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Author Topic: Internal Coherence of Christs Divinity  (Read 2846 times)

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Arius

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Re: Internal Coherence of Christs Divinity
« Reply #26 on: April 03, 2019, 01:39:36 am »
I just re-read my last post to GA, and I guess, I was really hard on him, when my aim was not really him, but that Trinity point that to me is really important, yet no one seems to care one way or another?

I am really sorry @Grace_Accepted, I should not have used you as a target, but instead keep providing proof of my point.

Please forgive me, really. It's just so frustrating because I was exactly where you all are in this trinity. But I guess until you watch enough historical videos from all kinds of different people and can start getting a better and better picture until you are absolutely convinced the information matches the history I witnessed myself, and the news out there, going to a good church with family and friends, why should it matter.

All Christians are going to Heaven, except me, an Arian heretic.

Love you guys, and again Grace_accepted I didn't realize I went off the handle like that till PJ mentioned it.

I got to stop debating this subject, if God allowed it to flourish for the past 1,700 years, then who the hell am I to think I can make a difference?
Galatians 2:20 (NKJV)
I have been crucified with Christ; it is no longer I who live, but Christ lives in me; and the life which I now live in the flesh I live by faith in the Son of God, who loved me and gave Himself for me.

There is but One Infinite and Eternal God, and since Infinite is borderless, you can't have any other gods besides Him.

God did not die, His son Word did, for you and for me, because - John 3:16

God is not a being, but the Ground of being - Tillich

patrick jane

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Re: Internal Coherence of Christs Divinity
« Reply #27 on: April 03, 2019, 05:34:08 am »
I just re-read my last post to GA, and I guess, I was really hard on him, when my aim was not really him, but that Trinity point that to me is really important, yet no one seems to care one way or another?

I am really sorry @Grace_Accepted, I should not have used you as a target, but instead keep providing proof of my point.

Please forgive me, really. It's just so frustrating because I was exactly where you all are in this trinity. But I guess until you watch enough historical videos from all kinds of different people and can start getting a better and better picture until you are absolutely convinced the information matches the history I witnessed myself, and the news out there, going to a good church with family and friends, why should it matter.

All Christians are going to Heaven, except me, an Arian heretic.

Love you guys, and again Grace_accepted I didn't realize I went off the handle like that till PJ mentioned it.

I got to stop debating this subject, if God allowed it to flourish for the past 1,700 years, then who the hell am I to think I can make a difference?
Thanks brother, and I was mostly kidding and GA can handle it. I like what you're doing and you make people think. Please don't stop debating the trinity because you're good at it and you make very good points with scripture. You're good bro, don't worry.
Hearing, believing and trusting the finished work of Jesus Christ on the cross; His death, burial and resurrection for the forgiveness of sins and REPENTING, seals us with that Holy Spirit of Promise - EPHESIANS 1:10-14 KJV - The Lord is not slack concerning His promise. 2 Peter 3:9 KJV - 1 Corinthians 15:1-4 KJV - Ephesians 1:10-14 KJV - Romans 10:9-10 KJV - Romans 10:13 - Romans 10:17 - Ephesians 1:7 KJV - Colossians 1:14 KJV -


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Grace_Accepted

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Re: Internal Coherence of Christs Divinity
« Reply #28 on: April 03, 2019, 07:33:23 am »

It has been rebutted point by point several times. Understanding Christ's divinity is an Amazing eye opening Journey into God's character and love but for those that cannot hear it, it is not salvational.  It is edifying but not salvational.

I know all about the Christian Christs divinity, but obvious enough that Christians who defend the divine Trinity-gods don't, .. and no one has ever rebutted the Bibles claims that; from the divine come divinations, which is an abomination to the Lord! No one even tried, .. because the holy-Christian-divines are never to be Debated.
Besides, this post was for my dear friend @patrick jane, who are you, a Jesuit watcher, one of the Knight Templars making sure he does not deviate in his thinking?

Since you would not listen to Biblical Reasoning please watch this video that touches on the divine, divinations, and the gods in the Christian Trinity. But of course, that can only happen if the Christian spirits from the divine will allow you to?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0fDFPQoqmYs


If you studied, .. no, if you "researched' history, you would have realized by now that the teaching about the divine is taught in Jesuit built Trinity Colleges, and Christian Schools of Divinity Yes, these were all orchestrated and built by the Jesuit Order aka Knights Templar whose head is the Black Pope aka Grand Master, wearing the white robe to cover the black.
Jesuit, the Knight Templar, the Illuminati, the Free Masons, Mormonism, .. these were all created by, and still are all under the "R.C. Christian" umbrella, yes, the same R.C. Christian who put up the Georgia Guide Stones, and yes, the 2.3 billion Christians are ready to take up Christs sword (Constantine's sword) and start the torture, beheading, and extermination of 6.5 billion people, lead by the same Knights Templar Grand Master, only this time as Pope aka God On Earth!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2vseEmfr88g

(just remove the word Christian when he is talking about the Believers, because he still doesn't know that the Jesuits he is referring to are the Real Christians!)

Quote from: Grace_accepted
You base your whole argument on several fallacies starting with the false dilemma that because Jesus was a man he couldn't be God.

Fallacies? Tell me then, who was the Angel of Fire talking to Moses, .. was he God?
If you say no, then I ask: "Why? Can't you imagine and believe that an Angel can be God? Especially if you believe a man can be God, then why not an Angel of the Lord?"

Quote
You seem to have a huge anti-catholic bias that also creates a guilt by association fallacy that states Catholics are bad, Catholics believe in the divinity of Christ, therefore the divinity if Christ must be a bad doctrine.

When have I ever said that; "Catholics are bad"? Show me one place?
Just because a man stole something would not make him bad. It is stealing that is bad. The same with divinations and going to Schools of Divinity to become witches and warlocks in the Christian Church so you can hypnotize the dumbed down sheep that Jesus was God, and you killed him. That is exactly the message, since in reality, it is our sins who put, and then killed our Lord Jesus on the cross. So by making Jesus God with your Jesuit School training, you kill God.

Quote
Yet in the end, if Jesus were not divine, he could not pay for your sins.  Lucky for us he does it anyway whether we understand the truth about Him or not as long as we rely on adhere to and trust in Him.

Oh no, .. you don't WANT to understand the truth about Jesus, instead, you are defending the Christian heresy that says God died.

Quote
It is crazy to believe that the one by whom all things exists isn't God.  If the one by whom all things exsist isn't God then who is?

Wow, .. where did you ever get this Trinity idea that; BY him (the son Word) all things exist? God created all things THROUGH him. Show me one place that says Jesus created anything?
John 1:3 All things were made through Him, and without Him nothing was made that was made.
John 1:10 He was in the world, and the world was made through Him, and the world did not know Him.


Quote from: Grace_Acepted
We tend to view Jesus as only the son of Mary begotten of the Holy spirit but that was just the Word's incarnate phase.  Before that he was the great I am, the cloud that lead Israel through the wilderness. the one that parted the sea so that they might cross on dry land.  After He was finished doing what He had to do on the cross He has resumed His glory and complete divine Godhood.  In doing so the Father gave Him back all of the power he had laid aside to come as a babe in Bethlehem.  so that at the name of Jesus every knee should bow, in heaven and on earth and under the earth! Amen

Go divine your Jesuit lies to someone else, .. actually I take that back. In Jesus name I ask that you stop divining your lies to those who seek Jesus!
I know all about the Jesuit oath, and what Judgment our Lord Jesus Christ will bring with him upon those who lead even one of the little ones, those reading the Bible and seeking God astray!
You are attacking a strawman created with a false dilemma.  You hate the Catholics so much that it has blinded you.  Your arguments are against tritheism as per your opening statement.

The fact is, I am so thrilled to accept the Grace given to me by God because God incarnate's infinite being and underived life was enough to bear my eternal damnation and not only mine but that of the whole world.  Having died my death he divided his perfect life and appropriated it for me and not for me only but for whomsoever believes on him shal have his eternal life in them.

Arius

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Re: Internal Coherence of Christs Divinity
« Reply #29 on: April 03, 2019, 05:04:35 pm »
Quote from: Grace_Accepted
You are attacking a strawman created with a false dilemma.  You hate the Catholics so much that it has blinded you.  Your arguments are against tritheism as per your opening statement.

I don't hate Catholics, I don't hate NASA employees, I don't hate Trinitarians, and especially brother I don't hate you.
But words are just words, coming from an avatar named Arius. So to prove to you that I Do Not Hate any human on this earth, I extend this welcome for everyone and anyone reading this post:


This is an invitation for all to my house (wife and two children) for dinner
Call ahead before coming.
Menu - several Hungarian dishes;
Hungarian beef Goulash w/ home made noodles,
breaded pork chops (old country style) fresh salad w/ choice of dressing, fresh bread and drinks
My Filipino wife's famous home made egg rolls (chicken, beef and pork), also beef/chicken Adobo with oyster sauce, .. her also famous Pancit (Asian rice noodles with vegetables and small sliced chicken breast)

Or
Call if you would like something you heard about, but never tried before and would like to try it?
My aim, like my wife's is to please.

Quote from: Grace_accepted
The fact is, I am so thrilled to accept the Grace given to me by God because God incarnate's infinite being and underived life was enough to bear my eternal damnation and not only mine but that of the whole world.  Having died my death he divided his perfect life and appropriated it for me and not for me only but for whomsoever believes on him shal have his eternal life in them.

It is obvious my friend that you do not understand the definition of "Infinite" (even though I make it a point to explain it over and over again in almost every post), and that Infinite and being do not mix. And neither can Infinite be "fully human". The Bible is clear how God revealed Himself throughout the Bible. And if God really had a spiritual/heavenly body like the Angels, or like His son Word, He would not have chosen to speak to Moses using the body of a Fiery Angel of his.

But now I understand, after 1,700 years of the most powerful organizations in the world: Jesuits/ Illuminati/ Mason, .. Emperors, .. pagan Satanic churches and other world rulers since our Lords assertion to heaven, no one on their own could just change what they throughout their whole life, including many, many previous generations were made to believe, and have sincerely mourned the death of God.

That is also 1,700 years of having been convinced that the word "Christian" was synonymous with "Bible".

Look how difficult it is to take the paper globe earth from peoples heads, and that has been only 500 years, while the "Christian/Bible" brainwashing has been around 1,200 years longer! Not only that, but just as the word Christian was made synonymous with the word "Bible", the paper "Globe Earth" was made synonymous with the word "science".

So if someone is against the paper globe, he is against science.
If against the Christian Trinity-god, he is against the Bible and Jesus Christ, and is a heretic who would benefit in being tortured to have him confess his heresy, than die in his anti-trinity blasphemy!

So do you want "evidence" to prove I do not hate people, but just as Jesus hated their perverted, unfair, unjust man-made dangerous ideologies that not only has caused pain and suffering over the past 1,700 years, but millions upon millions of innocent lives too?

It's just a call away.


Arius/Odon
« Last Edit: April 06, 2019, 03:13:03 am by patrick jane »
Galatians 2:20 (NKJV)
I have been crucified with Christ; it is no longer I who live, but Christ lives in me; and the life which I now live in the flesh I live by faith in the Son of God, who loved me and gave Himself for me.

There is but One Infinite and Eternal God, and since Infinite is borderless, you can't have any other gods besides Him.

God did not die, His son Word did, for you and for me, because - John 3:16

God is not a being, but the Ground of being - Tillich
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patrick jane

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Re: Internal Coherence of Christs Divinity
« Reply #30 on: April 04, 2019, 06:58:35 am »
Quote from: Grace_Accepted
You are attacking a strawman created with a false dilemma.  You hate the Catholics so much that it has blinded you.  Your arguments are against tritheism as per your opening statement.

I don't hate Catholics, I don't hate NASA employees, I don't hate Trinitarians, and especially brother I don't hate you.
But words are just words, coming from an avatar named Arius. So to prove to you that I Do Not Hate any human on this earth, I extend this welcome for everyone and anyone reading this post:

My real name is Odon Sabo
44768 W. Desert Garden Rd.
Maricopa, AZ 85139
my phone is: (480) 603-7407
This is an invitation for all to my house (wife and two children) for dinner
Call ahead before coming.
Menu - several Hungarian dishes;
Hungarian beef Goulash w/ home made noodles,
breaded pork chops (old country style) fresh salad w/ choice of dressing, fresh bread and drinks
My Filipino wife's famous home made egg rolls (chicken, beef and pork), also beef/chicken Adobo with oyster sauce, .. her also famous Pancit (Asian rice noodles with vegetables and small sliced chicken breast)

Or
Call if you would like something you heard about, but never tried before and would like to try it?
My aim, like my wife's is to please.

Quote from: Grace_accepted
The fact is, I am so thrilled to accept the Grace given to me by God because God incarnate's infinite being and underived life was enough to bear my eternal damnation and not only mine but that of the whole world.  Having died my death he divided his perfect life and appropriated it for me and not for me only but for whomsoever believes on him shal have his eternal life in them.

It is obvious my friend that you do not understand the definition of "Infinite" (even though I make it a point to explain it over and over again in almost every post), and that Infinite and being do not mix. And neither can Infinite be "fully human". The Bible is clear how God revealed Himself throughout the Bible. And if God really had a spiritual/heavenly body like the Angels, or like His son Word, He would not have chosen to speak to Moses using the body of a Fiery Angel of his.

But now I understand, after 1,700 years of the most powerful organizations in the world: Jesuits/ Illuminati/ Mason, .. Emperors, .. pagan Satanic churches and other world rulers since our Lords assertion to heaven, no one on their own could just change what they throughout their whole life, including many, many previous generations were made to believe, and have sincerely mourned the death of God.

That is also 1,700 years of having been convinced that the word "Christian" was synonymous with "Bible".

Look how difficult it is to take the paper globe earth from peoples heads, and that has been only 500 years, while the "Christian/Bible" brainwashing has been around 1,200 years longer! Not only that, but just as the word Christian was made synonymous with the word "Bible", the paper "Globe Earth" was made synonymous with the word "science".

So if someone is against the paper globe, he is against science.
If against the Christian Trinity-god, he is against the Bible and Jesus Christ, and is a heretic who would benefit in being tortured to have him confess his heresy, than die in his anti-trinity blasphemy!

So do you want "evidence" to prove I do not hate people, but just as Jesus hated their perverted, unfair, unjust man-made dangerous ideologies that not only has caused pain and suffering over the past 1,700 years, but millions upon millions of innocent lives too?

It's just a call away.


Arius/Odon
Oh yes, I recognize the name Odon Sabo from other forums. Good to know I have friends in AZ !!!
Hearing, believing and trusting the finished work of Jesus Christ on the cross; His death, burial and resurrection for the forgiveness of sins and REPENTING, seals us with that Holy Spirit of Promise - EPHESIANS 1:10-14 KJV - The Lord is not slack concerning His promise. 2 Peter 3:9 KJV - 1 Corinthians 15:1-4 KJV - Ephesians 1:10-14 KJV - Romans 10:9-10 KJV - Romans 10:13 - Romans 10:17 - Ephesians 1:7 KJV - Colossians 1:14 KJV -


Copyright Disclaimer: All audio and music belongs to the owner/creator. This is a non-profit. Under Section 107 of the Copyright Act 1976, allowance is made for "fair use" for purposes such as criticism, comment, news reporting, teaching, scholarship, and research. Fair use is a use permitted by copyright statute that might otherwise be infringing.
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Grace_Accepted

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Re: Internal Coherence of Christs Divinity
« Reply #31 on: April 04, 2019, 11:30:57 am »

Quote
It is obvious my friend that you do not understand the definition of "Infinite" (even though I make it a point to explain it over and over again in almost every post), and that Infinite and being do not mix. And neither can Infinite be "fully human".
Love, My friend is not condescending. These are words of condescension stated as a fact when they are merely your misinterpretation of the language.  Christ is an infinite being whether you understand the word or not.  He is immeasurable and eternally existing in all dimensions of time.

And Why would you deny God is omnipotent?

Quote
The Bible is clear how God revealed Himself throughout the Bible. And if God really had a spiritual/heavenly body like the Angels, or like His son Word, He would not have chosen to speak to Moses using the body of a Fiery Angel of his.
The body of a fiery Angle? Why do you add parenthetical information to the text as if it were fact.  You must establish it as fact first.
Quote
But now I understand, after 1,700 years of the most powerful organizations in the world: Jesuits/ Illuminati/ Mason, .. Emperors, .. pagan Satanic churches and other world rulers since our Lords assertion to heaven, no one on their own could just change what they throughout their whole life, including many, many previous generations were made to believe, and have sincerely mourned the death of God.
You claim to love but have a tremendously condescending approach to your fiction.  I can understand holding opinions but we should all keep that in perspective and not cross the line to assuming that it is fact because we believe it. This begins to slip into holier than thou art territory.

There is one power in the universe that wishes to deny the Christ is divine.  Now if we spend some time studying and pondering on this fact we can come up with some pretty revealing things.  If christ is not divine then...
  • The ransom for sin is inadequate (ps 49:6-8)
  • Jesus could not have survived the Cross or God abrogated his own law
  • The cross is reduced to a mere blood sacrifice or is just symbolic

There will be many who do not realize this truth but put their faith in Jesus who will be saved but they miss out on the truths wondrous love of God they could have now.

Quote
That is also 1,700 years of having been convinced that the word "Christian" was synonymous with "Bible".
Are you a seer?

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Arius

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Re: Internal Coherence of Christs Divinity
« Reply #32 on: April 04, 2019, 10:55:27 pm »

Quote
It is obvious my friend that you do not understand the definition of "Infinite" (even though I make it a point to explain it over and over again in almost every post), and that Infinite and being do not mix. And neither can Infinite be "fully human".

Love, My friend is not condescending. These are words of condescension stated as a fact when they are merely your misinterpretation of the language.  Christ is an infinite being whether you understand the word or not.  He is immeasurable and eternally existing in all dimensions of time.

Labeling someone "condescending" does not prove my interpretation of Infinite and Eternal is incorrect? Proving me wrong is, and I welcome any admonition, correction as long as it is backed up by evidence, not a man made belief created by a man-made doctrine. Also, just because a Disciple of Jesus is condemned to death for not accepting the Trinity doesn't mean he has no true love of his enemies.

John 8:48  (NKJV)
48 Then the Jews answered and said to Him, “Do we not say rightly that You are a Samaritan and have a demon?”


You see, Christians accept the Jews accusing Jesus of blasphemy because he said he was the son of God, then as a Christian you must accept the accusation that Jesus had a demon too. It says it right there, if you accept one Jewish accusation, then why not the other?

But if we read why the Jews hated him, then we can understand why they tried to find any accusation they could invent to charge him with blasphemy. So accusing me of being condescending is not that painful. Here is why both the Jews, and the Christians hate Jesus and want to keep Jesus hanging on the cross, and the belief that they killed God, so Rome could now elevate the one who claimed; "I shall be like the Most High!"

John 8:42 Jesus said to them, “If God were your Father, you would love me, for I proceeded forth and came from God; nor have I come of myself, but He sent me. 43 Why do you not understand my speech? Because you are not able to listen to my word.
44 You are of your father the devil, and the desires of your father you want to do. He was a murderer from the beginning, and does not stand in the truth, because there is no truth in him. When he speaks a lie, he speaks from his own resources, for he is a liar and the father of it.
45 But because I tell the truth, you do not believe me. 46 Which of you convicts me of sin? And if I tell the truth, why do you not believe me? 47 He who is of God hears God’s words; therefore you do not hear, because you are not of God.”


Quote from: G.A.
And Why would you deny God is omnipotent?

Again, the Christian Jesus sun-god is NOT omnipotent. He only wish he was.

Quote from: Arius
The Bible is clear how God revealed Himself throughout the Scriptures. And if God really had a spiritual/heavenly body like the Angels, or like His son Word, He would not have chosen to speak to Moses using the body of a Fiery Angel of his.
Quote from: GA
The body of a fiery Angel? Why do you add parenthetical information to the text as if it were fact.  You must establish it as fact first.

Acts 7:30
“And when forty years had passed, an Angel of the Lord appeared to him in a flame of fire in a bush, in the wilderness of Mount Sinai.

Hebrews 1:7
And of the angels He says: “Who makes His angels spirits And His ministers a flame of fire.”

Exodus 3:2 And the Angel of the Lord appeared to him in a flame of fire from the midst of a bush. So he looked, and behold, the bush was burning with fire, but the bush was not consumed. 3 Then Moses said, “I will now turn aside and see this great sight, why the bush does not burn.”
4 So when the Lord saw that he turned aside to look, God called to him from the midst of the bush and said, “Moses, Moses!”


But of course, Christianity must deny any mention of the Angel of Fire that appeared to Moses because it would throw another wrench into this Trinity-god doctrine. It would destroy the trinity, making it four-ity, and since queen of heaven Mary, the "mother-of-all-gods" is part of this unholy alliance, this would make it a five-ity.

Quote from: Arius
But now I understand, after 1,700 years of the most powerful organizations in the world: Jesuits/ Illuminati/ Mason, .. Emperors, .. pagan Satanic churches and other world rulers since our Lords assertion to heaven, no one on their own could just change what they throughout their whole life, including many, many previous generations were made to believe, and have sincerely mourned the death of God.
Quote from: GA
You claim to love but have a tremendously condescending approach to your fiction.  I can understand holding opinions but we should all keep that in perspective and not cross the line to assuming that it is fact because we believe it. This begins to slip into holier than thou art territory.

Did I say these were my opinions? That's why I presented them as "facts". Even if I was tortured and tied to a burning stake I hope and pray I would stand on these Biblical truths, the first of which is that: "God Is One"

Fiction, or:
Fact: God/Infinite/Eternal cannot die. This Gentile made doctrine that killed Gods son, claim they killed God also.
In the Trinity, .. God died. is this fact or not?

Fact: for about 1,500 years, the Christian Church tortured, boiled in oil, burnt at the stake anyone who opposed their Triune-gods.

Fact The very Foundation of the (let's kill both Jesus and God) mock-Christian Religion is the Trinity Doctrine!

Fact: This doctrine is non-Biblical. It was invented by gentiles, who worshipped many gods, both before and after its creation.

Quote from: G.A.
There is one power in the universe that wishes to deny the Christ is divine.  Now if we spend some time studying and pondering on this fact we can come up with some pretty revealing things.  If christ is not divine then...
  • The ransom for sin is inadequate (ps 49:6-8)

I wish you could remove your Trinity glasses long enough to read verse 6?

Psalm 49:6-8  (NKJV)
6 Those who trust in their wealth
And boast in the multitude of their riches,


7 None of them can by any means redeem his brother,
Nor give to God a ransom for him—
8 For the redemption of their souls is costly,
And it shall cease forever—


Quote from: GA
  • Jesus could not have survived the Cross or God abrogated his own law
  • The cross is reduced to a mere blood sacrifice or is just symbolic

The man Jesus died, NOT God, or some Christian god/man! Look:

Romans 5:12 Therefore, just as through one man sin entered the world, and death through sin, and thus death spread to all men, because all sinned—
..18 Therefore, as through one man’s offense judgment came to all men, resulting in condemnation, even so through one Man’s righteous act the free gift came to all men, resulting in justification of life. 19 For as by one man’s disobedience many were made sinners, so also by one Man’s obedience many will be made righteous.


It does NOT say: even so through one Gods righteous act the free gift came to all men, resulting in justification of life

Quote from: GA
There will be many who do not realize this truth but put their faith in Jesus who will be saved but they miss out on the truths wondrous love of God they could have now.

I endured persecution for 62 years for defending the Way and the Truth till this very day They are trying to kill me. My Gods wonderous love is not now, and definitely Not Here!

Mark 13:5 And Jesus, answering them, began to say: “Take heed that no one deceives you. 6 For many will come in My name, saying, ‘I am He,’ and will deceive many.
.. 9 “But watch out for yourselves, for they will deliver you up to councils, and you will be beaten in the synagogues. You will be brought before rulers and kings for My sake, for a testimony to them.
.. 12 Now brother will betray brother to death, and a father his child; and children will rise up against parents and cause them to be put to death. 13 And you will be hated by all for My name’s sake.
But he who endures to the end shall be saved.


Yes, the 2.5 billion Christians are enjoying the wonderous love of their sun-god Jesus Now, .. until that Terrible Day of the Lord when they hear the son of God say:
‘I tell you I do not know you where you are from? Depart from me all you workers of iniquity.’

Luke 13:23 And He said to them, 24 “Strive to enter through the narrow gate, for many (2.5 billion), I say to you, will seek to enter and will not be able. 25 When once the Master of the house has risen up and shut the door, and you begin to stand outside and knock at the door, saying, ‘Lord, Lord, (sun-god Jesus) open for us,’ and He will answer and say to you, ‘I do not know you, where you are from,’
26 then you will begin to say, ‘We ate and drank in Your presence, and You taught in our streets.’
27 But He will say, ‘I tell you I do not know you, where you are from.

(because I never said I was God, or that my Father was made up of three persons. You have killed God in the hearts and minds of Billions of people, so now I tell you)
Depart from Me, all you workers of iniquity.’  28 There will be weeping and gnashing of teeth, when you see Abraham and Isaac and Jacob and all the prophets in the kingdom of God, and yourselves thrust out.

Quote from: Arius
That is also 1,700 years of having been convinced that the word "Christian" was synonymous with "Bible".

Quote from: G.A.
Are you a seer?

No, it's in the documented history of Christianity.


Arius
Galatians 2:20 (NKJV)
I have been crucified with Christ; it is no longer I who live, but Christ lives in me; and the life which I now live in the flesh I live by faith in the Son of God, who loved me and gave Himself for me.

There is but One Infinite and Eternal God, and since Infinite is borderless, you can't have any other gods besides Him.

God did not die, His son Word did, for you and for me, because - John 3:16

God is not a being, but the Ground of being - Tillich

Arius

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Re: Internal Coherence of Christs Divinity
« Reply #33 on: April 05, 2019, 02:00:26 am »
Quote from: Grace_Accepted
You are attacking a strawman created with a false dilemma.  You hate the Catholics so much that it has blinded you.  Your arguments are against tritheism as per your opening statement.

I don't hate Catholics, I don't hate NASA employees, I don't hate Trinitarians, and especially brother I don't hate you.
But words are just words, coming from an avatar named Arius. So to prove to you that I Do Not Hate any human on this earth, I extend this welcome for everyone and anyone reading this post:

My real name is Odon Sabo
44768 W. Desert Garden Rd.
Maricopa, AZ 85139
my phone is: (480) 603-7407
This is an invitation for all to my house (wife and two children) for dinner
Call ahead before coming.
Menu - several Hungarian dishes;
Hungarian beef Goulash w/ home made noodles,
breaded pork chops (old country style) fresh salad w/ choice of dressing, fresh bread and drinks
My Filipino wife's famous home made egg rolls (chicken, beef and pork), also beef/chicken Adobo with oyster sauce, .. her also famous Pancit (Asian rice noodles with vegetables and small sliced chicken breast)

Or
Call if you would like something you heard about, but never tried before and would like to try it?
My aim, like my wife's is to please.

Quote from: Grace_accepted
The fact is, I am so thrilled to accept the Grace given to me by God because God incarnate's infinite being and underived life was enough to bear my eternal damnation and not only mine but that of the whole world.  Having died my death he divided his perfect life and appropriated it for me and not for me only but for whomsoever believes on him shal have his eternal life in them.

It is obvious my friend that you do not understand the definition of "Infinite" (even though I make it a point to explain it over and over again in almost every post), and that Infinite and being do not mix. And neither can Infinite be "fully human". The Bible is clear how God revealed Himself throughout the Bible. And if God really had a spiritual/heavenly body like the Angels, or like His son Word, He would not have chosen to speak to Moses using the body of a Fiery Angel of his.

But now I understand, after 1,700 years of the most powerful organizations in the world: Jesuits/ Illuminati/ Mason, .. Emperors, .. pagan Satanic churches and other world rulers since our Lords assertion to heaven, no one on their own could just change what they throughout their whole life, including many, many previous generations were made to believe, and have sincerely mourned the death of God.

That is also 1,700 years of having been convinced that the word "Christian" was synonymous with "Bible".

Look how difficult it is to take the paper globe earth from peoples heads, and that has been only 500 years, while the "Christian/Bible" brainwashing has been around 1,200 years longer! Not only that, but just as the word Christian was made synonymous with the word "Bible", the paper "Globe Earth" was made synonymous with the word "science".

So if someone is against the paper globe, he is against science.
If against the Christian Trinity-god, he is against the Bible and Jesus Christ, and is a heretic who would benefit in being tortured to have him confess his heresy, than die in his anti-trinity blasphemy!

So do you want "evidence" to prove I do not hate people, but just as Jesus hated their perverted, unfair, unjust man-made dangerous ideologies that not only has caused pain and suffering over the past 1,700 years, but millions upon millions of innocent lives too?

It's just a call away.


Arius/Odon
Oh yes, I recognize the name Odon Sabo from other forums. Good to know I have friends in AZ !!!

I make a lot of "comments" on YouTube that has my full name, especially on Evolution videos.

Yeah, I don't know if you ever visited the "Debating Christianity and Religion" forum? I was there for many years, over 1,000 posts, and they were long too. I learned a lot there, and made some awesome, very intelligent Frenemies.
Yes, it's awesome to still have the freedom to debate, met people from Australia, to Austria to UK and other European countries.

Well, if you and your wife ever come visiting this way, by all means, you are welcome to visit Bro! I would love to meet you, or anyone on either forums.

Is this the post you were telling me I didn't respond to?


Arius
Galatians 2:20 (NKJV)
I have been crucified with Christ; it is no longer I who live, but Christ lives in me; and the life which I now live in the flesh I live by faith in the Son of God, who loved me and gave Himself for me.

There is but One Infinite and Eternal God, and since Infinite is borderless, you can't have any other gods besides Him.

God did not die, His son Word did, for you and for me, because - John 3:16

God is not a being, but the Ground of being - Tillich
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Grace_Accepted

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Re: Internal Coherence of Christs Divinity
« Reply #34 on: April 08, 2019, 08:44:54 pm »

Quote
It is obvious my friend that you do not understand the definition of "Infinite" (even though I make it a point to explain it over and over again in almost every post), and that Infinite and being do not mix. And neither can Infinite be "fully human".

Love, My friend is not condescending. These are words of condescension stated as a fact when they are merely your misinterpretation of the language.  Christ is an infinite being whether you understand the word or not.  He is immeasurable and eternally existing in all dimensions of time.

Labeling someone "condescending" does not prove my interpretation of Infinite and Eternal is incorrect? Proving me wrong is, and I welcome any admonition, correction as long as it is backed up by evidence, not a man made belief created by a man-made doctrine. Also, just because a Disciple of Jesus is condemned to death for not accepting the Trinity doesn't mean he has no true love of his enemies.

John 8:48  (NKJV)
48 Then the Jews answered and said to Him, “Do we not say rightly that You are a Samaritan and have a demon?”


You see, Christians accept the Jews accusing Jesus of blasphemy because he said he was the son of God, then as a Christian you must accept the accusation that Jesus had a demon too. It says it right there, if you accept one Jewish accusation, then why not the other?
You are completely missing the point.  Jesus would have stopped and corrected the Jews if He weren't divine.  Jesus would never have told the devil that worship belonged to God only and then accepted it when given to him from men and angles if He weren't divine.

Isaiah 43:11 I, even I, am the LORD, and apart from me there is no savior. This was Jesus before He was jesus and while He was still called yahweh or LORD.



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patrick jane

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Re: Internal Coherence of Christs Divinity
« Reply #35 on: June 12, 2019, 04:42:12 am »

Quote
It is obvious my friend that you do not understand the definition of "Infinite" (even though I make it a point to explain it over and over again in almost every post), and that Infinite and being do not mix. And neither can Infinite be "fully human".

Love, My friend is not condescending. These are words of condescension stated as a fact when they are merely your misinterpretation of the language.  Christ is an infinite being whether you understand the word or not.  He is immeasurable and eternally existing in all dimensions of time.

Labeling someone "condescending" does not prove my interpretation of Infinite and Eternal is incorrect? Proving me wrong is, and I welcome any admonition, correction as long as it is backed up by evidence, not a man made belief created by a man-made doctrine. Also, just because a Disciple of Jesus is condemned to death for not accepting the Trinity doesn't mean he has no true love of his enemies.

John 8:48  (NKJV)
48 Then the Jews answered and said to Him, “Do we not say rightly that You are a Samaritan and have a demon?”


You see, Christians accept the Jews accusing Jesus of blasphemy because he said he was the son of God, then as a Christian you must accept the accusation that Jesus had a demon too. It says it right there, if you accept one Jewish accusation, then why not the other?
You are completely missing the point.  Jesus would have stopped and corrected the Jews if He weren't divine.  Jesus would never have told the devil that worship belonged to God only and then accepted it when given to him from men and angles if He weren't divine.

Isaiah 43:11 I, even I, am the LORD, and apart from me there is no savior. This was Jesus before He was jesus and while He was still called yahweh or LORD.
I concur.
Hearing, believing and trusting the finished work of Jesus Christ on the cross; His death, burial and resurrection for the forgiveness of sins and REPENTING, seals us with that Holy Spirit of Promise - EPHESIANS 1:10-14 KJV - The Lord is not slack concerning His promise. 2 Peter 3:9 KJV - 1 Corinthians 15:1-4 KJV - Ephesians 1:10-14 KJV - Romans 10:9-10 KJV - Romans 10:13 - Romans 10:17 - Ephesians 1:7 KJV - Colossians 1:14 KJV -


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Grace_Accepted

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Re: Internal Coherence of Christs Divinity
« Reply #36 on: June 20, 2019, 08:09:51 am »
John 5:23 That all men should honour the Son, even as they honour the Father. He that honoureth not the Son honoureth not the Father which hath sent him.

There is but One Infinite and Eternal God, .. pick one, because Jesus made it clear who his God was. I choose the God and Father of Jesus.

Quote
John 8:58 Jesus said unto them, Verily, verily, I say unto you, Before Abraham was, I am.

Yes he was, for he is the first and the last, so the son Word was way before creation of man on the earth, way before Abraham was, since God created all things through him and for him.

Quote
John 10:30 I and my Father are one.

As we all should be one with the Father, that was the son Words whole purpose for coming.
Right now Satan has us so split up, that the only way we'd come together is with his doctrine which is the original creation of Christianity, mainly; Roman Catholic Christian, with its foundation in the divined Trinity Doctrine.

Quote
John 10:33 The Jews answered him, saying, For a good work we stone thee not; but for blasphemy; and because that thou, being a man, makest thyself God.

A lie that the Jews made up to find an excuse to kill him.

Quote
John 10:38 But if I do, though ye believe not me, believe the works: that ye may know, and believe, that the Father is in me, and I in him.

And we as followers of Christ, the son of God Word do believe, and strive to have the Father in us also.

Quote
John 14:6 Jesus saith unto him, I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father, but by me.

And who is the Father? It is God, so Jesus is the gate to God. It doesn't say: "No one comes to Me, but by Me".

Quote
John 14:9 Jesus saith unto him, Have I been so long time with you, and yet hast thou not known me, Philip? he that hath seen me hath seen the Father; and how sayest thou then, Shew us the Father?

Oh how true that is, because Jesus is the closest any of us will ever come to actually "seeing" the invisible Infinite and Eternal Spirit/God, is His physical son Word. And because we have heard and read what God commanded him to speak, we who have not seen the Physical Jesus can also see God through the words he spoke. We are truly blessed, because we no longer depend on sight, but faith in the word of God.

Acts 1:9 Now when He had spoken these things, while they watched, He was taken up, and a cloud received Him out of their sight. 10 And while they looked steadfastly toward heaven as He went up, behold, two men stood by them in white apparel, 11 who also said, “Men of Galilee, why do you stand gazing up into heaven? This same Jesus, who was taken up from you into heaven, will so come in like manner as you saw Him go into heaven.”

John 20:29  (NKJV)
29 Jesus said to him, “Thomas, because you have seen Me, you have believed. Blessed are those who have not seen and yet have believed.”


.. because God is invisible Spirit/Mind, to truly see/know God is through His spoken word, which we find in the Bible as revealed to us by the Holy Spirit.

Quote
John 14:10 Believest thou not that I am in the Father, and the Father in me? the words that I speak unto you I speak not of myself: but the Father that dwelleth in me, he doeth the works.

Exactly, .. God revealed Himself through His son Word aka now Jesus Christ. God did not reveal Himself through Himself because God is Spirit and no one has ever seen God.

John 1:18  (NKJV)
18 No one has seen God at any time. The only begotten [a]Son, who is in the bosom of the Father, He has declared Him.


Quote
John 14:20 At that day ye shall know that I am in my Father, and ye in me, and I in you.

That explains it all, but this doesn't mean we are God, or make up who God Is.

Quote
John 17:5 And now, O Father, glorify thou me with thine own self with the glory which I had with thee before the world was.

.. when he was in Heaven with God his Father, when God created both the Heaven and the Earth with, by and through him.

Quote
John 20:28 And Thomas answered and said unto him, My Lord and my God.

Finally Thomas "seen God" in Christ, unlike most of the other Jews Christ came for.

John 1:9 That was the true Light which gives light to every man coming into the world.
10 He was in the world, and the world was made through Him, and the world did not know Him. 11 He came to His own, and His own did not receive Him. 12 But as many as received Him, to them He gave the right to become children of God, to those who believe in His name: 13 who were born, not of blood, nor of the will of the flesh, nor of the will of man, but of God.


Quote
John 17:21 That they all may be one; as thou, Father, art in me, and I in thee, that they also may be one in us: that the world may believe that thou hast sent me.

the world may believe that thou hast sent me So are we to believe that God sent God?

"That they all may be one; as thou, Father, art in me, and I in thee, that they also may be one in us"

Are we also going to be added into some doctrine that make up the idea of God like the Mormons, for they believe they are all gods who together make up the idea of "God" like the Trinity does?

Quote
2 Corinthians 4:6 For God, who commanded the light to shine out of darkness, hath shined in our hearts, to give the light of the knowledge of the glory of God in the face of Jesus Christ.

2 Corinthians 4:4 In whom the god of this world hath blinded the minds of them which believe not, lest the light of the glorious gospel of Christ, who is the image of God, should shine unto them.

Can't get any more clearer than that, For God, who commanded the light to shine out of darkness, hath shined in our hearts, to give the light of the knowledge of the glory of God in the face of Jesus Christ, and by this Christian Trinity Doctrine the god of this world hath blinded the minds of them which believe not, lest the light of the glorious gospel of Christ, who is the image of God, should shine unto them!

Quote
2 Corinthians 5:19 To wit, that God was in Christ, reconciling the world unto himself, not imputing their trespasses unto them; and hath committed unto us the word of reconciliation.

If Christ was God, then who was in whom? Was God in God, and God died to redeem us? I wouldn't worship a God who the Jews and the Romans could humiliate and murder, would any of you?
Remember God was in Moses, He was in the Fiery Angel of the Lord, in the Ark of the Covenant, none of them are mentioned in the Trinity? The Only reason they chose Jesus and not the Angel of Fire that appeared to Moses is because they seen that they could kill Jesus, not knowing that it is the very reason he came for. If they knew, they would not have killed him, not that they wouldn't want to, but because by Not killing him he could not have fulfilled the Prophesies, and the world would have no savior.

But now it's too late, so Satan changed plans, this time he attacks the Bible by confiscating it and twisting the message, making up doctrines of lies, and by making humanity believe that God died, which opened up the Bible to tens of thousands of interpretations, all under Satan's flag: His doctrine of the Three gods in one, where he made our One and Only Infinite and Eternal God, a threesome, plural, many.

to be continued

God bless you my Brother in Christ


Arius.

P.S.
maybe I already mentioned this, but did you know that Isaak Newton, who was made as the inventor of gravity actually was a follower of Arianism, friend of Arius, a non-Trinitarian?

Maybe not even a Christian!? I have to search more.
Invented Gravity?
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patrick jane

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Re: Internal Coherence of Christs Divinity
« Reply #37 on: June 29, 2019, 11:30:09 am »
 ;D :D
Hearing, believing and trusting the finished work of Jesus Christ on the cross; His death, burial and resurrection for the forgiveness of sins and REPENTING, seals us with that Holy Spirit of Promise - EPHESIANS 1:10-14 KJV - The Lord is not slack concerning His promise. 2 Peter 3:9 KJV - 1 Corinthians 15:1-4 KJV - Ephesians 1:10-14 KJV - Romans 10:9-10 KJV - Romans 10:13 - Romans 10:17 - Ephesians 1:7 KJV - Colossians 1:14 KJV -


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patrick jane

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Re: Internal Coherence of Christs Divinity
« Reply #38 on: July 11, 2019, 05:58:58 am »
Hearing, believing and trusting the finished work of Jesus Christ on the cross; His death, burial and resurrection for the forgiveness of sins and REPENTING, seals us with that Holy Spirit of Promise - EPHESIANS 1:10-14 KJV - The Lord is not slack concerning His promise. 2 Peter 3:9 KJV - 1 Corinthians 15:1-4 KJV - Ephesians 1:10-14 KJV - Romans 10:9-10 KJV - Romans 10:13 - Romans 10:17 - Ephesians 1:7 KJV - Colossians 1:14 KJV -


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