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Author Topic: Amillenialism vs Pre-Trib Millennialism: Comments  (Read 20671 times)

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joechan82

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Re: Amillennialism or Premillennialism
« Reply #13 on: August 14, 2018, 04:45:29 pm »
Here is the point at which we diverge. I say that the church will go through Daniel's 70th week until wrath begins at the 7th trumpet. Now we will begin to argue things such as when does wrath begin, and why Daniel's 70th week includes both the church and national Israel. I can see this discussion as if it happened yesterday. I compare Matt 24:29-31 to 1Thess 4:13-8 and see the exact same event in both passages. Some may say, wait, one is for the Jews and the other is for the Church, because dispensationalism says it must be two different events. I say that dispensationalism is wrong on this point. I think they are wrong on the definition of the church too. I think the church started with Christ and the disciples during His earthly ministry, not at Pentecoste. The church (both the Jewish and Gentile elements) were grafted into the plan already in operation. The Jewish believing remnant was joined by the Samaratins, then the Gentiles. We are not separate from them. The nation of Israel left God, He did not leave them.
Rom 11:1  I say then, Hath God cast away his people? God forbid. For I also am an Israelite, of the seed of Abraham, of the tribe of Benjamin.
Rom 11:5  Even so then at this present time also there is a remnant according to the election of grace.
Rom 11:7  What then? Israel hath not obtained that which he seeketh for; but the election hath obtained it, and the rest were blinded
Rom 11:11  I say then, Have they stumbled that they should fall? God forbid: but rather through their fall salvation is come unto the Gentiles, for to provoke them to jealousy.
Rom 11:12  Now if the fall of them be the riches of the world, and the diminishing of them the riches of the Gentiles; how much more their fullness?

You said this, "The beginning of the Millennium was the end of the 1st resurrection!"

I completely agree with this, but it fits with pre-tribulation or pre-wrath. If the church is gone before the great tribulation, where in the world to all the saved people come from that are beheaded etc?
[/quote]

Where did it go... I had written a fews down and now it is gone. Oh-well...

Joe, I ask that you read these points.

* God has not left HIS people behind. This shown throughout prophecy in the OT and NT. The Covenants are and will be in effect. especially GEn 12:3.   oh, and GOD is in control, HE left them.

*If you rightly divide the Bible, everything will make sense and be easier to read ACTs 2:1 was the beginning of the CHurch because that was the day the Holy Spirit came into the Church.

*These are people that are left behind. You probably know some that believe in Jesus but do not believe in everythin He has said.
 the 144,000 will evangelize around the world and bring in multitudes . They themselves will be martyred. The two Witnesses will bring in many believers after they are rapture to heaven. These will also Die in Christ.  and the OT saints (their souls are in Heaven already) will be resurrected from their graves unto life again. They too are redeemed.

The Jews that flee Jerusalem when the Antichrist performed the Abomination of Desolate, will be protected by GOD (the Father) in the mountains of Petra. There He will feed and water them for the next 3. 5 years of Daniel's 70th week. These Jews will He give New Covenant, Jeremiah speaks of, into their hearts and removes all of their sins, forever. They will rule the Nation of Israel with Jesus during the millennium. Their Children will have 100 years to decide (to believe or Not to believe)

The last group are those that lived through Daniel's 70th week. They are the "maybe" believers as all the unbelievers are dead. These did not take the mark of the beast but managed to survive.  They will be given land and will turn their swords into plows.
They will have 100 years to make a decision (to believe or Not to Believe).

The Church (body of Christ) saints will judge from Thrones with Jesus

The Tribulation Saints will serve the Lord day and night. (at what I do not know)

It does not say what the 144,000 will be doing.

Blade

[/quote]
I need to learn how to quote just part of the conversations. When I quote a post, it quotes all the posts that have been quoted. I have read the book called One Book Rightly Divided, so I know what you mean by 'rightly dividing'. That alone should help you see where I am coming from. I just have some verses that challenge where exactly to divide. I am not pretending to be schooling you. I just want you to see where I am coming from. I already cited Matt 24:29-31 compared to 1Thes 4:13-18 so I won't keep saying the same thing over and over. I assume that you are very familiar with those verses, and can hopefully see why I see one event, not two.
My next comparison of passages is Matt 24:15-21 with 2Thes 2:1-4. Here Paul tells the church to look for the abomination of desolation, just like Jesus said in Matt 24. If Matt 24 is just for the Jews, why then does Paul explain it to the church?
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