israel.

Since Gen 12, God has been calling out Saints to ultimately occupy the 3 parts of His Universe.
(1) The nation Israel will inherit the New Earth, as in the Abrahamic promises.
(2) Elite Israel will inherit the New Jerusalem, which is essentially part of the New Heavens, but attaches to the New Earth.  Note there is a gate in the NJ for each tribe. There are no Gentile gates. The Jewish occupants of the NJ will make up the bride.
(3) The present day Gentile church, which is found ONLY in Paul's 7 post-Acts epistles are the ONLY people in the Bible to have a Hope of spending eternity in Heavenly Places, Eph 2:6, Far above the created New Heavens. The place where Christ now sits at the right hand of God, Eph 1:20.

As a summary
(1) Gen 12 thru Acts 9, 2000 years. 100% Israel, as far as ANY blessings of God are concerned,
(2) Acts 10 thru Acts 28. Still all-Israel, since all saved Gentiles were part of Israel's program.
(3) After Acts. 100% Gentiles, since there has been no Israel since 64AD. Jews today are just Gentiles, in God's eyes. The only books of the Bible written TO or ABOUT anyone living today are - Eph, Phil, Col, 1&2Tim, Titus and Philemon. The other 59 books are written TO and ABOUT Israel, PERIOD!!. All of the Bible is written FOR us, FOR our learning, but Paul's 7 post-Acts books are the only books that tell us ANYTHING about our Hope and Calling, and our Future.

I feel very sad for you.

Just about every thing you just said above is WRONG!    BUT!!!! the sentences that bother me the most are: YOU SAID:  "I have been an Acts 28 dispensationalist, the only group in the world that literally obeys 2Tim 2:15 and RIGHTLY divides (Correctly Cuts) God's Word."

For anyone to think they have the right to "CORRECTLY CUT" GOD's WORD is really messed up.

The other sentence: "The purpose of right division is to cut and remove everything Israel from our personal doctrine that we Gentiles have been falsely taught by the denominational church system belongs to us."

Personal DOCTRINEs Oh MY!.............I think you really need some help but after 30 years , it is apparent you are not going to change.

So Sad!

Blade
« Last Edit: April 01, 2020, 07:18:53 pm by Bladerunner »
1 Cor 15:3-4.."For I delivered unto you first of all that which I also received, how that Christ died for our sins according to the scriptures; And that he was buried, and that he rose again the third day according to the scriptures:"

Acts 17:11.."These were more noble than those in Thessalonica, in that they received the word with all readiness of mind, and searched the scriptures daily, whether those things were so."
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ac28

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Re: Rightly Dividing the Bible or Dispensations
« Reply #18 on: January 16, 2019, 09:09:21 am »
I've seen lists with as many as 16-18 different dispensations. Most people pick 7 because 7 is the number of completion. I see 3, through the present dispensation. More in the future for Israel, starting about 2064.

(1) Anarchy, Giant rule, flood - Gen 1 through Gen 11 - 2000 years
(2) ALL-Israel, NO Gentiles - Gen 12 through Acts 28 - 2000 years
(3) ALL-Gentiles, NO Israel - Eph 1 through 2Tim - 64AD to 2064 - 2000 years



ac28...#1 is a personal view of the dispensation periods.  However,

#2.... "NO GENTILES".....Gentiles have been involved from Day 6. Adam and Eve were Gentiles.  Ruth a Moabite Priestess who married Boez and became the ancestry of Jesus Christ. (yes, Another Gentile).

The biggest problem I see, is that you left out the crucifixion of Jesus  in favor of Acts 28. I know your a Mid-Acts person but this is ridiculous. The Period of Grace started when Jesus Christ Died on that Cross and washed away all the sins of the world for those who would believe in HIM.  He spoke of this period (Kingdom of GOD) in early days of Matthew, Mark and Luke. Of course, the apostles did not understand it until those early days of Acts(2:1) when HIS Church was born. 

#3. NO ISRAEL?....God disbursed HIS chosen people throughout the world and partially blinding them so they may not see the truth. Since that time, He has lead them back from being an obscure peoples to a Nation in 1948. Did you know that the day after they declared themselves a sovereign Nation, they were attacked from three sides in an attempt to completely destroy them. While they had a small army it was no match for the other three nations attacking them... Yet, they won quite handily... The WORK of GOD???; I think so! 

For those Jews that have become Christians since that time, It seems you are forgetting them... What about those 3,000 Jews that became Christians in Acts 2. Did you forget them as well????????

It seems you are traveling a dangerous road which leads to anti-Semitism. We saw this in WWII and the Pulpit gets a part of the blame for the six million Jews Hitler killed. Yes, All they had to do was open their mouths and cry out for those poor Jewish souls. Yet, they were of the same mind 95% of the Churches throughout the world are in today.

When you are predicting 2064???? can you expand on that thought... Have not heard of that one before.

We are all in this together. Those who are not a part of HIS Church (Bride) will suffer the same faith as the Jewish People who do not find their Messiah in Jesus Christ.  They both will be swimming together in the Lake of Fire.

So Sad!

Blade

If you knew dispensationalism, you would know I am NOT mid-Acts. For 30 unwavering years, I have been an Acts 28 dispensationalist, the only group in the world that literally obeys 2Tim 2:15 and RIGHTLY divides (Correctly Cuts) God's Word. For 4000 years, God has always treated Israel and Gentiles differently. Except for Christ, I can think of nothing that God ever gave or commanded of Israel that He also gave or commanded of today's Gentiles, The purpose of right division is to cut and remove everything Israel from our personal doctrine that we Gentiles have been falsely taught by the denominational church system belongs to us. Only then will we know our true state and standing before God and our future, About 80-90% of what the average denominational preacher teaches is this Israel stuff that we will never, ever get because none of it was ever given to the Gentiles. No denominational preacher I have ever heard of has the foggiest idea about right division.

There is no nation of Israel today in God's eyes. After having had the blindness curse of Isa 6:9-10 pronounced upon her for the 5th and last time in the Bible, in Ac 28:25-27, the Salvation of God (Jesus Christ) was taken from her in vs 28 and given to the Gentiles. Today, Israel is just another Gentile nation in God's eyes. In Paul's 7 books written after Ac 28, there is no mention of Israel being Active today. EVERYTHING in those books is addressed to Gentiles - Search and See. She is Lo-ammi, not My people, Hosea 1:9. With no temple, it is impossible for her to keep the law.  Her present state is summed up in Hosea 3:4. She will be back after 2 days, 2000 years, about 2064, Hosea 6:2.

From Gen 12 through Acts 28, it was all-Israel, as far as God's Blessings were concerned. The ONLY way Gentiles could be blessed unto God was to become a Jew, a proselyte. Except for a mere handful, like Rahab, the only Gentiles to enjoy ANY blessings were those believers in Acts, starting with Acts 10. However, every saved Gentile in Acts was part of Israel, being grafted into Israel. Every blessing any Gentile had was borrowed  from Israel. The Gentile had absolutely nothing of their own. All in all, Acts was 100% Israel.

Since Gen 12, God has been calling out Saints to ultimately occupy the 3 parts of His Universe.
(1) The nation Israel will inherit the New Earth, as in the Abrahamic promises.
(2) Elite Israel will inherit the New Jerusalem, which is essentially part of the New Heavens, but attaches to the New Earth.  Note there is a gate in the NJ for each tribe. There are no Gentile gates. The Jewish occupants of the NJ will make up the bride.
(3) The present day Gentile church, which is found ONLY in Paul's 7 post-Acts epistles are the ONLY people in the Bible to have a Hope of spending eternity in Heavenly Places, Eph 2:6, Far above the created New Heavens. The place where Christ now sits at the right hand of God, Eph 1:20.

As a summary
(1) Gen 12 thru Acts 9, 2000 years. 100% Israel, as far as ANY blessings of God are concerned,
(2) Acts 10 thru Acts 28. Still all-Israel, since all saved Gentiles were part of Israel's program.
(3) After Acts. 100% Gentiles, since there has been no Israel since 64AD. Jews today are just Gentiles, in God's eyes. The only books of the Bible written TO or ABOUT anyone living today are - Eph, Phil, Col, 1&2Tim, Titus and Philemon. The other 59 books are written TO and ABOUT Israel, PERIOD!!. All of the Bible is written FOR us, FOR our learning, but Paul's 7 post-Acts books are the only books that tell us ANYTHING about our Hope and Calling, and our Future.

I feel very sad for you.

Just about every thing you just said above is WRONG!    BUT!!!! the sentences that bother me the most are: YOU SAID:  "I have been an Acts 28 dispensationalist, the only group in the world that literally obeys 2Tim 2:15 and RIGHTLY divides (Correctly Cuts) God's Word."

For anyone to think they have the right to "CORRECTLY CUT" GOD's WORD is really messed up.

The other sentence: "The purpose of right division is to cut and remove everything Israel from our personal doctrine that we Gentiles have been falsely taught by the denominational church system belongs to us."

Personal DOCTRINEs Oh MY!.............I think you really need some help but after 30 years , it is apparent you are not going to change.

So Sad!

Blade

Everything I said was scriptural. It's foreign to you because you don't rightly divide, correctly cut, God's word, and, therefore, it's impossible for you to be scriptural. Instead of your goofy insults, why don't you try proving me wrong, scripturally? From what you've shown so far, you are just another typical victim of Satan's denominational church (synagogue) system, composed of preachers who teach unobtainable Jewish doctrine to unsuspecting Gentile sheep.

Here's a short list of doctrine that was given ONLY to Israel, but I would be shocked if you don't believe that you can falsely claim every item on the list as belonging to you. Show me, with scripture, where any of these things were EVER specifically given to Gentiles today - NOT the Gentiles in Acts, who were grafted into Israel, but the totally independent Gentiles today, as found ONLY in Paul's 7 post-Acts books. At the time each of these things was given to Israel, they were NOT given to any Gentile that was not part of Israel. Why do you think we Gentiles can claim them now? As a whole, Christendom falsely believes the church is replacing Israel, as does anyone that believes any of the following apply to the Gentile Church today.

---the Lord's prayer
---the Lord's supper,
---Christ's gospel of the Earthly Kingdom
---the Great Commission
---the churches in the Gospels and Acts (we have a brand new church in Eph and Col),
---the New Covenant,
---the sermon on the mount,
---all or any part of the Law,
---water baptism,
---the Gifts of the Spirit,
---the idea that we are the seed of Abraham and Abraham is our Father,
---the New Jerusalem,
---the idea that we Gentiles are now part of Israel, in any way, whatsoever
---and, of course, Satan's favorite, the Rapture, the lie that keeps people in Acts and out of the TRUTH

Nothing (except for Christ) in the OT, the Gospels, or the Acts period was TO or ABOUT any Gentile today. If you can't find it in Eph, Phil, Col, 1&2Tim, Titus, or Philemon, it isn't TO or ABOUT you today. These books are unique in that they are Calling out Gentiles to be the future occupants of Heavenly Places, Eph 2:6. Far above the starry Heavens, Eph 4:10, where Christ now sits at God's right hand, Eph 1:20. No one, no Jew, no Gentile, in the other all-Israel 59 books, EVER had a Hope of spending eternity in this Highest Heaven.

---Everything Paul taught in his 7 Acts books was based on the all-Israel OT, Moses and the Prophets, Ac 26:22.
---Everything Paul taught in his 7 post-Acts books was part of a mystery that had been hid in God since the world began, Eph 3:9, Col 1:26, until it was revealed to Paul by special revelation from Christ after Acts ended, Eph 3:3

Therefore, no human knew anything about the content of Eph, Col, etc., until Eph and Col, etc., were written. There is nothing about this mystery found anywhere else in scripture. Therefore, it is impossible to blend any scripture from Paul's last 7 books with any scripture from the other 59 books. Paul's 7 post-Acts books are  an island unto themselves, with no traffic in or out. These 7 books are the only books in the Bible TO or ABOUT anyone living today, including all Jews and all Gentiles.

If you want to argue scripture, I'm game. If you want to continue your pitiful insults, I don't have time to waste with you. So far, NOTHING you've said is credible. Check out the scripture I've given. Remove your Jewish spectacles and study Eph, Phil, and Col seriously for the first time in your life. You're a Pure Gentile under Pure Grace, which can only be found in Paul's 7 post-Acts epistles. You have absolutely no part in anything associated with Israel.

The blessings possible for you in Paul's 7 post-Acts epistles are 1000s of times better than anything EVER given to Israel. Why stay with the beggarly elements of Israel's blessings? There are indications that the Heavenly position in Eph is NOT automatic. In Paul's prayer of Eph 1:17-18, it indicates that God must give you the eyes of understanding in order for you to SEE the Hope of your calling found only in Paul's post-Acts epistles. In other words, if you can't see this Hope of the Highest Heaven, there is the possibility you won't go to Heaven. I believe that, if you don't give up all those Jewish beliefs, God won't allow you to SEE your true Hope of Heaven. That's what God's command to rightly divide is all about. In 2Tim 2:15, it says that, if you Correctly Cut God's Word, you will be approved unto God and will have no need to feel ashamed.

A question. Can you see your Hope in Ephesians, and that it's different than any other Hope in the Bible? If you can't, you have a problem.

Since nothing ever given to Israel, except Christ, was EVER given to today's Gentiles, it only requires one Correct Cut to separate all things Israel from all things Gentile. There is one place, and one place only, in scripture, where it is 100% Israel (59 books) on one side of the cut and 100% Gentiles (7 books) on the other side of the cut. That is between Acts and Ephesians. Everything in the 59 books is invaluable for our learning but, when it comes to things TO and ABOUT us and what is our Hope, Calling, and Future, only the 7 books written after Acts apply directly to us.

According to Strong's, the phrase, "rightly dividing" means, "make a straight cut", "Correctly cut" or "Correctly dissect". The Satanic modern Bibles, such as the ESV, ASV, NIV, NASB, use milky, wimpy, incorrect phrases like, "handling aright" or "correctly handles". These are easily proven to be wrong. Anything to "dumb down" Christendom.
« Last Edit: April 01, 2020, 07:17:00 pm by Bladerunner »
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Re: Rightly Dividing the Bible or Dispensations
« Reply #19 on: January 16, 2019, 07:19:55 pm »
I've seen lists with as many as 16-18 different dispensations. Most people pick 7 because 7 is the number of completion. I see 3, through the present dispensation. More in the future for Israel, starting about 2064.

(1) Anarchy, Giant rule, flood - Gen 1 through Gen 11 - 2000 years
(2) ALL-Israel, NO Gentiles - Gen 12 through Acts 28 - 2000 years
(3) ALL-Gentiles, NO Israel - Eph 1 through 2Tim - 64AD to 2064 - 2000 years



ac28...#1 is a personal view of the dispensation periods.  However,

#2.... "NO GENTILES".....Gentiles have been involved from Day 6. Adam and Eve were Gentiles.  Ruth a Moabite Priestess who married Boez and became the ancestry of Jesus Christ. (yes, Another Gentile).

The biggest problem I see, is that you left out the crucifixion of Jesus  in favor of Acts 28. I know your a Mid-Acts person but this is ridiculous. The Period of Grace started when Jesus Christ Died on that Cross and washed away all the sins of the world for those who would believe in HIM.  He spoke of this period (Kingdom of GOD) in early days of Matthew, Mark and Luke. Of course, the apostles did not understand it until those early days of Acts(2:1) when HIS Church was born. 

#3. NO ISRAEL?....God disbursed HIS chosen people throughout the world and partially blinding them so they may not see the truth. Since that time, He has lead them back from being an obscure peoples to a Nation in 1948. Did you know that the day after they declared themselves a sovereign Nation, they were attacked from three sides in an attempt to completely destroy them. While they had a small army it was no match for the other three nations attacking them... Yet, they won quite handily... The WORK of GOD???; I think so! 

For those Jews that have become Christians since that time, It seems you are forgetting them... What about those 3,000 Jews that became Christians in Acts 2. Did you forget them as well????????

It seems you are traveling a dangerous road which leads to anti-Semitism. We saw this in WWII and the Pulpit gets a part of the blame for the six million Jews Hitler killed. Yes, All they had to do was open their mouths and cry out for those poor Jewish souls. Yet, they were of the same mind 95% of the Churches throughout the world are in today.

When you are predicting 2064???? can you expand on that thought... Have not heard of that one before.

We are all in this together. Those who are not a part of HIS Church (Bride) will suffer the same faith as the Jewish People who do not find their Messiah in Jesus Christ.  They both will be swimming together in the Lake of Fire.

So Sad!

Blade

If you knew dispensationalism, you would know I am NOT mid-Acts. For 30 unwavering years, I have been an Acts 28 dispensationalist, the only group in the world that literally obeys 2Tim 2:15 and RIGHTLY divides (Correctly Cuts) God's Word. For 4000 years, God has always treated Israel and Gentiles differently. Except for Christ, I can think of nothing that God ever gave or commanded of Israel that He also gave or commanded of today's Gentiles, The purpose of right division is to cut and remove everything Israel from our personal doctrine that we Gentiles have been falsely taught by the denominational church system belongs to us. Only then will we know our true state and standing before God and our future, About 80-90% of what the average denominational preacher teaches is this Israel stuff that we will never, ever get because none of it was ever given to the Gentiles. No denominational preacher I have ever heard of has the foggiest idea about right division.

There is no nation of Israel today in God's eyes. After having had the blindness curse of Isa 6:9-10 pronounced upon her for the 5th and last time in the Bible, in Ac 28:25-27, the Salvation of God (Jesus Christ) was taken from her in vs 28 and given to the Gentiles. Today, Israel is just another Gentile nation in God's eyes. In Paul's 7 books written after Ac 28, there is no mention of Israel being Active today. EVERYTHING in those books is addressed to Gentiles - Search and See. She is Lo-ammi, not My people, Hosea 1:9. With no temple, it is impossible for her to keep the law.  Her present state is summed up in Hosea 3:4. She will be back after 2 days, 2000 years, about 2064, Hosea 6:2.

From Gen 12 through Acts 28, it was all-Israel, as far as God's Blessings were concerned. The ONLY way Gentiles could be blessed unto God was to become a Jew, a proselyte. Except for a mere handful, like Rahab, the only Gentiles to enjoy ANY blessings were those believers in Acts, starting with Acts 10. However, every saved Gentile in Acts was part of Israel, being grafted into Israel. Every blessing any Gentile had was borrowed  from Israel. The Gentile had absolutely nothing of their own. All in all, Acts was 100% Israel.

Since Gen 12, God has been calling out Saints to ultimately occupy the 3 parts of His Universe.
(1) The nation Israel will inherit the New Earth, as in the Abrahamic promises.
(2) Elite Israel will inherit the New Jerusalem, which is essentially part of the New Heavens, but attaches to the New Earth.  Note there is a gate in the NJ for each tribe. There are no Gentile gates. The Jewish occupants of the NJ will make up the bride.
(3) The present day Gentile church, which is found ONLY in Paul's 7 post-Acts epistles are the ONLY people in the Bible to have a Hope of spending eternity in Heavenly Places, Eph 2:6, Far above the created New Heavens. The place where Christ now sits at the right hand of God, Eph 1:20.

As a summary
(1) Gen 12 thru Acts 9, 2000 years. 100% Israel, as far as ANY blessings of God are concerned,
(2) Acts 10 thru Acts 28. Still all-Israel, since all saved Gentiles were part of Israel's program.
(3) After Acts. 100% Gentiles, since there has been no Israel since 64AD. Jews today are just Gentiles, in God's eyes. The only books of the Bible written TO or ABOUT anyone living today are - Eph, Phil, Col, 1&2Tim, Titus and Philemon. The other 59 books are written TO and ABOUT Israel, PERIOD!!. All of the Bible is written FOR us, FOR our learning, but Paul's 7 post-Acts books are the only books that tell us ANYTHING about our Hope and Calling, and our Future.

I feel very sad for you.

Just about every thing you just said above is WRONG!    BUT!!!! the sentences that bother me the most are: YOU SAID:  "I have been an Acts 28 dispensationalist, the only group in the world that literally obeys 2Tim 2:15 and RIGHTLY divides (Correctly Cuts) God's Word."

For anyone to think they have the right to "CORRECTLY CUT" GOD's WORD is really messed up.

The other sentence: "The purpose of right division is to cut and remove everything Israel from our personal doctrine that we Gentiles have been falsely taught by the denominational church system belongs to us."

Personal DOCTRINEs Oh MY!.............I think you really need some help but after 30 years , it is apparent you are not going to change.

So Sad!

Blade

Everything I said was scriptural. It's foreign to you because you don't rightly divide, correctly cut, God's word, and, therefore, it's impossible for you to be scriptural. Instead of your goofy insults, why don't you try proving me wrong, scripturally? From what you've shown so far, you are just another typical victim of Satan's denominational church (synagogue) system, composed of preachers who teach unobtainable Jewish doctrine to unsuspecting Gentile sheep.

Here's a short list of doctrine that was given ONLY to Israel, but I would be shocked if you don't believe that you can falsely claim every item on the list as belonging to you. Show me, with scripture, where any of these things were EVER specifically given to Gentiles today - NOT the Gentiles in Acts, who were grafted into Israel, but the totally independent Gentiles today, as found ONLY in Paul's 7 post-Acts books. At the time each of these things was given to Israel, they were NOT given to any Gentile that was not part of Israel. Why do you think we Gentiles can claim them now? As a whole, Christendom falsely believes the church is replacing Israel, as does anyone that believes any of the following apply to the Gentile Church today.

---the Lord's prayer
---the Lord's supper,
---Christ's gospel of the Earthly Kingdom
---the Great Commission
---the churches in the Gospels and Acts (we have a brand new church in Eph and Col),
---the New Covenant,
---the sermon on the mount,
---all or any part of the Law,
---water baptism,
---the Gifts of the Spirit,
---the idea that we are the seed of Abraham and Abraham is our Father,
---the New Jerusalem,
---the idea that we Gentiles are now part of Israel, in any way, whatsoever
---and, of course, Satan's favorite, the Rapture, the lie that keeps people in Acts and out of the TRUTH

Nothing (except for Christ) in the OT, the Gospels, or the Acts period was TO or ABOUT any Gentile today. If you can't find it in Eph, Phil, Col, 1&2Tim, Titus, or Philemon, it isn't TO or ABOUT you today. These books are unique in that they are Calling out Gentiles to be the future occupants of Heavenly Places, Eph 2:6. Far above the starry Heavens, Eph 4:10, where Christ now sits at God's right hand, Eph 1:20. No one, no Jew, no Gentile, in the other all-Israel 59 books, EVER had a Hope of spending eternity in this Highest Heaven.

---Everything Paul taught in his 7 Acts books was based on the all-Israel OT, Moses and the Prophets, Ac 26:22.
---Everything Paul taught in his 7 post-Acts books was part of a mystery that had been hid in God since the world began, Eph 3:9, Col 1:26, until it was revealed to Paul by special revelation from Christ after Acts ended, Eph 3:3

Therefore, no human knew anything about the content of Eph, Col, etc., until Eph and Col, etc., were written. There is nothing about this mystery found anywhere else in scripture. Therefore, it is impossible to blend any scripture from Paul's last 7 books with any scripture from the other 59 books. Paul's 7 post-Acts books are  an island unto themselves, with no traffic in or out. These 7 books are the only books in the Bible TO or ABOUT anyone living today, including all Jews and all Gentiles.

If you want to argue scripture, I'm game. If you want to continue your pitiful insults, I don't have time to waste with you. So far, NOTHING you've said is credible. Check out the scripture I've given. Remove your Jewish spectacles and study Eph, Phil, and Col seriously for the first time in your life. You're a Pure Gentile under Pure Grace, which can only be found in Paul's 7 post-Acts epistles. You have absolutely no part in anything associated with Israel.

The blessings possible for you in Paul's 7 post-Acts epistles are 1000s of times better than anything EVER given to Israel. Why stay with the beggarly elements of Israel's blessings? There are indications that the Heavenly position in Eph is NOT automatic. In Paul's prayer of Eph 1:17-18, it indicates that God must give you the eyes of understanding in order for you to SEE the Hope of your calling found only in Paul's post-Acts epistles. In other words, if you can't see this Hope of the Highest Heaven, there is the possibility you won't go to Heaven. I believe that, if you don't give up all those Jewish beliefs, God won't allow you to SEE your true Hope of Heaven. That's what God's command to rightly divide is all about. In 2Tim 2:15, it says that, if you Correctly Cut God's Word, you will be approved unto God and will have no need to feel ashamed.

A question. Can you see your Hope in Ephesians, and that it's different than any other Hope in the Bible? If you can't, you have a problem.

Since nothing ever given to Israel, except Christ, was EVER given to today's Gentiles, it only requires one Correct Cut to separate all things Israel from all things Gentile. There is one place, and one place only, in scripture, where it is 100% Israel (59 books) on one side of the cut and 100% Gentiles (7 books) on the other side of the cut. That is between Acts and Ephesians. Everything in the 59 books is invaluable for our learning but, when it comes to things TO and ABOUT us and what is our Hope, Calling, and Future, only the 7 books written after Acts apply directly to us.

According to Strong's, the phrase, "rightly dividing" means, "make a straight cut", "Correctly cut" or "Correctly dissect". The Satanic modern Bibles, such as the ESV, ASV, NIV, NASB, use milky, wimpy, incorrect phrases like, "handling aright" or "correctly handles". These are easily proven to be wrong. Anything to "dumb down" Christendom.

So far, NOTHING you've said is credible. back at you......It appears you do not believe in the millennium??

To be certain, One of us is wrong! It is a hard way to find out., When death comes to us, it will not allow any more  opportunity to change ones mind.

Have a good day

Blade
« Last Edit: April 01, 2020, 07:14:39 pm by Bladerunner »
1 Cor 15:3-4.."For I delivered unto you first of all that which I also received, how that Christ died for our sins according to the scriptures; And that he was buried, and that he rose again the third day according to the scriptures:"

Acts 17:11.."These were more noble than those in Thessalonica, in that they received the word with all readiness of mind, and searched the scriptures daily, whether those things were so."
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ac28

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Re: Rightly Dividing the Bible or Dispensations
« Reply #20 on: January 18, 2019, 08:42:14 am »
Blade,

I just noticed that, in what you wrote to me, you didn't quote scripture once, I assume that means you feel incapable of combating what I said. On the other hand, I quoted scripture 20 times. Everything I said is scriptural.

There has been no Israel, in God's eyes, for 1956 years. Absolutely no OT prophecy has been fulfilled during that time. God had no part in the formation of present day Israel. The map in this link proves that. When God does gather Israel, they will occupy all the land that was promised to Abraham, Issac,and Jacob.
http://www.refuteit.com/article-blog/the-geographic-center-of-the-earth-and-the-bible.

Of course I believe there will be a 1000 year reign of Christ on the earth.


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Bladerunner

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Re: Rightly Dividing the Bible or Dispensations
« Reply #21 on: January 18, 2019, 10:37:36 pm »
Blade,

I just noticed that, in what you wrote to me, you didn't quote scripture once, I assume that means you feel incapable of combating what I said. On the other hand, I quoted scripture 20 times. Everything I said is scriptural.

There has been no Israel, in God's eyes, for 1956 years. Absolutely no OT prophecy has been fulfilled during that time. God had no part in the formation of present day Israel. The map in this link proves that. When God does gather Israel, they will occupy all the land that was promised to Abraham, Issac,and Jacob.
http://www.refuteit.com/article-blog/the-geographic-center-of-the-earth-and-the-bible.


Of course I believe there will be a 1000 year reign of Christ on the earth.

Which post are you talking about ac28, there are three,.  No need to argue with you. you cannot see or will not see.,.... When Christ reigns on earth for that 1,000 years you believe in, that is when the REMNANT of Israel will be brought back into their land that was given to Moses.

Rev 12 1-17. with verse 17 telling us who Satan is at war with. "And the dragon was wroth with the woman, and went to make war with the remnant of her seed, which keep the commandments of God, and have the testimony of Jesus Christ."

In the mean time, the Nation of Israel and the world will have to endure several prophecies that are still unfulfilled. Psalm 83, Ezekiel 38, Isa 17:1; Jer 49:1-5; Isa 19:1-2; Gog/Magog War...Ezekial 38,39........ for a few..

YHou Said:"When God does gather Israel, they will occupy all the land that was promised to Abraham, Issac,and Jacob.
http://www.refuteit.com/article-blog/the-geographic-center-of-the-earth-and-the-bible"


I thought you were quoting only scripture.......this is not scripture:"http://www.refuteit.com/article-blog/the-geographic-center-of-the-earth-and-the-bible"



Hope this enough scripture for you......

Blade




« Last Edit: April 01, 2020, 07:12:40 pm by Bladerunner »
1 Cor 15:3-4.."For I delivered unto you first of all that which I also received, how that Christ died for our sins according to the scriptures; And that he was buried, and that he rose again the third day according to the scriptures:"

Acts 17:11.."These were more noble than those in Thessalonica, in that they received the word with all readiness of mind, and searched the scriptures daily, whether those things were so."
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ac28

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Re: Rightly Dividing the Bible or Dispensations
« Reply #22 on: January 19, 2019, 11:33:09 am »
Blade,

I just noticed that, in what you wrote to me, you didn't quote scripture once, I assume that means you feel incapable of combating what I said. On the other hand, I quoted scripture 20 times. Everything I said is scriptural.

There has been no Israel, in God's eyes, for 1956 years. Absolutely no OT prophecy has been fulfilled during that time. God had no part in the formation of present day Israel. The map in this link proves that. When God does gather Israel, they will occupy all the land that was promised to Abraham, Issac,and Jacob.
http://www.refuteit.com/article-blog/the-geographic-center-of-the-earth-and-the-bible.


Of course I believe there will be a 1000 year reign of Christ on the earth.

Which post are you talking about ac28, there are three,.  No need to argue with you. you cannot see or will not see.,.... When Christ reigns on earth for that 1,000 years you believe in, that is when the REMNANT of Israel will be brought back into their land that was given to Moses.

Rev 12 1-17. with verse 17 telling us who Satan is at war with. "And the dragon was wroth with the woman, and went to make war with the remnant of her seed, which keep the commandments of God, and have the testimony of Jesus Christ."

In the mean time, the Nation of Israel and the world will have to endure several prophecies that are still unfulfilled. Psalm 83, Ezekiel 38, Isa 17:1; Jer 49:1-5; Isa 19:1-2; Gog/Magog War...Ezekial 38,39........ for a few..

YHou Said:"When God does gather Israel, they will occupy all the land that was promised to Abraham, Issac,and Jacob.
http://www.refuteit.com/article-blog/the-geographic-center-of-the-earth-and-the-bible"


I thought you were quoting only scripture.......this is not scripture:"http://www.refuteit.com/article-blog/the-geographic-center-of-the-earth-and-the-bible"



Hope this enough scripture for you......

Blade
Not even close. How did you select that scripture? With a dart? In any case,it is meaningless to this discussion.

Where did I say I was quoting ONLY scripture? It's not a quote, anyway, It's a map that proves Israel only occupies about 1/50th of the land she was promised. When Christ returns, His angels will gather Israel and place them in the ENTIRE promised land.
« Last Edit: April 01, 2020, 07:11:53 pm by Bladerunner »

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Re: Rightly Dividing the Bible or Dispensations
« Reply #23 on: January 19, 2019, 12:11:10 pm »
Blade,

I just noticed that, in what you wrote to me, you didn't quote scripture once, I assume that means you feel incapable of combating what I said. On the other hand, I quoted scripture 20 times. Everything I said is scriptural.

There has been no Israel, in God's eyes, for 1956 years. Absolutely no OT prophecy has been fulfilled during that time. God had no part in the formation of present day Israel. The map in this link proves that. When God does gather Israel, they will occupy all the land that was promised to Abraham, Issac,and Jacob.
http://www.refuteit.com/article-blog/the-geographic-center-of-the-earth-and-the-bible.


Of course I believe there will be a 1000 year reign of Christ on the earth.

Which post are you talking about ac28, there are three,.  No need to argue with you. you cannot see or will not see.,.... When Christ reigns on earth for that 1,000 years you believe in, that is when the REMNANT of Israel will be brought back into their land that was given to Moses.

Rev 12 1-17. with verse 17 telling us who Satan is at war with. "And the dragon was wroth with the woman, and went to make war with the remnant of her seed, which keep the commandments of God, and have the testimony of Jesus Christ."

In the mean time, the Nation of Israel and the world will have to endure several prophecies that are still unfulfilled. Psalm 83, Ezekiel 38, Isa 17:1; Jer 49:1-5; Isa 19:1-2; Gog/Magog War...Ezekial 38,39........ for a few..

You Said:"When God does gather Israel, they will occupy all the land that was promised to Abraham, Issac,and Jacob.
http://www.refuteit.com/article-blog/the-geographic-center-of-the-earth-and-the-bible"


I thought you were quoting only scripture.......this is not scripture:"http://www.refuteit.com/article-blog/the-geographic-center-of-the-earth-and-the-bible"



Hope this enough scripture for you......

Blade
Not even close. How did you select that scripture? With a dart? In any case,it is meaningless to this discussion.

Where did I say I was quoting ONLY scripture? It's not a quote, anyway, It's a map that proves Israel only occupies about 1/50th of the land she was promised. When Christ returns, His angels will gather Israel and place them in the ENTIRE promised land.
[/quote]

I think it funny, in one area of your ramblings, you deny what I said yet, you agree with it in the last sentence. "When Christ returns, His angels will gather Israel and place them in the ENTIRE promised land."

BYE!

Blade
« Last Edit: April 01, 2020, 07:11:12 pm by Bladerunner »
1 Cor 15:3-4.."For I delivered unto you first of all that which I also received, how that Christ died for our sins according to the scriptures; And that he was buried, and that he rose again the third day according to the scriptures:"

Acts 17:11.."These were more noble than those in Thessalonica, in that they received the word with all readiness of mind, and searched the scriptures daily, whether those things were so."
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