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Author Topic: The dangers of woman keeping silent...  (Read 1141 times)

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Bladerunner

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Re: The dangers of woman keeping silent...
« Reply #104 on: April 27, 2019, 01:23:08 am »

Blade....I'm looking forward to you showing me in the study I did where I am missing not only the point of the passage but God and His word by allowing scripture to interpret scripture for me.  Thank you in advance for the time to show me my error not just tell me I am in error.

Your question was put in one of your post which I have copied it here. You said: "So question I purposed we think about....I have something to think on while I am gone...if we understand I Tim the way these videos teach it, what does that tell the men about their authority in the church?  More when I return...it's an interesting discussion.

As the Bride of Christ, the church is to take on the role of the wife in Ephesians 5...so when we are talking about men and the church, the men must (if the traditional understanding is correct) stop trying to run the church and usurp their own authority over that of Christ and be silent..


I had at one time brushed this off but after considerable research, have come back to it.

You are confusing the term "Bride of Christ" with that of a woman spoken of in 1 Tm 2:11; 1 Cor 14:34; 1 Tim 2:12.

The 'Bride of Christ' is patterned after the Jewish Wedding and as a prologue to the Rapture.  The first step of the "Betrothal" is for the prospective groom to negotiate a price that must be paid for the Bride. We see this in the purchase of both Leah and Rachel with 14 years of work for payment. We also see this in the sacrifice of Jesus Christ as the purchase for the Bride(His Church).

Note: Once the purchase price was paid in full, the Groom and the Bride were considered in a marriage covenant, thus the Church (Body and Bride) of Jesus is a done deal.

To be true to the pattern, the Groom would leave to His father's house to prepare a place for the Bride which usually took a year to complete.  The Bride during this time would prepare herself for marriage and gather her dowry. (1)

Did not Jesus tell us that He is leaving to His father's house to prepare a place for us? John 14:2

When the Groom returns for His wife to be with a "Shout".  (1 Th 4:16).

**
Are the passages (1 Tim 2:11-12) we speak of obscure or straight forward.
 
According to  Daniel Doriani, they have been traditionally interpreted in a straight forward manner. He says: "But suddenly, with the advent of modern feminism, many scholars have decided that these texts are obscure. Why has this happened? The texts did not change.”(2)

As C. S. Lewis once remarked, “We all want progress, but if you’re on the wrong road, progress means doing an about-turn and walking back to the right road; in that case, the man who turns back soonest is the most progressive.”(3)

Perceived clarity and purported certainty simply are not indicators of truth. (4)

 It appears that both complementarians and egalitarians hold to the "obscure in light of clear" hermeneutical principle. "If basic rules of hermeneutics can be so easily set aside when it is theologically convenient, upon what grounds do such concessions stop?"(5)

“Gal 3:28 asserts that there is equality in the church, so women should be able to do everything men can do” (a common caricature propagated by critics of women pastors). Rather, the argument is, “Gal 3:28 asserts that there is inherently no sexism in the body of Christ, and forbidding women from doing certain activities [e.g., pastoring] solely because of their sex is sexist.”(6)

**
Where in the Bible is  Scripture interpret Scripture:

2 Timothy 3:16 says, “All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness:”" If that is true, then it follows that all Scripture has one divine author even if it has many human authors" (7).

Yet, in John 20:31, gives the Book of JOHN  purpose as it does all of scripture in the Bible. One could take all the prophecies of Christ from Entry into Jerusalem to His resurrection as scripture interpreting scripture.

During Creation, God rested on the seventh day. There is much about the amount of time each day contain yet in Exodus 20:8-11, these scripture define the 7th day as a 24 hour day.

Summary: I have looked at many different articles, concerning the interpretation of 1 TIM 2:11-12 and have listed some of them. For me, there is only one way to read these scripture as I feel they are not obscure in any form nor do any other scriptures force a different view on their meaning. They are straight forward and along with 1 Cor 14:34-35, they imply the commandments of Jesus exactly as they were written. If your hermeneutics consider the Literal, Historical and Grammatical text as the Word of GOD, as the Commands He left  mankind  to follow, you will adhere to the traditional viewpoints of this argument.

On the other hand if you interpret the WORD of GOD using a progressive agenda or world view, then these scriptures are obscure and hard to read and with other scriptures pulled from the Bible, allow the woman to do anything a man can do in the church.

The scriptures in this case, do not mean what they say but rather what one feels like they should say or whatever is relative. In this case, we need to throw the Bible away for every word in the Bible is then suspect to it correctness, etc.

Thank goodness, this is a personal decision to accept the Bible (KJV) as it says in 1 TIM 2:12.."But I suffer not a woman to teach, nor to usurp authority over the man, but to be in silence."

You in the end, regardless of what I say, the bereans say, your husband says, will have to answer for your own decision on this matter.

It is very clear that the Bride of Christ does not have anything to do with these passages but rather the coming Rapture of the Bride (His spiritual Church) is contrasted to a Jewish Wedding.

Lori, I have spent many hours on this and have tried to give you a sensible answer. I can do no more...It is time for you to make that decision. I will pray that you make the right one according to my interpretation.

Hope you have a lovely day tomorrow.

Blade

p..s say hi to your husband and I hope you bet him on that prophecy He made. Oh, well we know one thing, He is not a prophet or soothsayer! ;D
[/shaddow]



1. http://www.jewishencyclopedia.com/articles/9290-ketubah

2. Grudem, Evangelical Feminism and Biblical Truth, 364.

3. C. S. Lewis, Mere Christianity, in The Complete C. S. Lewis Signature Classics (New York: HarperOne, 2002), 33.

4. For more on this important topic, especially as it relates to bibliology, see Carlos Bovell, Rehabilitating Inerrancy in a Culture of Fear (Eugene: Wipf & Stock, 2012); idem, Inerrancy and the Spiritual Formation of Younger Evangelicals (Eugene: Wipf & Stock, 2015); James Barr, Beyond Fundamentalism (Louisville: Westminster John Knox, 1984); Christian Smith, The Bible Made Impossible: Why Biblicism Is Not a Truly Evangelical Reading of Scripture (Grand Rapids: Brazos Press, 2012); N. T. Wright, Scripture and the Authority of God (New York: HarperOne, 2013); John Goldingay, Models for Scripture (Toronto: Clements, 2004); idem, Models for Interpretation of Scripture (Toronto: Clements, 2004); Craig Allert, A High View of Scripture? (Grand Rapids: Baker Academic, 2007); Peter Enns, The Sin of Certainty (New York: HarperCollins, 2016). For more on this topic in general, see Greg Boyd, Benefit of the Doubt: Breaking the Idol of Certainty (Grand Rapids: Baker, 2013).

5. Revisiting the Clarity of Scripture in 1 Timothy 2:12

6. ibid

7. Christian Answers to Two Roman Catholic Questions on “Catholic Answers”


1 Cor 15:3-4.."For I delivered unto you first of all that which I also received, how that Christ died for our sins according to the scriptures; And that he was buried, and that he rose again the third day according to the scriptures:"

Acts 17:11.."These were more noble than those in Thessalonica, in that they received the word with all readiness of mind, and searched the scriptures daily, whether those things were so."
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Lori Bolinger

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Re: The dangers of woman keeping silent...
« Reply #105 on: April 27, 2019, 12:41:43 pm »

Blade....I'm looking forward to you showing me in the study I did where I am missing not only the point of the passage but God and His word by allowing scripture to interpret scripture for me.  Thank you in advance for the time to show me my error not just tell me I am in error.
this isn't the study I was talking about...but I assume you know that....
Quote


Your question was put in one of your post which I have copied it here. You said: "So question I purposed we think about....I have something to think on while I am gone...if we understand I Tim the way these videos teach it, what does that tell the men about their authority in the church?  More when I return...it's an interesting discussion.

As the Bride of Christ, the church is to take on the role of the wife in Ephesians 5...so when we are talking about men and the church, the men must (if the traditional understanding is correct) stop trying to run the church and usurp their own authority over that of Christ and be silent..


I had at one time brushed this off but after considerable research, have come back to it.

You are confusing the term "Bride of Christ" with that of a woman spoken of in 1 Tm 2:11; 1 Cor 14:34; 1 Tim 2:12.
why do you always assume I am confusing terms without understanding of what I am saying?  wouldn't it be more profitable for you to ask for clarification if you don't understand rather than assume I am confusing terms?
Quote


The 'Bride of Christ' is patterned after the Jewish Wedding and as a prologue to the Rapture.  The first step of the "Betrothal" is for the prospective groom to negotiate a price that must be paid for the Bride. We see this in the purchase of both Leah and Rachel with 14 years of work for payment. We also see this in the sacrifice of Jesus Christ as the purchase for the Bride(His Church).

Note: Once the purchase price was paid in full, the Groom and the Bride were considered in a marriage covenant, thus the Church (Body and Bride) of Jesus is a done deal.

To be true to the pattern, the Groom would leave to His father's house to prepare a place for the Bride which usually took a year to complete.  The Bride during this time would prepare herself for marriage and gather her dowry. (1)

Did not Jesus tell us that He is leaving to His father's house to prepare a place for us? John 14:2

When the Groom returns for His wife to be with a "Shout".  (1 Th 4:16).
yep....but not part of the discussion.
Quote

**
Are the passages (1 Tim 2:11-12) we speak of obscure or straight forward.
 
According to  Daniel Doriani, they have been traditionally interpreted in a straight forward manner. He says: "But suddenly, with the advent of modern feminism, many scholars have decided that these texts are obscure. Why has this happened? The texts did not change.”(2)
as I previously stated, we cannot allow modern sins to tell us how to interpret a passage....you said you weren't doing that then come here and confess to that very thing. In fact, the very study I asked you to look at and show me where I have it wrong, did NOT assume anything at all about the text or culture....all it did was look at the text and ask what it really was telling us as per scripture interpreting scripture.  Previously you said that for me to allow scripture to interpret scripture would draw me away from God and His word but you show no reason for your claims...how can I consider what you are saying as truth without something to judge your claims by? 
Quote


As C. S. Lewis once remarked, “We all want progress, but if you’re on the wrong road, progress means doing an about-turn and walking back to the right road; in that case, the man who turns back soonest is the most progressive.”(3)

Perceived clarity and purported certainty simply are not indicators of truth. (4)
not sure what you are trying to say here.
Quote


 It appears that both complementarians and egalitarians hold to the "obscure in light of clear" hermeneutical principle. "If basic rules of hermeneutics can be so easily set aside when it is theologically convenient, upon what grounds do such concessions stop?"(5)
so show me where I laid hermeneutics aside...
Quote


“Gal 3:28 asserts that there is equality in the church, so women should be able to do everything men can do” (a common caricature propagated by critics of women pastors). Rather, the argument is, “Gal 3:28 asserts that there is inherently no sexism in the body of Christ, and forbidding women from doing certain activities [e.g., pastoring] solely because of their sex is sexist.”(6)
again not sure how that applies to anything I said.
Quote


**
Where in the Bible is  Scripture interpret Scripture:

2 Timothy 3:16 says, “All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness:”" If that is true, then it follows that all Scripture has one divine author even if it has many human authors" (7).

Yet, in John 20:31, gives the Book of JOHN  purpose as it does all of scripture in the Bible. One could take all the prophecies of Christ from Entry into Jerusalem to His resurrection as scripture interpreting scripture.

During Creation, God rested on the seventh day. There is much about the amount of time each day contain yet in Exodus 20:8-11, these scripture define the 7th day as a 24 hour day.

Summary: I have looked at many different articles, concerning the interpretation of 1 TIM 2:11-12 and have listed some of them. For me, there is only one way to read these scripture as I feel they are not obscure in any form nor do any other scriptures force a different view on their meaning. They are straight forward and along with 1 Cor 14:34-35, they imply the commandments of Jesus exactly as they were written. If your hermeneutics consider the Literal, Historical and Grammatical text as the Word of GOD, as the Commands He left  mankind  to follow, you will adhere to the traditional viewpoints of this argument.
Why?  If the traditional viewpoints are wrong, why would I hold to them simply because they are the traditionally help POV's?  As to scripture interpreting scripture...as I study scripture I refuse to assume any understanding that is not supported throughout the scriptures....but that is another discussion I think
Quote


On the other hand if you interpret the WORD of GOD using a progressive agenda or world view, then these scriptures are obscure and hard to read and with other scriptures pulled from the Bible, allow the woman to do anything a man can do in the church.
well that would leave out what I am saying because as I have told you, I am not progressive thinking in this area...as to other scripture...if it isn't stated several places in scripture, how can we know for sure we have the intended meaning?
Quote


The scriptures in this case, do not mean what they say but rather what one feels like they should say or whatever is relative. In this case, we need to throw the Bible away for every word in the Bible is then suspect to it correctness, etc.
so you believe I should throw away the bible because I want it to say the traditional understanding but can't find that backed up in scripture?  Isn't that putting self and tradition above God and what He says?
Quote


Thank goodness, this is a personal decision to accept the Bible (KJV) as it says in 1 TIM 2:12.."But I suffer not a woman to teach, nor to usurp authority over the man, but to be in silence."
well my personal decision is to accept everything God says as He intends for it to be understood...I don't know any other way to serve and Love Him.
Quote


You in the end, regardless of what I say, the bereans say, your husband says, will have to answer for your own decision on this matter.

It is very clear that the Bride of Christ does not have anything to do with these passages but rather the coming Rapture of the Bride (His spiritual Church) is contrasted to a Jewish Wedding.
You missed the point I was making...as Head of the man....the man must be in submission to Christ...that is the point.  In scripture that picture is of "silence" ....so, let me see if I can phrase this another way...if Christ is the head of the Church and the head of the man...then men are no more qualified to run the church than woman are....Christ alone is to run the church....men need to sit at the feet of Jesus in "silence" learning in all submission to Christ as He teaches and runs the church.
Quote


Lori, I have spent many hours on this and have tried to give you a sensible answer. I can do no more...It is time for you to make that decision. I will pray that you make the right one according to my interpretation.
I will continue to take the side of what I can find to be true in scripture and since you still refuse to show me where my study is wrong, I have nothing more I can do but trust that the Holy Spirit is teaching me since you will not.
Quote
 

Hope you have a lovely day tomorrow.

Blade

p..s say hi to your husband and I hope you bet him on that prophecy He made. Oh, well we know one thing, He is not a prophet or soothsayer! ;D
[/shaddow]



1. http://www.jewishencyclopedia.com/articles/9290-ketubah

2. Grudem, Evangelical Feminism and Biblical Truth, 364.

3. C. S. Lewis, Mere Christianity, in The Complete C. S. Lewis Signature Classics (New York: HarperOne, 2002), 33.

4. For more on this important topic, especially as it relates to bibliology, see Carlos Bovell, Rehabilitating Inerrancy in a Culture of Fear (Eugene: Wipf & Stock, 2012); idem, Inerrancy and the Spiritual Formation of Younger Evangelicals (Eugene: Wipf & Stock, 2015); James Barr, Beyond Fundamentalism (Louisville: Westminster John Knox, 1984); Christian Smith, The Bible Made Impossible: Why Biblicism Is Not a Truly Evangelical Reading of Scripture (Grand Rapids: Brazos Press, 2012); N. T. Wright, Scripture and the Authority of God (New York: HarperOne, 2013); John Goldingay, Models for Scripture (Toronto: Clements, 2004); idem, Models for Interpretation of Scripture (Toronto: Clements, 2004); Craig Allert, A High View of Scripture? (Grand Rapids: Baker Academic, 2007); Peter Enns, The Sin of Certainty (New York: HarperCollins, 2016). For more on this topic in general, see Greg Boyd, Benefit of the Doubt: Breaking the Idol of Certainty (Grand Rapids: Baker, 2013).

5. Revisiting the Clarity of Scripture in 1 Timothy 2:12

6. ibid

7. Christian Answers to Two Roman Catholic Questions on “Catholic Answers”

since you still did NOT do what I asked, I would say he did pretty good at predicting what would happen.
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Bladerunner

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Re: The dangers of woman keeping silent...
« Reply #106 on: April 28, 2019, 01:11:59 am »

Blade....I'm looking forward to you showing me in the study I did where I am missing not only the point of the passage but God and His word by allowing scripture to interpret scripture for me.  Thank you in advance for the time to show me my error not just tell me I am in error.
this isn't the study I was talking about...but I assume you know that....
Quote


Your question was put in one of your post which I have copied it here. You said: "So question I purposed we think about....I have something to think on while I am gone...if we understand I Tim the way these videos teach it, what does that tell the men about their authority in the church?  More when I return...it's an interesting discussion.

As the Bride of Christ, the church is to take on the role of the wife in Ephesians 5...so when we are talking about men and the church, the men must (if the traditional understanding is correct) stop trying to run the church and usurp their own authority over that of Christ and be silent..


I had at one time brushed this off but after considerable research, have come back to it.

You are confusing the term "Bride of Christ" with that of a woman spoken of in 1 Tm 2:11; 1 Cor 14:34; 1 Tim 2:12.
why do you always assume I am confusing terms without understanding of what I am saying?  wouldn't it be more profitable for you to ask for clarification if you don't understand rather than assume I am confusing terms?
Quote


The 'Bride of Christ' is patterned after the Jewish Wedding and as a prologue to the Rapture.  The first step of the "Betrothal" is for the prospective groom to negotiate a price that must be paid for the Bride. We see this in the purchase of both Leah and Rachel with 14 years of work for payment. We also see this in the sacrifice of Jesus Christ as the purchase for the Bride(His Church).

Note: Once the purchase price was paid in full, the Groom and the Bride were considered in a marriage covenant, thus the Church (Body and Bride) of Jesus is a done deal.

To be true to the pattern, the Groom would leave to His father's house to prepare a place for the Bride which usually took a year to complete.  The Bride during this time would prepare herself for marriage and gather her dowry. (1)

Did not Jesus tell us that He is leaving to His father's house to prepare a place for us? John 14:2

When the Groom returns for His wife to be with a "Shout".  (1 Th 4:16).
yep....but not part of the discussion.
Quote

**
Are the passages (1 Tim 2:11-12) we speak of obscure or straight forward.
 
According to  Daniel Doriani, they have been traditionally interpreted in a straight forward manner. He says: "But suddenly, with the advent of modern feminism, many scholars have decided that these texts are obscure. Why has this happened? The texts did not change.”(2)
as I previously stated, we cannot allow modern sins to tell us how to interpret a passage....you said you weren't doing that then come here and confess to that very thing. In fact, the very study I asked you to look at and show me where I have it wrong, did NOT assume anything at all about the text or culture....all it did was look at the text and ask what it really was telling us as per scripture interpreting scripture.  Previously you said that for me to allow scripture to interpret scripture would draw me away from God and His word but you show no reason for your claims...how can I consider what you are saying as truth without something to judge your claims by? 
Quote


As C. S. Lewis once remarked, “We all want progress, but if you’re on the wrong road, progress means doing an about-turn and walking back to the right road; in that case, the man who turns back soonest is the most progressive.”(3)

Perceived clarity and purported certainty simply are not indicators of truth. (4)
not sure what you are trying to say here.
Quote


 It appears that both complementarians and egalitarians hold to the "obscure in light of clear" hermeneutical principle. "If basic rules of hermeneutics can be so easily set aside when it is theologically convenient, upon what grounds do such concessions stop?"(5)
so show me where I laid hermeneutics aside...
Quote


“Gal 3:28 asserts that there is equality in the church, so women should be able to do everything men can do” (a common caricature propagated by critics of women pastors). Rather, the argument is, “Gal 3:28 asserts that there is inherently no sexism in the body of Christ, and forbidding women from doing certain activities [e.g., pastoring] solely because of their sex is sexist.”(6)
again not sure how that applies to anything I said.
Quote


**
Where in the Bible is  Scripture interpret Scripture:

2 Timothy 3:16 says, “All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness:”" If that is true, then it follows that all Scripture has one divine author even if it has many human authors" (7).

Yet, in John 20:31, gives the Book of JOHN  purpose as it does all of scripture in the Bible. One could take all the prophecies of Christ from Entry into Jerusalem to His resurrection as scripture interpreting scripture.

During Creation, God rested on the seventh day. There is much about the amount of time each day contain yet in Exodus 20:8-11, these scripture define the 7th day as a 24 hour day.

Summary: I have looked at many different articles, concerning the interpretation of 1 TIM 2:11-12 and have listed some of them. For me, there is only one way to read these scripture as I feel they are not obscure in any form nor do any other scriptures force a different view on their meaning. They are straight forward and along with 1 Cor 14:34-35, they imply the commandments of Jesus exactly as they were written. If your hermeneutics consider the Literal, Historical and Grammatical text as the Word of GOD, as the Commands He left  mankind  to follow, you will adhere to the traditional viewpoints of this argument.
Why?  If the traditional viewpoints are wrong, why would I hold to them simply because they are the traditionally help POV's?  As to scripture interpreting scripture...as I study scripture I refuse to assume any understanding that is not supported throughout the scriptures....but that is another discussion I think
Quote


On the other hand if you interpret the WORD of GOD using a progressive agenda or world view, then these scriptures are obscure and hard to read and with other scriptures pulled from the Bible, allow the woman to do anything a man can do in the church.
well that would leave out what I am saying because as I have told you, I am not progressive thinking in this area...as to other scripture...if it isn't stated several places in scripture, how can we know for sure we have the intended meaning?
Quote


The scriptures in this case, do not mean what they say but rather what one feels like they should say or whatever is relative. In this case, we need to throw the Bible away for every word in the Bible is then suspect to it correctness, etc.
so you believe I should throw away the bible because I want it to say the traditional understanding but can't find that backed up in scripture?  Isn't that putting self and tradition above God and what He says?
Quote


Thank goodness, this is a personal decision to accept the Bible (KJV) as it says in 1 TIM 2:12.."But I suffer not a woman to teach, nor to usurp authority over the man, but to be in silence."
well my personal decision is to accept everything God says as He intends for it to be understood...I don't know any other way to serve and Love Him.
Quote


You in the end, regardless of what I say, the bereans say, your husband says, will have to answer for your own decision on this matter.

It is very clear that the Bride of Christ does not have anything to do with these passages but rather the coming Rapture of the Bride (His spiritual Church) is contrasted to a Jewish Wedding.
You missed the point I was making...as Head of the man....the man must be in submission to Christ...that is the point.  In scripture that picture is of "silence" ....so, let me see if I can phrase this another way...if Christ is the head of the Church and the head of the man...then men are no more qualified to run the church than woman are....Christ alone is to run the church....men need to sit at the feet of Jesus in "silence" learning in all submission to Christ as He teaches and runs the church.
Quote


Lori, I have spent many hours on this and have tried to give you a sensible answer. I can do no more...It is time for you to make that decision. I will pray that you make the right one according to my interpretation.
I will continue to take the side of what I can find to be true in scripture and since you still refuse to show me where my study is wrong, I have nothing more I can do but trust that the Holy Spirit is teaching me since you will not.
Quote
 

Hope you have a lovely day tomorrow.

Blade

p..s say hi to your husband and I hope you bet him on that prophecy He made. Oh, well we know one thing, He is not a prophet or soothsayer! ;D
[/shaddow]



1. http://www.jewishencyclopedia.com/articles/9290-ketubah

2. Grudem, Evangelical Feminism and Biblical Truth, 364.

3. C. S. Lewis, Mere Christianity, in The Complete C. S. Lewis Signature Classics (New York: HarperOne, 2002), 33.

4. For more on this important topic, especially as it relates to bibliology, see Carlos Bovell, Rehabilitating Inerrancy in a Culture of Fear (Eugene: Wipf & Stock, 2012); idem, Inerrancy and the Spiritual Formation of Younger Evangelicals (Eugene: Wipf & Stock, 2015); James Barr, Beyond Fundamentalism (Louisville: Westminster John Knox, 1984); Christian Smith, The Bible Made Impossible: Why Biblicism Is Not a Truly Evangelical Reading of Scripture (Grand Rapids: Brazos Press, 2012); N. T. Wright, Scripture and the Authority of God (New York: HarperOne, 2013); John Goldingay, Models for Scripture (Toronto: Clements, 2004); idem, Models for Interpretation of Scripture (Toronto: Clements, 2004); Craig Allert, A High View of Scripture? (Grand Rapids: Baker Academic, 2007); Peter Enns, The Sin of Certainty (New York: HarperCollins, 2016). For more on this topic in general, see Greg Boyd, Benefit of the Doubt: Breaking the Idol of Certainty (Grand Rapids: Baker, 2013).

5. Revisiting the Clarity of Scripture in 1 Timothy 2:12

6. ibid

7. Christian Answers to Two Roman Catholic Questions on “Catholic Answers”

since you still did NOT do what I asked, I would say he did pretty good at predicting what would happen.

To be quite frank, Lori.. 1 Tim 2:12 relegates Christian Women to a sphere of influence and action..their Home and raises these Women of Christ from the position of degradation and intellectual inferiority they have experienced for the past 2000 years in the pagan systems of the East and the West to a sphere within where Women should work exercising her power and influence---in the HOME. A special place given to her by GOD in His plan for both sexes while on this earth knowing that She is a fellow-heir to the Kingdom of God where sexes WILL  no longer exist in the future. Until Mankind gets to this future place, he and she are still required to follow the teachings of Jesus Christ.

Yet, in her infinite wisdom, the Modern woman rejects this plan, jumping right back into the very cesspool of inferiority she  experienced in earlier years.

Yes, we are both a part of the Church(Body and the Bride) of Jesus Christ, yet this is a spiritual kingdom that we have only partly been able to participate in. Until ones death releases their spirit from this world and the bodies of those who have died "in Christ" are resurrected and transfigured;  the plan of Jesus Christ which was placed into action by forty writers of the Bible for both Man and Woman will remain in effect.

The pagan world may ignore the teaching of Paul by rejecting the clear straightforward commands of our Lord,like 1 Tim 2:9-15 yet in the end, those Christian Women who follow the traditional teachings will reap the rewards in a future setting of the Kingdom of God.

Blade
1 Cor 15:3-4.."For I delivered unto you first of all that which I also received, how that Christ died for our sins according to the scriptures; And that he was buried, and that he rose again the third day according to the scriptures:"

Acts 17:11.."These were more noble than those in Thessalonica, in that they received the word with all readiness of mind, and searched the scriptures daily, whether those things were so."

Lori Bolinger

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Re: The dangers of woman keeping silent...
« Reply #107 on: April 29, 2019, 11:15:36 am »

To be quite frank, Lori.. 1 Tim 2:12 relegates Christian Women to a sphere of influence and action..their Home and raises these Women of Christ from the position of degradation and intellectual inferiority they have experienced for the past 2000 years in the pagan systems of the East and the West to a sphere within where Women should work exercising her power and influence---in the HOME. A special place given to her by GOD in His plan for both sexes while on this earth knowing that She is a fellow-heir to the Kingdom of God where sexes WILL  no longer exist in the future. Until Mankind gets to this future place, he and she are still required to follow the teachings of Jesus Christ.

Yet, in her infinite wisdom, the Modern woman rejects this plan, jumping right back into the very cesspool of inferiority she  experienced in earlier years.
what do you NOT understand about me wanting to understand I Tim. in light of the traditional teaching because it is the comfortable teaching to me but that I can't find that understanding when I actually take time to study the passage in light of scripture interpreting scripture? 
Quote


Yes, we are both a part of the Church(Body and the Bride) of Jesus Christ, yet this is a spiritual kingdom that we have only partly been able to participate in. Until ones death releases their spirit from this world and the bodies of those who have died "in Christ" are resurrected and transfigured;  the plan of Jesus Christ which was placed into action by forty writers of the Bible for both Man and Woman will remain in effect.
see above...you keep asserting your understanding is the right one but refuse to look at the study I did and show me where I went wrong.  How can I consider myself wrong when no one will show me where the error is?  In fact, in place of studying the passage, you make false assumptions and assertions of what I am saying and never once consider that what I am understanding from my study of the text, is a much much harder thing to obey.
Quote


The pagan world may ignore the teaching of Paul by rejecting the clear straightforward commands of our Lord,like 1 Tim 2:9-15 yet in the end, those Christian Women who follow the traditional teachings will reap the rewards in a future setting of the Kingdom of God.

Blade[/shadow]
So now you want to claim that following traditions of man are more important than following the Commands of God?  How strange...I honestly believe we should challenge every tradition of man against what scripture really does say if we want to please God not man!!!!!!!!!!!!

Bladerunner

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Re: The dangers of woman keeping silent...
« Reply #108 on: April 29, 2019, 07:52:08 pm »

To be quite frank, Lori.. 1 Tim 2:12 relegates Christian Women to a sphere of influence and action..their Home and raises these Women of Christ from the position of degradation and intellectual inferiority they have experienced for the past 2000 years in the pagan systems of the East and the West to a sphere within where Women should work exercising her power and influence---in the HOME. A special place given to her by GOD in His plan for both sexes while on this earth knowing that She is a fellow-heir to the Kingdom of God where sexes WILL  no longer exist in the future. Until Mankind gets to this future place, he and she are still required to follow the teachings of Jesus Christ.

Yet, in her infinite wisdom, the Modern woman rejects this plan, jumping right back into the very cesspool of inferiority she  experienced in earlier years.
what do you NOT understand about me wanting to understand I Tim. in light of the traditional teaching because it is the comfortable teaching to me but that I can't find that understanding when I actually take time to study the passage in light of scripture interpreting scripture? 
Quote


Yes, we are both a part of the Church(Body and the Bride) of Jesus Christ, yet this is a spiritual kingdom that we have only partly been able to participate in. Until ones death releases their spirit from this world and the bodies of those who have died "in Christ" are resurrected and transfigured;  the plan of Jesus Christ which was placed into action by forty writers of the Bible for both Man and Woman will remain in effect.
see above...you keep asserting your understanding is the right one but refuse to look at the study I did and show me where I went wrong.  How can I consider myself wrong when no one will show me where the error is?  In fact, in place of studying the passage, you make false assumptions and assertions of what I am saying and never once consider that what I am understanding from my study of the text, is a much much harder thing to obey.
Quote


The pagan world may ignore the teaching of Paul by rejecting the clear straightforward commands of our Lord,like 1 Tim 2:9-15 yet in the end, those Christian Women who follow the traditional teachings will reap the rewards in a future setting of the Kingdom of God.

Blade[/shadow]
So now you want to claim that following traditions of man are more important than following the Commands of God?  How strange...I honestly believe we should challenge every tradition of man against what scripture really does say if we want to please God not man!!!!!!!!!!!!

Then read and follow the verses in 1 Tim 2:9-12 literally! While your at it, read verses 13 thru 15 and take it up with the LORD on why He placed the sphere of influence and power of the woman in the HOME and not the Church.

Rem this Lori, 'the SIN, Eve and Adam committed in Eden are the same yet only one allowed herself to be deceived.'

You and other women carry the shame of 'disobeying GOD' by  being deluded by the serpent (Satan).

I and other men carry the shame of 'Disobeying GOD' and 'Man's Downfall' for the Love of a woman!


Blade





1 Cor 15:3-4.."For I delivered unto you first of all that which I also received, how that Christ died for our sins according to the scriptures; And that he was buried, and that he rose again the third day according to the scriptures:"

Acts 17:11.."These were more noble than those in Thessalonica, in that they received the word with all readiness of mind, and searched the scriptures daily, whether those things were so."
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Lori Bolinger

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Re: The dangers of woman keeping silent...
« Reply #109 on: April 30, 2019, 08:40:24 am »

To be quite frank, Lori.. 1 Tim 2:12 relegates Christian Women to a sphere of influence and action..their Home and raises these Women of Christ from the position of degradation and intellectual inferiority they have experienced for the past 2000 years in the pagan systems of the East and the West to a sphere within where Women should work exercising her power and influence---in the HOME. A special place given to her by GOD in His plan for both sexes while on this earth knowing that She is a fellow-heir to the Kingdom of God where sexes WILL  no longer exist in the future. Until Mankind gets to this future place, he and she are still required to follow the teachings of Jesus Christ.

Yet, in her infinite wisdom, the Modern woman rejects this plan, jumping right back into the very cesspool of inferiority she  experienced in earlier years.
what do you NOT understand about me wanting to understand I Tim. in light of the traditional teaching because it is the comfortable teaching to me but that I can't find that understanding when I actually take time to study the passage in light of scripture interpreting scripture? 
Quote


Yes, we are both a part of the Church(Body and the Bride) of Jesus Christ, yet this is a spiritual kingdom that we have only partly been able to participate in. Until ones death releases their spirit from this world and the bodies of those who have died "in Christ" are resurrected and transfigured;  the plan of Jesus Christ which was placed into action by forty writers of the Bible for both Man and Woman will remain in effect.
see above...you keep asserting your understanding is the right one but refuse to look at the study I did and show me where I went wrong.  How can I consider myself wrong when no one will show me where the error is?  In fact, in place of studying the passage, you make false assumptions and assertions of what I am saying and never once consider that what I am understanding from my study of the text, is a much much harder thing to obey.
Quote


The pagan world may ignore the teaching of Paul by rejecting the clear straightforward commands of our Lord,like 1 Tim 2:9-15 yet in the end, those Christian Women who follow the traditional teachings will reap the rewards in a future setting of the Kingdom of God.

Blade[/shadow]
So now you want to claim that following traditions of man are more important than following the Commands of God?  How strange...I honestly believe we should challenge every tradition of man against what scripture really does say if we want to please God not man!!!!!!!!!!!!

Then read and follow the verses in 1 Tim 2:9-12 literally! While your at it, read verses 13 thru 15 and take it up with the LORD on why He placed the sphere of influence and power of the woman in the HOME and not the Church.

Rem this Lori, 'the SIN, Eve and Adam committed in Eden are the same yet only one allowed herself to be deceived.'

You and other women carry the shame of 'disobeying GOD' by  being deluded by the serpent (Satan).

I and other men carry the shame of 'Disobeying GOD' and 'Man's Downfall' for the Love of a woman!


Blade

Nothing there addresses what I asked you to address.  Why so stubbornly refuse?
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patrick jane

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Hearing, believing and trusting the finished work of Jesus Christ on the cross; His death, burial and resurrection for the forgiveness of sins, the gospel of our salvation, and repenting, seals us with that Holy Spirit of Promise. The Lord is not slack concerning His promise. 2 Peter 3:9 KJV - 1 Corinthians 15:1-4 KJV - Ephesians 1:10-14 KJV - Romans 10:9-10 KJV - Romans 10:13 - Romans 10:17 - Ephesians 1:7 KJV - Colossians 1:14 KJV -


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Lori Bolinger

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Re: The dangers of woman keeping silent...
« Reply #111 on: May 08, 2019, 09:32:52 am »
Women and Ministry


Lori, I think you will agree with this lesson.

1 hour
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CA647v1MiFs&list=WL&index=8&t=64s




















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closer to what I found when I studied it than anything else I've seen so far.

Bladerunner

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Re: The dangers of woman keeping silent...
« Reply #112 on: May 19, 2019, 10:09:40 pm »

To be quite frank, Lori.. 1 Tim 2:12 relegates Christian Women to a sphere of influence and action..their Home and raises these Women of Christ from the position of degradation and intellectual inferiority they have experienced for the past 2000 years in the pagan systems of the East and the West to a sphere within where Women should work exercising her power and influence---in the HOME. A special place given to her by GOD in His plan for both sexes while on this earth knowing that She is a fellow-heir to the Kingdom of God where sexes WILL  no longer exist in the future. Until Mankind gets to this future place, he and she are still required to follow the teachings of Jesus Christ.

Yet, in her infinite wisdom, the Modern woman rejects this plan, jumping right back into the very cesspool of inferiority she  experienced in earlier years.
what do you NOT understand about me wanting to understand I Tim. in light of the traditional teaching because it is the comfortable teaching to me but that I can't find that understanding when I actually take time to study the passage in light of scripture interpreting scripture? 
Quote


Yes, we are both a part of the Church(Body and the Bride) of Jesus Christ, yet this is a spiritual kingdom that we have only partly been able to participate in. Until ones death releases their spirit from this world and the bodies of those who have died "in Christ" are resurrected and transfigured;  the plan of Jesus Christ which was placed into action by forty writers of the Bible for both Man and Woman will remain in effect.
see above...you keep asserting your understanding is the right one but refuse to look at the study I did and show me where I went wrong.  How can I consider myself wrong when no one will show me where the error is?  In fact, in place of studying the passage, you make false assumptions and assertions of what I am saying and never once consider that what I am understanding from my study of the text, is a much much harder thing to obey.
Quote


The pagan world may ignore the teaching of Paul by rejecting the clear straightforward commands of our Lord,like 1 Tim 2:9-15 yet in the end, those Christian Women who follow the traditional teachings will reap the rewards in a future setting of the Kingdom of God.

Blade[/shadow]
So now you want to claim that following traditions of man are more important than following the Commands of God?  How strange...I honestly believe we should challenge every tradition of man against what scripture really does say if we want to please God not man!!!!!!!!!!!!

Then read and follow the verses in 1 Tim 2:9-12 literally! While your at it, read verses 13 thru 15 and take it up with the LORD on why He placed the sphere of influence and power of the woman in the HOME and not the Church.

Rem this Lori, 'the SIN, Eve and Adam committed in Eden are the same yet only one allowed herself to be deceived.'

You and other women carry the shame of 'disobeying GOD' by  being deluded by the serpent (Satan).

I and other men carry the shame of 'Disobeying GOD' and 'Man's Downfall' for the Love of a woman!


Blade

Nothing there addresses what I asked you to address.  Why so stubbornly refuse?


I can only give you through the Authority of GOD as stated in:
 1 Tim 2, 3 and Titan are GOD's WORD.

Like so many others before you, including those advocating change in the Southern Baptist Convention are doing so for personal worldviews and lifestyles.

It is a disobedience and as for changing, deleting, removing (REV 22:18-19) His WORD, it is a SIN.

Your Choice!

Blade

1 Cor 15:3-4.."For I delivered unto you first of all that which I also received, how that Christ died for our sins according to the scriptures; And that he was buried, and that he rose again the third day according to the scriptures:"

Acts 17:11.."These were more noble than those in Thessalonica, in that they received the word with all readiness of mind, and searched the scriptures daily, whether those things were so."

Lori Bolinger

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Re: The dangers of woman keeping silent...
« Reply #113 on: May 20, 2019, 11:52:28 am »
Blade...you have repeatedly been asked to look at and discuss the study of the passage with me and you refuse...in my book that removes any authority you might have had a one point when it comes to knowing what is being taught, IOW's what God is trying to communicate with us.  We are commanded to study to show ourselves approved...your refusing to study it says it all as far as I can tell...because you start out in disobedience.
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Bladerunner

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Re: The dangers of woman keeping silent...
« Reply #114 on: May 20, 2019, 08:09:20 pm »
Blade...you have repeatedly been asked to look at and discuss the study of the passage with me and you refuse...in my book that removes any authority you might have had a one point when it comes to knowing what is being taught, IOW's what God is trying to communicate with us.  We are commanded to study to show ourselves approved...your refusing to study it says it all as far as I can tell...because you start out in disobedience.

Lori, You are right. I have no authority here or in any of the post I reply to or create. The authority is that of GOD.

You still want to study the verse and get opinions on what 1 Tim 2:12 actually says. It is pretty clear with out the need for further interpretation.

We can discuss the; who or what is Jesus speaking to in 1 TIM 1-6. We can have a bible study on the qualifications of Elders (Pastors, Bishops, Deacons, etc.).  No study is needed of 1 Tim 2:9-15

I have no doubt that shady teachers with shady agendas will continue to interpret those verses of 1 Tim 2:9-15 using hermeneutics other than that of literal interpretation. I had hoped you of all people would see that the Bible (KJV) is not a living book to be interpreted/changed through the eyes of any ole worldview.

A bible study for you:

In ancient times, the rules of the church/ synagogue were different and had not changed for thousands of years. Women were not welcome in these places of worship.

Then when 'The Age of the Church' began, all the present day rules for both the male and female were changed and they were changed for the better. In 1 Tim 1-6, Jesus is speaking to Tim about his role as a pastor and tells him and us the rules He expects for the Pastors (Elders, Bishops, etc) of all churches to follow. He tells us who is to lead public prayer (the male). He also in Chapter 3 gives us the qualifications of the leaders of the Church.

Then He does something wonderful. He gives us the role of the woman in the church. Up until this time,the woman was second class. Now, She is equal to the Male, both with different individual roles to be played throughout our lifetimes.

Yet, in the post modern world, many women are not satisfied with the role God has laid out for them. They had rather show to the world they can assume the male role and become a force to be reckoned with (using some expressions of active feminist).

Up until recently, feminism stayed in the Business world. Today, even in the last bastion considered to follow the Word of GOD, the Southern Baptist Convention is deliberating new roles of the female within the Church doctrine. 

NOTE: for those who do not know, the SBC is the head of several Baptist Churches that adhere, subscribe and follow the Biblical doctrine as set forth by the leaders of the SBC.

To me, as a Literalist with a Historical and Grammatical Hermeneutics, GOD's WORDs in 1 Tim 2: 9-15 were self-explanatory and have not change in some 2000 years.

Lori, it is also clear you are trying to justify following a path that is not within the parameters set forth in 1 Tim 1-5 by our Lord Jesus Christ.

I urge you to come back to the fold and follow and be obedient to His Commandments in 1 Tim 2:9-15.

Again, I offer no authority on these verses. 1 Tim 1-5 are HIS WORD(s). They are on HIS Authority.

Blade






 







1 Cor 15:3-4.."For I delivered unto you first of all that which I also received, how that Christ died for our sins according to the scriptures; And that he was buried, and that he rose again the third day according to the scriptures:"

Acts 17:11.."These were more noble than those in Thessalonica, in that they received the word with all readiness of mind, and searched the scriptures daily, whether those things were so."
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Lori Bolinger

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Re: The dangers of woman keeping silent...
« Reply #115 on: May 21, 2019, 08:11:10 am »
Blade...you have repeatedly been asked to look at and discuss the study of the passage with me and you refuse...in my book that removes any authority you might have had a one point when it comes to knowing what is being taught, IOW's what God is trying to communicate with us.  We are commanded to study to show ourselves approved...your refusing to study it says it all as far as I can tell...because you start out in disobedience.

Lori, You are right. I have no authority here or in any of the post I reply to or create. The authority is that of GOD.
and God says to study His word not listen to teachers who have agendas...which is why I asked for you to show me where I went wrong in my study...but you refused.
Quote


You still want to study the verse and get opinions on what 1 Tim 2:12 actually says. It is pretty clear with out the need for further interpretation.
the only opinion I want is the one that God gives through a careful study of the passage, allowing scripture to interpret scripture for us....but you claimed that would draw me away from God and His word without ever explaining how...
Quote


We can discuss the; who or what is Jesus speaking to in 1 TIM 1-6. We can have a bible study on the qualifications of Elders (Pastors, Bishops, Deacons, etc.).  No study is needed of 1 Tim 2:9-15

I have no doubt that shady teachers with shady agendas will continue to interpret those verses of 1 Tim 2:9-15 using hermeneutics other than that of literal interpretation. I had hoped you of all people would see that the Bible (KJV) is not a living book to be interpreted/changed through the eyes of any ole worldview.
so insults are better than studying the word of God....notice I want to study the scripture in light of the totality of scripture which has absolutely nothing to do with teachers with shady anything unless you are calling God shady which I don't believe you are intending to do and all you do is criticize why?  When did wanting to study scripture not man's ideas of what scripture says become in your mind a shady thing?
Quote


A bible study for you:

In ancient times, the rules of the church/ synagogue were different and had not changed for thousands of years. Women were not welcome in these places of worship.

Then when 'The Age of the Church' began, all the present day rules for both the male and female were changed and they were changed for the better. In 1 Tim 1-6, Jesus is speaking to Tim about his role as a pastor and tells him and us the rules He expects for the Pastors (Elders, Bishops, etc) of all churches to follow. He tells us who is to lead public prayer (the male). He also in Chapter 3 gives us the qualifications of the leaders of the Church.

Then He does something wonderful. He gives us the role of the woman in the church. Up until this time,the woman was second class. Now, She is equal to the Male, both with different individual roles to be played throughout our lifetimes.

Yet, in the post modern world, many women are not satisfied with the role God has laid out for them. They had rather show to the world they can assume the male role and become a force to be reckoned with (using some expressions of active feminist).

Up until recently, feminism stayed in the Business world. Today, even in the last bastion considered to follow the Word of GOD, the Southern Baptist Convention is deliberating new roles of the female within the Church doctrine. 

NOTE: for those who do not know, the SBC is the head of several Baptist Churches that adhere, subscribe and follow the Biblical doctrine as set forth by the leaders of the SBC.

To me, as a Literalist with a Historical and Grammatical Hermeneutics, GOD's WORDs in 1 Tim 2: 9-15 were self-explanatory and have not change in some 2000 years.
First this is all history not Biblical study...second...as per the study I did, and I don't know how you are still missing this about me, but here it is again...I have no problem with woman not being in leadership in the church but as I study the passage in light of the totality of scripture I do NOT see this passage as teaching that...as I see it in light of the totality of scripture this particular passage is teaching something else...we can (as the last videos posted show) get to that conclusion another way...but not through this passage...but then again, one would have to be brave enough to study it for themselves rather than relying on shady teachers to understand that NOTHING at all in what I am saying is advocating woman in leadership in the church only that I Tim. is NOT talking about that....
Quote


Lori, it is also clear you are trying to justify following a path that is not within the parameters set forth in 1 Tim 1-5 by our Lord Jesus Christ.

I urge you to come back to the fold and follow and be obedient to His Commandments in 1 Tim 2:9-15.

Again, I offer no authority on these verses. 1 Tim 1-5 are HIS WORD(s). They are on HIS Authority.

Blade[/shadow]
Blade...this is insulting to say the least...especially since all I am asking is that you go over the study I did and show me where I got it wrong...at worst it's judgmental and false accusations and you should be ashamed.
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Bladerunner

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Re: The dangers of woman keeping silent...
« Reply #116 on: May 21, 2019, 07:23:29 pm »
Blade...you have repeatedly been asked to look at and discuss the study of the passage with me and you refuse...in my book that removes any authority you might have had a one point when it comes to knowing what is being taught, IOW's what God is trying to communicate with us.  We are commanded to study to show ourselves approved...your refusing to study it says it all as far as I can tell...because you start out in disobedience.

Lori, You are right. I have no authority here or in any of the post I reply to or create. The authority is that of GOD.
and God says to study His word not listen to teachers who have agendas...which is why I asked for you to show me where I went wrong in my study...but you refused.
Quote


You still want to study the verse and get opinions on what 1 Tim 2:12 actually says. It is pretty clear with out the need for further interpretation.
the only opinion I want is the one that God gives through a careful study of the passage, allowing scripture to interpret scripture for us....but you claimed that would draw me away from God and His word without ever explaining how...
Quote


We can discuss the; who or what is Jesus speaking to in 1 TIM 1-6. We can have a bible study on the qualifications of Elders (Pastors, Bishops, Deacons, etc.).  No study is needed of 1 Tim 2:9-15

I have no doubt that shady teachers with shady agendas will continue to interpret those verses of 1 Tim 2:9-15 using hermeneutics other than that of literal interpretation. I had hoped you of all people would see that the Bible (KJV) is not a living book to be interpreted/changed through the eyes of any ole worldview.
so insults are better than studying the word of God....notice I want to study the scripture in light of the totality of scripture which has absolutely nothing to do with teachers with shady anything unless you are calling God shady which I don't believe you are intending to do and all you do is criticize why?  When did wanting to study scripture not man's ideas of what scripture says become in your mind a shady thing?
Quote


A bible study for you:

In ancient times, the rules of the church/ synagogue were different and had not changed for thousands of years. Women were not welcome in these places of worship.

Then when 'The Age of the Church' began, all the present day rules for both the male and female were changed and they were changed for the better. In 1 Tim 1-6, Jesus is speaking to Tim about his role as a pastor and tells him and us the rules He expects for the Pastors (Elders, Bishops, etc) of all churches to follow. He tells us who is to lead public prayer (the male). He also in Chapter 3 gives us the qualifications of the leaders of the Church.

Then He does something wonderful. He gives us the role of the woman in the church. Up until this time,the woman was second class. Now, She is equal to the Male, both with different individual roles to be played throughout our lifetimes.

Yet, in the post modern world, many women are not satisfied with the role God has laid out for them. They had rather show to the world they can assume the male role and become a force to be reckoned with (using some expressions of active feminist).

Up until recently, feminism stayed in the Business world. Today, even in the last bastion considered to follow the Word of GOD, the Southern Baptist Convention is deliberating new roles of the female within the Church doctrine. 

NOTE: for those who do not know, the SBC is the head of several Baptist Churches that adhere, subscribe and follow the Biblical doctrine as set forth by the leaders of the SBC.

To me, as a Literalist with a Historical and Grammatical Hermeneutics, GOD's WORDs in 1 Tim 2: 9-15 were self-explanatory and have not change in some 2000 years.
First this is all history not Biblical study...second...as per the study I did, and I don't know how you are still missing this about me, but here it is again...I have no problem with woman not being in leadership in the church but as I study the passage in light of the totality of scripture I do NOT see this passage as teaching that...as I see it in light of the totality of scripture this particular passage is teaching something else...we can (as the last videos posted show) get to that conclusion another way...but not through this passage...but then again, one would have to be brave enough to study it for themselves rather than relying on shady teachers to understand that NOTHING at all in what I am saying is advocating woman in leadership in the church only that I Tim. is NOT talking about that....
Quote


Lori, it is also clear you are trying to justify following a path that is not within the parameters set forth in 1 Tim 1-5 by our Lord Jesus Christ.

I urge you to come back to the fold and follow and be obedient to His Commandments in 1 Tim 2:9-15.

Again, I offer no authority on these verses. 1 Tim 1-5 are HIS WORD(s). They are on HIS Authority.

Blade[/shadow]
Blade...this is insulting to say the least...especially since all I am asking is that you go over the study I did and show me where I got it wrong...at worst it's judgmental and false accusations and you should be ashamed.

I guess I have learned a lesson here!!!! I did not aim to insult you. Let me put it this way, one more time.

Yes, some scriptures are interpreted by other scriptures. (i.e. Rev. 1:20) Like these scriptures, the Bible lets you know when it does interpret other scriptures.

However, 1 Tim 2:9-15 has no such verses that interpret them. These verses are literally interpreted as spoken by GOD.

There is no other way!

Hope you have a great day!

Blade



1 Cor 15:3-4.."For I delivered unto you first of all that which I also received, how that Christ died for our sins according to the scriptures; And that he was buried, and that he rose again the third day according to the scriptures:"

Acts 17:11.."These were more noble than those in Thessalonica, in that they received the word with all readiness of mind, and searched the scriptures daily, whether those things were so."
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