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CHRISTIAN THEOLOGY with BLADERUNNER, LORI BOLINGER and BILLY EVMUR => EVANGELISM & THEOLOGY by BILLY EVMUR => Topic started by: Billy Evmur on August 21, 2018, 04:50:18 am

Title: The Jews to be kept SAFE during the Great Tribulation
Post by: Billy Evmur on August 21, 2018, 04:50:18 am
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The Great Tribulation must not be mixed up with God's wrath, no blood bought soul will ever have to suffer the wrath of God, no matter how backslidden they are.

The Great Tribulation is that period in history [yet to come] mentioned only a few times in scriptures, In Daniel, in our Lord's Mt Olivet sermon and in Jeremiah where it is called the time of "Jacob's trouble"

Let's look at what God says in Jeremiah and see if we could see something we didn't see before.  :)

Jeremiah 30:5
For thus saith the Lord, we have heard a voice of trembling, of fear and not peace.
Ask ye now and see whether a man doth travail with child? wherefore do I see every man with his hands upon his loins as a woman in travail and all faces are turned to paleness?

Alas for that day is great so that none is like it, it is even the time of Jacob's trouble
BUT
...he shall be saved out of it

for it shall come to pass in that day saith the Lord of hosts that I will break his yoke from off thy neck and will burst thy bonds and strangers shall no more serve themselves of him. But they shall serve the Lord their God and David their king whomI will raise up to them

Therefore FEAR YE NOT o My servant Jacob saith the Lord NEITHER BE DISMAYED o Israel for lo I will SAVE THEE from afar and thy seed from the land of their captivity

And Jacob shall return AND SHALL BE IN REST and BE QUIET and NONE SHALL MAKE HIM AFRAID

For I am with thee saith the Lord to SAVE THEE, though I make a full end of the nations, but I will correct thee in measure and I will not leave thee altogether unpunished.
Title: Re: The Jews to be kept SAFE during the Great Tribulation
Post by: Billy Evmur on August 21, 2018, 05:08:57 am
This scripture is fully borne out in Dan.12
And at that time shall Michael stand up, the great Prince which standeth for thy people. And there shall be a time of trouble such as never was since there was a nation even to that time and at that time THY PEOPLE SHALL BE DELIVERED, everyone that shall be found written in the book.
Title: Re: The Jews to be kept SAFE during the Great Tribulation
Post by: Billy Evmur on August 21, 2018, 05:19:54 am
WHY then is it called the time of Jacob's trouble?

In Jeremiah we clearly see the people are in dread fear...God asks "WHY? why are you afraid? this is the time of your VINDICATION...I'm gunna break the yoke off of your neck, you'll be SAVED, you'll be IN PEACE, you'll be AT REST, NONE SHALL MAKE YOU AFRAID.

It is called the time of Jacob's trouble because the trouble is coming upon the nations ON JACOB'S BEHALF.

Watch this close now, for it shows who will and who will not go through the Great Tribulation.

He says it is not the MAN who travails in childbirth it is the WOMAN who travails in childbirth

See...Israel is God's firstborn son, the church is His Bride

And the PURPOSE of our travail, the Great Tribulation is to give birth, spiritual birth to the nation of Israel.
Title: Re: The Jews to be kept SAFE during the Great Tribulation
Post by: Sasha on August 21, 2018, 05:26:38 am
The Great Tribulation must not be mixed up with God's wrath, no blood bought soul will ever have to suffer the wrath of God, no matter how backslidden they are.

The Great Tribulation is that period in history [yet to come] mentioned only a few times in scriptures, In Daniel, in our Lord's Mt Olivet sermon and in Jeremiah where it is called the time of "Jacob's trouble"

Let's look at what God says in Jeremiah and see if we could see something we didn't see before.  :)

Jeremiah 30:5
For thus saith the Lord, we have heard a voice of trembling, of fear and not peace.
Ask ye now and see whether a man doth travail with child? wherefore do I see every man with his hands upon his loins as a woman in travail and all faces are turned to paleness?

Alas for that day is great so that none is like it, it is even the time of Jacob's trouble
BUT
...he shall be saved out of it

for it shall come to pass in that day saith the Lord of hosts that I will break his yoke from off thy neck and will burst thy bonds and strangers shall no more serve themselves of him. But they shall serve the Lord their God and David their king whomI will raise up to them

Therefore FEAR YE NOT o My servant Jacob saith the Lord NEITHER BE DISMAYED o Israel for lo I will SAVE THEE from afar and thy seed from the land of their captivity

And Jacob shall return AND SHALL BE IN REST and BE QUIET and NONE SHALL MAKE HIM AFRAID

For I am with thee saith the Lord to SAVE THEE, though I make a full end of the nations, but I will correct thee in measure and I will not leave thee altogether unpunished.


When scripture interprets scripture, and one is conformed by scriptural view, this really is the only possible meaning of these passages.
Title: Re: The Jews to be kept SAFE during the Great Tribulation
Post by: joechan82 on August 21, 2018, 10:16:09 am
Good topic.
Dan 9:24  Seventy weeks are determined upon thy people and upon thy holy city, to finish the transgression, and to make an end of sins, and to make reconciliation for iniquity, and to bring in everlasting righteousness, and to seal up the vision and prophecy, and to anoint the most Holy. 

The verse above must speak of a yet future event, because Jesus will be anointed. I believe that this is His anointing as king. I also believe that Israel will also be purged of her nonbelieving elements during this 70th week. Look at how many die in the earthquakes in Israel during that week. Many Jews will also be saved during this time.
Title: Re: The Jews to be kept SAFE during the Great Tribulation
Post by: Billy Evmur on August 22, 2018, 06:24:12 am
Christ is anointed, in fact Christ means anointed, He HAS made an end of sins and made reconciliation for iniquities, He has brought in everlasting righteousness.

The vision and the prophecy is now sealed up in Christ. The most holy is anointed.

But Christ was cut off after 62 weeks, all that happened to the Jews happened between the 62 and the 69th week...the word is desolations not earthquake.

Now look you can't mix up prophecies  :)

There in all the Prophets we see the early prophecies concerning Israel and the later prophecies, these later prophecies are usually designated "in the last days" or "in the latter times"

The early prophecies deal with the FALL of Israel and the later prophecies deal with the RISE of Israel, there are prophecies of judgement and punishment, banishment and prophecies of gathering and blessing. God can't be doing both these things at the same time, He is either judging them or He is blessing them and keeping them safe, He can't be scattering them and gathering them too.

So what do we see God doing now? He is gathering them, and He IS protecting them, we can actually SEE this with our own eyes.
Title: Re: The Jews to be kept SAFE during the Great Tribulation
Post by: Bladerunner on August 22, 2018, 02:55:55 pm
Christ is anointed, in fact Christ means anointed, He HAS made an end of sins and made reconciliation for iniquities, He has brought in everlasting righteousness.

The vision and the prophecy is now sealed up in Christ. The most holy is anointed.

But Christ was cut off after 62 weeks, all that happened to the Jews happened between the 62 and the 69th week...the word is desolations not earthquake.

Now look you can't mix up prophecies  :)

There in all the Prophets we see the early prophecies concerning Israel and the later prophecies, these later prophecies are usually designated "in the last days" or "in the latter times"

The early prophecies deal with the FALL of Israel and the later prophecies deal with the RISE of Israel, there are prophecies of judgement and punishment, banishment and prophecies of gathering and blessing. God can't be doing both these things at the same time, He is either judging them or He is blessing them and keeping them safe, He can't be scattering them and gathering them too.

So what do we see God doing now? He is gathering them, and He IS protecting them, we can actually SEE this with our own eyes.


How are you defining earlier and later prophecies?

Blade
Title: Re: The Jews to be kept SAFE during the Great Tribulation
Post by: Billy Evmur on August 22, 2018, 07:06:11 pm
OK, so not hard and fast, but if we read Isaiah, Jeremiah and Ezekiel for eg we see in the early portions God is dealing with Israel according to the rebelliousness, punishing them and warning them of being scattered or driven out. But then we read the later portions where God promises to restore them and bring them home and bless them and protect them.

He can't be doing both at the same time. Jacob's trouble is all about Antichrist's invasion of Jerusalem with his armies, but God is going to come and fight for Israel. It is the time of Israel's vindication.
Title: Re: The Jews to be kept SAFE during the Great Tribulation
Post by: Bladerunner on August 22, 2018, 09:01:22 pm
OK, so not hard and fast, but if we read Isaiah, Jeremiah and Ezekiel for eg we see in the early portions God is dealing with Israel according to the rebelliousness, punishing them and warning them of being scattered or driven out. But then we read the later portions where God promises to restore them and bring them home and bless them and protect them.

He can't be doing both at the same time. Jacob's trouble is all about Antichrist's invasion of Jerusalem with his armies, but God is going to come and fight for Israel. It is the time of Israel's vindication.


The hordes will be outside the city when the antichrist (son of Perdition) declares the AOD. Those Jews who believe in Jesus Christ and are alive, will flee the city as Jesus told them to do. They will flee to Petra. At around the same time, Michael is throwing Satan out of Heaven. Yes, Satan still has access in heaven even after all these years.

WHen Satan comes to earth, the antichritst (man of sin) will have been fatally wounded. Satan will take over His body and mimic the resurrection Jesus did 2000 years ago. The AOD will then Happen.

God will protect the Jewish people fleeing Jerusalem and will feed and water them at that place. Rev 12.

Please keep in mind,  2/3 of the Jewish people's population at that time will die during Daniel's 70th week with most of them dying during ' Jacob's trouble',the Great tribulation spoken of by Jesus, last 3 1/2 years of Daniel's 70tyh week.

The Remnant (1/3) will be at Petra.

*********

If by chance a post rapture happens, then all those left on earth after the wicked are killed off will be believers. These believers include all the church, tribulation Believers left on earth including the Jewish people and the OT saints. All these plus those dead in all categories (in Christ) will be resurrected and receive translated Bodies. In other words, everyone will be as Jesus is.

No one will have a mortal body. No one will need the Fruit from the Tree of Life that is in the Garden of Eden.

Who will populate the earth's millennium.  HUM..... So much for prophecy. Thus, if one small error is contained within the Bible prophecy, then we simply need to throw it out along with the GOD who authored it?

Happily, it will not happen that way.  All prophecy will happen as it is literally written and the Millennium will be lead by the very GOD whose Love and Grace has embraced us and forgiven our sins. Jesus Christ.


Title: Re: The Jews to be kept SAFE during the Great Tribulation
Post by: Billy Evmur on September 02, 2018, 04:49:29 am
70 WEEKS, (DANIEL IS A VERY DIFFICULT BOOK TO INTERPRET, LIKE THE APOCALYPSE THE INTERPRETATIONS ARE LEGION)

62 WEEKS ENDED WITH THE MESSIAH BEING CUT OFF, IT IS IN THIS PERIOD BETWEEN THE 62ND WEEK AND THE 69TH WEEK WE SEE THE PEOPLE OF THE PRINCE WHO IS TO COME [ANTICHRIST] CAME IN AND DESTROYED THE CITY AND THE TEMPLE. THAT IS WHEN THE CHRISTRIANS FLED TO PETRA AND 2/3 OF JEWS WERE KILLED.

THERE IS ONE WEEK YET REMAINING, IN THAT WEEK (7 YEARS) THERE WILL BE A TREATY BETWEEN THE PRINCE WHO IS TO COME (ANTICHRIST) AND ISRAEL, AFTER 3 AND 1/2 YEARS HE WILL BREAK THAT TREATY AND INVADE ISRAEL.

THAT IS WHEN THE ABOMINATION WILL TAKE PLACE AND WHEN CHRIST DESCENDS FROM HEAVEN WITH A SHOUT AND THE RAP TAKES PLACE...ANTICHRIST IS DESTROYED AND THE DAY OF THE LORD BEGINS.

THE CHURCH WILL HAVE ENDURED ANTICHRIST'S REIGN, BUT ISRAEL WILL HAVE HAD A TREATY DURING THE 3 AND 1/2 YEARS
Title: Re: The Jews to be kept SAFE during the Great Tribulation
Post by: Bladerunner on September 03, 2018, 09:40:56 pm
70 WEEKS, (DANIEL IS A VERY DIFFICULT BOOK TO INTERPRET, LIKE THE APOCALYPSE THE INTERPRETATIONS ARE LEGION)

62 WEEKS ENDED WITH THE MESSIAH BEING CUT OFF, IT IS IN THIS PERIOD BETWEEN THE 62ND WEEK AND THE 69TH WEEK WE SEE THE PEOPLE OF THE PRINCE WHO IS TO COME [ANTICHRIST] CAME IN AND DESTROYED THE CITY AND THE TEMPLE. THAT IS WHEN THE CHRISTRIANS FLED TO PETRA AND 2/3 OF JEWS WERE KILLED.

THERE IS ONE WEEK YET REMAINING, IN THAT WEEK (7 YEARS) THERE WILL BE A TREATY BETWEEN THE PRINCE WHO IS TO COME (ANTICHRIST) AND ISRAEL, AFTER 3 AND 1/2 YEARS HE WILL BREAK THAT TREATY AND INVADE ISRAEL.

THAT IS WHEN THE ABOMINATION WILL TAKE PLACE AND WHEN CHRIST DESCENDS FROM HEAVEN WITH A SHOUT AND THE RAP TAKES PLACE...ANTICHRIST IS DESTROYED AND THE DAY OF THE LORD BEGINS.

THE CHURCH WILL HAVE ENDURED ANTICHRIST'S REIGN, BUT ISRAEL WILL HAVE HAD A TREATY DURING THE 3 AND 1/2 YEARS

Billy: Are you are speaking of the of the Macabellion Revolt because of the Abomination of Desolate caused by Antiochus Epiphanes.

Likewise in the 70 AD prophecy of Jesus Christ, there were no Christians that died as they Believed Jesus and Fled when the Roman Army surrounded the city.

The Jews who did not believe did not leave and died. It was NOT 2/3 of the Population as they were then scattered all across the earth in every different nation only to come back (Dry Bones Prophecy) to their own land in 1948.

OH, there was no Abomination of Desolate during 70 AD. The temple BURNT to the Ground, some (Josephus) say the temple was set on fire by the priest to protect it from the soldiers.

Because it burnt to the ground, the heat melted the Gold inlaid in the walls, ceiling, etc.. This is why the soldiers were told by Gen Titus to move every stone to get the gold.

Yes, there was soldiers praying to their Idols while they were huddled around the eastern Gate but this was NOT, I repeat NOT an Abomination of Desolate. This could only happen in the Holy of Holies and it was destroyed by fire.

Blade
 
Title: Re: The Jews to be kept SAFE during the Great Tribulation
Post by: Billy Evmur on September 04, 2018, 05:55:12 pm
We might just be missing each other in passing Blade because we read Dan differently, do you see a gap at the 69th week? that means there is 1 more week left, I understand, I'm afraid every commentator reads it differently, but as I understand, that in that week which is 7 years and is still future the temple will be built, in the time of trouble, that is the tribulation.

Antichrist will be in control everywhere but he will have a 7 year treaty or pact with Israel but he will break it after 31/2 years and invade, his sitting in the temple will be the abomination and the Lord will destroy him at His coming.
Title: Re: The Jews to be kept SAFE during the Great Tribulation
Post by: Bladerunner on September 04, 2018, 08:16:18 pm
We might just be missing each other in passing Blade because we read Dan differently, do you see a gap at the 69th week? that means there is 1 more week left, I understand, I'm afraid every commentator reads it differently, but as I understand, that in that week which is 7 years and is still future the temple will be built, in the time of trouble, that is the tribulation.

Antichrist will be in control everywhere but he will have a 7 year treaty or pact with Israel but he will break it after 31/2 years and invade, his sitting in the temple will be the abomination and the Lord will destroy him at His coming.


HI Billy... and a good evening to you sir!

Yes, I do read Daniel a little different than you. The 69 weeks brings us to the death, burial and resurrection of Jesus Christ and stops there.

The 70th week is prophesied in Dan 9:27..  and you have generalized it very well,. lol...

How do you read it differently? Just inquisitive. Each verse is independent of the others.

Gabriel told Daniel right, Jesus appeared on that very day 69 weeks or 173,880 days, April 6, 32AD, from the command to rebuild Jerusalem, the temple and "the city wall and streets" was given on March 14, 445 B.C. by Artaxerxes Longimanus.

Blade
Title: Re: The Jews to be kept SAFE during the Great Tribulation
Post by: Billy Evmur on September 05, 2018, 08:45:27 am
Yo

What I fail to see is where you get the 2/3s from at the time of the end....of course you are Pretrib, I am definitely Post [as was Jesus  :P]

A crucial understanding is 9.26. and the people of the prince who is to come some people believe this prince who is to come is the Lord, but no it is Antichrist.

So the prince who is to come Antichrist is future but the people of the prince who is to come [the Romans] were those who destroyed the temple and the city thus the prophesied 2/3s.

But it is Antichrist who is yet to come who will have a covenant with Israel for one week, or seven years but will break it after 3 and 1/2 years.

This is the tribulation 7 years but Israel will be in peace, having a peace treaty with Ac while the rest of the world is in utter turmoil, so we see the tribulation period cut short as the Lord prophesied "lest all flesh should perish" so more correctly I am mid-trib rapture.

But I srael escapes which is totally in line with Jeremiah 30 and with Dan.12.

Thanks for your imput  :)
Title: Re: The Jews to be kept SAFE during the Great Tribulation
Post by: Bladerunner on September 05, 2018, 10:00:54 pm
Yo

What I fail to see is where you get the 2/3s from at the time of the end....of course you are Pretrib, I am definitely Post [as was Jesus  :P]

A crucial understanding is 9.26. and the people of the prince who is to come some people believe this prince who is to come is the Lord, but no it is Antichrist.

So the prince who is to come Antichrist is future but the people of the prince who is to come [the Romans] were those who destroyed the temple and the city thus the prophesied 2/3s.

But it is Antichrist who is yet to come who will have a covenant with Israel for one week, or seven years but will break it after 3 and 1/2 years.

This is the tribulation 7 years but Israel will be in peace, having a peace treaty with Ac while the rest of the world is in utter turmoil, so we see the tribulation period cut short as the Lord prophesied "lest all flesh should perish" so more correctly I am mid-trib rapture.

But I srael escapes which is totally in line with Jeremiah 30 and with Dan.12.

Thanks for your imput  :)


Billy,  [The people of the prince], was not the Romans. This was the eastern leg of ROME and they employed not Roman soldiers but local people who could sign up for service in the Roman Army and become a roman citizen.  Thus people throughout the middle east  the Assyrians or other locals. Micah 5 tells us the anti-christ will be an Assyrian. Remember NIMROD, the First Assyrian King and leader of an empire. Would not the Anti-Christ be the Last Leader of an Empire. (the One world Empire)??

The Anti-christ will be of Assyrian dissent.

The anti-christ will (enforce) as covenant with Israel and WHO (Death and HELL)  Isaiah 28:14-18). This covenant will allow the Jewish people to rebuild the temple in search of the Messiah they so long ago killed on the Cross.

There are many more prophecies that will affect Israel and GOD will save them everytime. God himself tells us He will save a Remnant (1/3  the size of the population when Daniel’s 70th week begins)

As far as post and mid trib Raptures, Jesus did not tell HIS BRIDE (the Church) that she would be beaten up and killed before He could take her to the marriage supper.

Blade
Title: Re: The Jews to be kept SAFE during the Great Tribulation
Post by: Billy Evmur on September 09, 2018, 12:13:30 pm
Riiight….the remnant are the church Jews, the apostles et al.

I really cannot agree that Jesus did not warn His bride about the great end time persecution [aka the great tribulation] it is for His name's sake we will be hated by all.

It cannot be the Jews...no way

for children will deliver up parents unto death and parents the children. This kind of persecution must be horrific beyond our imagination that parents will deliver up their children to death.

Now think

If the persecution is coming upon the Jews because they are Jewish then the parents would be betraying themselves also, for if the children are Jewish then the parents must be Jewish also. Similarly if the children deliver up the parents to death.

No this persecution is coming upon the church...I do not expect to be raptured [actually I'll prolly get run over by a bus] but if I don't and if I don't die of old age I fully expect to be martyred.

This is that great crowd which no man could number which suddenly appeared in glory which John saw, who had palm branches in their hand and had washed their robes and made them white...these are imo martyrs.


In the previous chapter the martyrs under the altar cried for justice and were told to wait until they should be joined by their fellow brethren martyrs, they were given white robes. This huge multitude which now appeared are these martyrs.
Title: Re: The Jews to be kept SAFE during the Great Tribulation
Post by: 1Mind1Spirit on September 09, 2018, 03:05:19 pm
Those of Israel who were to escape the destruction of Jerusalem escaped.
Those who were to be martyred because they were hated by both Jews and Gentiles were martyred.
There is no "missing" 70th week.
Christ was crucified in the middle of it.
Title: Re: The Jews to be kept SAFE during the Great Tribulation
Post by: Bladerunner on September 09, 2018, 06:30:06 pm
Those of Israel who were to escape the destruction of Jerusalem escaped.
Those who were to be martyred because they were hated by both Jews and Gentiles were martyred.
There is no "missing" 70th week.
Christ was crucified in the middle of it.

Ah, 1Mind1Spirit, has a Ammillist-preterist Theology. Hope this finds you well.

Have always argued against your theology. Got to ask WHY do you think this way when overwhelming evidence supports the prophecies of the BIBLE?

JUst asking and hope you have a great evening.

Blade

Title: Re: The Jews to be kept SAFE during the Great Tribulation
Post by: 1Mind1Spirit on September 10, 2018, 01:16:00 am
I'm neither preterist nor futurist.
I just cannot logically call Jesus the anti-Christ.
Jesus caused the oblation to cease when he was crucified.
Title: Re: The Jews to be kept SAFE during the Great Tribulation
Post by: Bladerunner on September 10, 2018, 07:15:35 pm
I'm neither preterist nor futurist.
I just cannot logically call Jesus the anti-Christ.
Jesus caused the oblation to cease when he was crucified.

Hey 1Mind1Spirit, don't believe I called you a Futurist. That would make you like me or close..????
https://3169.createaforum.com/Smileys/users/3169/grin.gif

Preterist are ones who incorporate the Nation of Israel into the CHurch instead of God having two plans He only has one. https://3169.createaforum.com/Smileys/users/3169/undecided.gif

Rem, Jesus cannot marry Israel as She is a divorced woman.

you said:"I just cannot logically call Jesus the anti-Christ.
Jesus caused the oblation to cease when he was crucified."

How anyone call Jesus the Anti-Christ...Oh, wait a minute, I know.. Daniel 9:26  Don't see how you are getting that from this verse either?

How did Jesus Cause the OBLATION (worship) to cease out of Daniel 9:27 which is in Daniel's 70th week?

Oh well, Hope you have a great evening

Blade
Title: Re: The Jews to be kept SAFE during the Great Tribulation
Post by: 1Mind1Spirit on September 30, 2018, 09:29:18 pm
I'm neither preterist nor futurist.
I just cannot logically call Jesus the anti-Christ.
Jesus caused the oblation to cease when he was crucified.

Hey 1Mind1Spirit, don't believe I called you a Futurist. That would make you like me or close..????
https://3169.createaforum.com/Smileys/users/3169/grin.gif

Preterist are ones who incorporate the Nation of Israel into the CHurch instead of God having two plans He only has one. https://3169.createaforum.com/Smileys/users/3169/undecided.gif

Rem, Jesus cannot marry Israel as She is a divorced woman.

you said:"I just cannot logically call Jesus the anti-Christ.
Jesus caused the oblation to cease when he was crucified."

How anyone call Jesus the Anti-Christ...Oh, wait a minute, I know.. Daniel 9:26  Don't see how you are getting that from this verse either?

How did Jesus Cause the OBLATION (worship) to cease out of Daniel 9:27 which is in Daniel's 70th week?

Oh well, Hope you have a great evening

Blade

Why would you think Jesus' sacrifice didn't count for another 30 some odd years?
Title: Re: The Jews to be kept SAFE during the Great Tribulation
Post by: 1Mind1Spirit on September 30, 2018, 09:35:45 pm

This is that great crowd which no man could number which suddenly appeared in glory which John saw, who had palm branches in their hand and had washed their robes and made them white...these are imo martyrs.

In the previous chapter the martyrs under the altar cried for justice and were told to wait until they should be joined by their fellow brethren martyrs, they were given white robes. This huge multitude which now appeared are these martyrs. [/color][/size][/font]
Nope.
These are those who believe in Christ,


In the previous chapter the martyrs under the altar cried for justice and were told to wait until they should be joined by their fellow brethren martyrs, they were given white robes. This huge multitude which now appeared are these martyrs. [/color][/size][/font]

These are those slain from righteous Abel until the destruction of Jerusalem.

Title: Re: The Jews to be kept SAFE during the Great Tribulation
Post by: Bladerunner on September 30, 2018, 10:22:32 pm
I'm neither preterist nor futurist.
I just cannot logically call Jesus the anti-Christ.
Jesus caused the oblation to cease when he was crucified.

Hey 1Mind1Spirit, don't believe I called you a Futurist. That would make you like me or close..????
https://3169.createaforum.com/Smileys/users/3169/grin.gif

Preterist are ones who incorporate the Nation of Israel into the CHurch instead of God having two plans He only has one. https://3169.createaforum.com/Smileys/users/3169/undecided.gif

Rem, Jesus cannot marry Israel as She is a divorced woman.

you said:"I just cannot logically call Jesus the anti-Christ.
Jesus caused the oblation to cease when he was crucified."

How anyone call Jesus the Anti-Christ...Oh, wait a minute, I know.. Daniel 9:26  Don't see how you are getting that from this verse either?

How did Jesus Cause the OBLATION (worship) to cease out of Daniel 9:27 which is in Daniel's 70th week?

Oh well, Hope you have a great evening

Blade

Why would you think Jesus' sacrifice didn't count for another 30 some odd years?

 DO WHAT? did not count? It counted in the next  days after His resurrection.

Daniel's 9:27 is a prophecy if I am hearing right?

God (the Father) is the one who divorced Israel and is the one to remarry HER.

Jesus' Bride is HIS Church (believers in His Gospel)
 (1 Cor 15:1-4) during the Dispensation of Grace period., This started at Acts 2 and will end with the Rapture of the Church to Heaven.

You Said:How did Jesus Cause the OBLATION (worship) to cease out of Daniel 9:27 which is in Daniel's 70th week?

Jesus did not cause it, the Pseudo Christ did. You are reading Daniel 9:27 wrong.  Let me try to explain:

Daniel 9:26 "And after threescore and two weeks shall Messiah (prior to Prince in next line)be cut off, but not for himself: and the people of the prince that shall come shall destroy the city and the sanctuary; and the end thereof shall be with a flood, and unto the end of the war desolations are determined."

Daniel 9:27.."And he shall confirm the covenant with many for one week: and in the midst of the week he shall cause the sacrifice and the oblation to cease, and for the overspreading of abominations he shall make it desolate, even until the consummation, and that determined shall be poured upon the desolate."

We see in verse 27:" he" is the antecedent to the previous paragraph, verse Daniel 9:26.

Define "ANECEDENT" a thing or event that existed before or logically precedes another.

In Daniel 9:26. ".... and the people of the prince that shall..."  is the Antecedent not the "Messiah" which was before the Prince.

What I am saying is grammatically correct. If you do not believe,  please consult a English teacher.

It is the Pseudo-Christ that will be from ancestry of the people that were with Titus in 70AD. These people were of Assyrian Ancestry. So will be the Pseudo Christ. Another Nimrod first King of the first Empire (Assyrian).

Jesus Christ was and is still in heaven awaiting the fullness of the Church. Not the gentiles but the Church.

The Fullness of the Gentiles will not be until the end of Daniel's 70th week.  Armageddon will remove all gentiles from Jerusalem thus the (Fullness of the Gentiles).

1Mind1SPirit
, there are many, many scholars and others that agree with my explanation of the Pseudo Christ and who HE will be. Keep in mind that there was NO AOD during the 70 AD destruction of Jerusalem. The temple was set fire by the priest within as was the city itself. However, the Romans after seeing this, decided to burn the rest adding insult to injury.

Again, the temple was burnt. Titus nor anyone else defiled the Holy of Holies within its walls while they were standing that is.

Hang in there my friend.

Blade



Title: Re: The Jews to be kept SAFE during the Great Tribulation
Post by: Scripter on October 03, 2018, 08:10:13 am
Very good blade,
You should do the same with the rest, however, the Daniel passage dissolves into a generation, as I see it.  I mean the desolation coming like a flood.  Given that there was already a major rebellion (a messianic zealot one) in 6 during the census (Acts 5), the country could have gone up in smoke anytime from then to 66, when the final one started. 
Title: Re: The Jews to be kept SAFE during the Great Tribulation
Post by: Bladerunner on October 04, 2018, 05:57:15 pm
Very good blade,
You should do the same with the rest, however, the Daniel passage dissolves into a generation, as I see it.  I mean the desolation coming like a flood.  Given that there was already a major rebellion (a messianic zealot one) in 6 during the census (Acts 5), the country could have gone up in smoke anytime from then to 66, when the final one started.

Final What started. In 70 AD the temple was burnt to the ground, Jerusalem, the city itself is not completely destroyed and there is still a Jewish presence there. There is simply no rebellion.

The meaning of desolate empty, to include people, etc. A desert while has many tribes traveling over it, has places that have not seen people in a while. No nothing except maybe rodents live there. This is desolate.

The AOD did not take place in 70 AD and the se3cond one has not taken place yet. The first one was in 167 BC.

The church was married to the State (world went Christian) around 300 AD and Jerusalem was completely destroyed and PLOWED UNDER in 135AD. This is when the remaining Jewish population was under diaspora throughout the world. 

I know you think the Jews are part of the CHurch now but Jesus tells us in Romans 9,10 and 11 their past, presence and future. To dispute the Lord's WORD would not be a good idea.

The desolation like a Flood is used in Rev. and means the hordes of gentiles armies that are being held off by the antichrist's covenant during the first half of Daniel's 70th week. These armies are probably as bad as the roman armies were in ancient times. Pillage, Rape, killing babies (although the US does that efficiently enough today), killing men, women and children that do not believe as they do. Does this remind you of anything in the US today. The Liberal left has the same mindset. If you do not agree with them, then you are dirt under their feet. one step away from pulling the trigger in order to get their way. It is coming very soon,,,I suspect sooner than anyone suspects. ARE YOU READY!
Blade


Title: Re: The Jews to be kept SAFE during the Great Tribulation
Post by: Scripter on October 21, 2018, 12:59:09 pm
"I know you think the Jews are part of the church now."

You are a very confused person.

To have faith in the Gospel of Christ's righteousness is to be a believer.  God is working with believers, not unbelievers.  It does not matter what gender, race or DNA the person is any more.  That is neither for nor against them.  Rom 11:30:  he has shown all men bound to sin, that he might have mercy on them all.  Race, gender, class does not matter. 
Title: Re: The Jews to be kept SAFE during the Great Tribulation
Post by: Billy Evmur on October 21, 2018, 01:18:26 pm
Well you say I am confused. But you play scriptural hopscotch, you accept one line of scripture and then reject the next, this one, you say, is literal but this next one must be symbolic because it doesn't fit into my doctrine.

I accept it all...except where it is obviously a metaphor or parable, even then the truths taught are literal.

You say Israel is laid aside, I accept they are, the scripture clearly teaches it. But the very same passage of scripture which says they are now rejected says they will be accepted, now they are diminished but they will attain to fulness. They are now grafted out of their vine but they will be grafted back in.


So the upshot is Paul teaches "all Israel will be saved." why do you only accept half scriptures.
Title: Re: The Jews to be kept SAFE during the Great Tribulation
Post by: Bladerunner on October 21, 2018, 07:54:44 pm
Well you say I am confused. But you play scriptural hopscotch, you accept one line of scripture and then reject the next, this one, you say, is literal but this next one must be symbolic because it doesn't fit into my doctrine.

I accept it all...except where it is obviously a metaphor or parable, even then the truths taught are literal.

You say Israel is laid aside, I accept they are, the scripture clearly teaches it. But the very same passage of scripture which says they are now rejected says they will be accepted, now they are diminished but they will attain to fulness. They are now grafted out of their vine but they will be grafted back in.


So the upshot is Paul teaches "all Israel will be saved." why do you only accept half scriptures.


Billy: are you speaking to me or 'Scripter'.... I don't want to get in if you are arguing His points views

Blade
Title: Re: The Jews to be kept SAFE during the Great Tribulation
Post by: Scripter on October 21, 2018, 08:35:16 pm
You are seeing D'ism when you read that is not in the text.

What it actually says is that those who are in now are there by faith.  That is, they are justified.  He quoted Isaiah about (his) now.

Nowhere in Romans or the NT does 'saved' mean a restored Israel.  There is no interest or concern about it that I know of.  They would like to have seen it miss the destructive events of the 6th decade, but it was pretty much inevitable, and then there was Dan 9.

To say information on the 1000 in Rev 20 is scant does not mean I'm jumping around with it.  Or around it.  It means there is too little info when compared with the NHNE which dates as far back as Isaiah. 

The 'restored Israel' episode you imagine was never known in the Reformation, and it was concocted by 2 guys who said the Bible did not make sense, even though they were standing at the end of 200 years of reformation teaching.  So they came up with their system or liked what they saw in Ribera's!  When they got done they unleashed more nonsense and conflict and discord than was ever in the Reformation. 
Title: Re: The Jews to be kept SAFE during the Great Tribulation
Post by: Billy Evmur on October 22, 2018, 01:53:41 pm
The restored Israel has nothing to do with Schoffield or Darby, all the church fathers taught that at the last Israel would be brought in. Oh yes you jump about, you zing in on anything that shows Israel's fall, which none of us deny, but you are blind to all the prophets who ever spoke concerning Israel's restoration.

Much more importantly Paul taught it...in the very passages you quote to show their fall.

It was not known by the reformation because the RCC was anti semite [as are YOU] and this carried over, Luther was anti semite.

You fail to understand the promise to the seed from Abe's loin is the land, the ends of the earth, not heavenly, the heavenly promise is for the Christ seed which does include Abe, Ike and Jake.


God said to Abraham "count the stars, for numbers so shall your seed be" God also said "for number your seed shall be as sand on the seashore" The heavenly or spiritual and the earthly. The heavenly seed is Christ. 
Title: Re: The Jews to be kept SAFE during the Great Tribulation
Post by: Bladerunner on October 23, 2018, 07:53:47 pm
The restored Israel has nothing to do with Schoffield or Darby, all the church fathers taught that at the last Israel would be brought in. Oh yes you jump about, you zing in on anything that shows Israel's fall, which none of us deny, but you are blind to all the prophets who ever spoke concerning Israel's restoration.

Much more importantly Paul taught it...in the very passages you quote to show their fall.

It was not known by the reformation because the RCC was anti semite [as are YOU] and this carried over, Luther was anti semite.

You fail to understand the promise to the seed from Abe's loin is the land, the ends of the earth, not heavenly, the heavenly promise is for the Christ seed which does include Abe, Ike and Jake.


God said to Abraham "count the stars, for numbers so shall your seed be" God also said "for number your seed shall be as sand on the seashore" The heavenly or spiritual and the earthly. The heavenly seed is Christ.

Billy..2/3 of Israel will die during Jacob's trouble and He (God)will protect the other 1/3.


Zechariah 13:8-9 -" And it shall come to pass in all the land," Says the LORD, "That two-thirds in it shall be cut off and die, But one-third shall be left in it: I will bring the one-third through the fire, Will refine them as silver is refined, And test them as gold is tested. They will call on My name, And I will answer them. I will say, 'This is My people'; And each one will say, 'The LORD is my God.' "

Blade
Title: Re: The Jews to be kept SAFE during the Great Tribulation
Post by: Billy Evmur on October 24, 2018, 02:35:21 am
So you keep saying dear Bade...later Zecharia speaks about Israel's restoration.

And Jremiah says Jacob will be saved, will be at peace, and none shall make him afraid, he will even be in prosperity for every man shall sit under his fig tree and under his vine.


All this in the time of Jacob's trouble.

Even Dan.12 states by open scripture that at that time of trouble Michael shall stand up for his people to deliver them.


WHY THEN is it called "Jacob's trouble"?


It is called Jacob's trouble because it is trouble coming upon the nations on account of Israel, it is the time of vengeance against Israel's enemies, the time of Israel's vindication. The time when Jerusalem will become a cup to make the nations reel.


Surely you see Zech.13. which speaks about "on that day a fountain shall be opened for the house of David and the inhabitants of Jerusalem for sin and for uncleaness", when he speaks about the Shepherd being smitten and the sheep scattered he is speaking about Christ's first appearance and the cross.


But Zech.14 takes a different tack and is talking a day which is coming when

YES Jerusalem will be attacked and taken into captivity with women raped and houses rifled and half the city will go into captivity

verse 3.
THEN the Lord will go forth and fight against those nations as when He fought in the day of battle.

In chapter 13 He is punishing Israel and scattering them but then in chapter 14. He fights for them.


They are different prophecies concerning different events.
Title: Re: The Jews to be kept SAFE during the Great Tribulation
Post by: Bladerunner on October 24, 2018, 06:28:18 pm
So you keep saying dear Bade...later Zecharia speaks about Israel's restoration.

And Jremiah says Jacob will be saved, will be at peace, and none shall make him afraid, he will even be in prosperity for every man shall sit under his fig tree and under his vine.


All this in the time of Jacob's trouble.

Even Dan.12 states by open scripture that at that time of trouble Michael shall stand up for his people to deliver them.


WHY THEN is it called "Jacob's trouble"?


It is called Jacob's trouble because it is trouble coming upon the nations on account of Israel, it is the time of vengeance against Israel's enemies, the time of Israel's vindication. The time when Jerusalem will become a cup to make the nations reel.


Surely you see Zech.13. which speaks about "on that day a fountain shall be opened for the house of David and the inhabitants of Jerusalem for sin and for uncleaness", when he speaks about the Shepherd being smitten and the sheep scattered he is speaking about Christ's first appearance and the cross.


But Zech.14 takes a different tack and is talking a day which is coming when

YES Jerusalem will be attacked and taken into captivity with women raped and houses rifled and half the city will go into captivity

verse 3.
THEN the Lord will go forth and fight against those nations as when He fought in the day of battle.

In chapter 13 He is punishing Israel and scattering them but then in chapter 14. He fights for them.


They are different prophecies concerning different events.


Isa is perhaps the best History of the Jewish people throughout the early times and the end times. Isa does not do anything in chronological order but Rev 6 onward is there. In Rev it is simply in chronological order.

How many times throughout History was Jerusalem held in captivity only to return to their land.  Many

How many times were the Jewish people placed in diaspora (dispersed) around the world, only to return to their land?  ONE- 1948

How many times has other ethtnic groups, countries, etc. been lost to diaspora and have been assimilated in the country they wound up in? Many  (i.e northern Jewish kingdom)

How many of these groups have come back to their country with their own identity as Israel has done. NONE

A remnant of the Jewish People will be saved but these people will all be believers that Jesus Christ is the Son of GOD and is the Messiah. This is a big part of what Daniel's 70th week is for. To place the Jewish people (UP AGAINST the WALL) in order for them to understand just who Jesus really is.

2/3 of the population, as told to us in scriptures, WILL DIE!

The saved 1/3 will live during the "Kingdom of Heaven" or the Millennium.

anything specifically you would like to get down and explore?

Blade

Title: Re: The Jews to be kept SAFE during the Great Tribulation
Post by: Billy Evmur on October 24, 2018, 08:55:19 pm
I have shown you where we disagree....
Title: Re: The Jews to be kept SAFE during the Great Tribulation
Post by: Bladerunner on October 25, 2018, 07:01:55 pm
I have shown you where we disagree....

After reading your last post two or three times; I have to say: Yes, we do disagree.

BUT what is in a minor disagreement! Nothing. Will catch you later Mr. Billy.

Have a great day!

Blade
Title: Re: The Jews to be kept SAFE during the Great Tribulation
Post by: patrick jane on May 15, 2019, 02:11:36 pm
Billy is too old. He has no time for this forum. He has his own thing going on. God bless him.
Title: Re: The Jews to be kept SAFE during the Great Tribulation
Post by: Billy Evmur on May 18, 2019, 03:33:08 pm
zzzzz eh? whut? who pushed my rocking chair? … gimme back my blanket
Title: Re: The Jews to be kept SAFE during the Great Tribulation
Post by: Bladerunner on May 19, 2019, 09:46:56 pm
zzzzz eh? whut? who pushed my rocking chair? … gimme back my blanket

LOL...Billy save me a rocker and a blanket too.

Blade
Title: Re: The Jews to be kept SAFE during the Great Tribulation
Post by: patrick jane on June 12, 2019, 04:58:21 am
Tell us more you two old farts.  ;D💋
Title: Re: The Jews to be kept SAFE during the Great Tribulation
Post by: Bladerunner on June 12, 2019, 10:10:42 am
Tell us more you two old farts.  ;D💋

The disagreement between Billy and I is simple. Billy literally and correctly reads that "all of Israel" will be saved. I believe the same yet, there are those verses that dictate just who is "all of Israel" during this time period.

The very definition of "remnant" to me is "what is left" from a previous whole. If I take out ten apples from a bushel, I no longer have a bushel but the remnant of a bushel. "What is left of a bushel"  (Google def:"a small remaining quantity of something/ remaining.")

In Zechariah 13:8-9.(KJV).."And it shall come to pass, that in all the land, saith the LORD, two parts therein shall be cut off and die; but the third shall be left therein.". In this chapter, the Lord is speaking of His people, Israel  before and during the millennium. Here two thirds of them will die...(Keep in mind that 6 million died in WWII, a scant one third of the population worldwide.)

v 9. "And I will bring the third part through the fire, and will refine them as silver is refined, and will try them as gold is tried: they shall call on my name, and I will hear them: I will say, It is my people: and they shall say, The LORD is my God."

Here we are told that He will bring the surviving 1/3 of Israel through a cleansing fire (Great Tribulation , Rev 12). 

These are and will be the remnant of Israel.... "All of Israel"

Blade







Title: Re: The Jews to be kept SAFE during the Great Tribulation
Post by: patrick jane on June 29, 2019, 11:21:58 am
Good thread.
Title: Re: The Jews to be kept SAFE during the Great Tribulation
Post by: patrick jane on July 11, 2019, 05:55:43 am
Good thread.
Simply amazing.
Title: Re: The Jews to be kept SAFE during the Great Tribulation
Post by: Billy Evmur on April 03, 2020, 10:01:36 am
Tell us more you two old farts.  ;D 💋

The disagreement between Billy and I is simple. Billy literally and correctly reads that "all of Israel" will be saved. I believe the same yet, there are those verses that dictate just who is "all of Israel" during this time period.

The very definition of "remnant" to me is "what is left" from a previous whole. If I take out ten apples from a bushel, I no longer have a bushel but the remnant of a bushel. "What is left of a bushel"  (Google def:"a small remaining quantity of something/ remaining.")

In Zechariah 13:8-9.(KJV).."And it shall come to pass, that in all the land, saith the LORD, two parts therein shall be cut off and die; but the third shall be left therein.". In this chapter, the Lord is speaking of His people, Israel  before and during the millennium. Here two thirds of them will die...(Keep in mind that 6 million died in WWII, a scant one third of the population worldwide.)

v 9. "And I will bring the third part through the fire, and will refine them as silver is refined, and will try them as gold is tried: they shall call on my name, and I will hear them: I will say, It is my people: and they shall say, The LORD is my God."

Here we are told that He will bring the surviving 1/3 of Israel through a cleansing fire (Great Tribulation , Rev 12). 

These are and will be the remnant of Israel.... "All of Israel"

Blade


You begin in Zechariah 13 v 8


Verse 7 says
Awake O sword against My Shepherd and against the man who is My fellow saith the Lord of hosts, smite the Shepherd and the sheep will be scattered and I will turn My hand against the little ones


verse and it shall come to pass that in all the land saith the Lord 2 parts shall be cut off and die but the 1/3 shall be left therein.


So when was the Shepherd smitten and the sheep scattered?


John says the prophecy was fulfilled at the cross.
Title: Re: The Jews to be kept SAFE during the Great Tribulation
Post by: Bladerunner on April 03, 2020, 03:12:43 pm
Tell us more you two old farts.  ;D 💋

The disagreement between Billy and I is simple. Billy literally and correctly reads that "all of Israel" will be saved. I believe the same yet, there are those verses that dictate just who is "all of Israel" during this time period.

The very definition of "remnant" to me is "what is left" from a previous whole. If I take out ten apples from a bushel, I no longer have a bushel but the remnant of a bushel. "What is left of a bushel"  (Google def:"a small remaining quantity of something/ remaining.")

In Zechariah 13:8-9.(KJV).."And it shall come to pass, that in all the land, saith the LORD, two parts therein shall be cut off and die; but the third shall be left therein.". In this chapter, the Lord is speaking of His people, Israel  before and during the millennium. Here two thirds of them will die...(Keep in mind that 6 million died in WWII, a scant one third of the population worldwide.)

v 9. "And I will bring the third part through the fire, and will refine them as silver is refined, and will try them as gold is tried: they shall call on my name, and I will hear them: I will say, It is my people: and they shall say, The LORD is my God."

Here we are told that He will bring the surviving 1/3 of Israel through a cleansing fire (Great Tribulation , Rev 12). 

These are and will be the remnant of Israel.... "All of Israel"

Blade


You begin in Zechariah 13 v 8


Verse 7 says
Awake O sword against My Shepherd and against the man who is My fellow saith the Lord of hosts, smite the Shepherd and the sheep will be scattered and I will turn My hand against the little ones


verse and it shall come to pass that in all the land saith the Lord 2 parts shall be cut off and die but the 1/3 shall be left therein.


So when was the Shepherd smitten and the sheep scattered?


John says the prophecy was fulfilled at the cross.

No, John did not say that about the Cross.

Blade,
Title: Re: The Jews to be kept SAFE during the Great Tribulation
Post by: Billy Evmur on April 04, 2020, 04:15:58 am
Tell us more you two old farts.  ;D 💋

The disagreement between Billy and I is simple. Billy literally and correctly reads that "all of Israel" will be saved. I believe the same yet, there are those verses that dictate just who is "all of Israel" during this time period.

The very definition of "remnant" to me is "what is left" from a previous whole. If I take out ten apples from a bushel, I no longer have a bushel but the remnant of a bushel. "What is left of a bushel"  (Google def:"a small remaining quantity of something/ remaining.")

In Zechariah 13:8-9.(KJV).."And it shall come to pass, that in all the land, saith the LORD, two parts therein shall be cut off and die; but the third shall be left therein.". In this chapter, the Lord is speaking of His people, Israel  before and during the millennium. Here two thirds of them will die...(Keep in mind that 6 million died in WWII, a scant one third of the population worldwide.)

v 9. "And I will bring the third part through the fire, and will refine them as silver is refined, and will try them as gold is tried: they shall call on my name, and I will hear them: I will say, It is my people: and they shall say, The LORD is my God."

Here we are told that He will bring the surviving 1/3 of Israel through a cleansing fire (Great Tribulation , Rev 12). 

These are and will be the remnant of Israel.... "All of Israel"

Blade


You begin in Zechariah 13 v 8


Verse 7 says
Awake O sword against My Shepherd and against the man who is My fellow saith the Lord of hosts, smite the Shepherd and the sheep will be scattered and I will turn My hand against the little ones


verse and it shall come to pass that in all the land saith the Lord 2 parts shall be cut off and die but the 1/3 shall be left therein.


So when was the Shepherd smitten and the sheep scattered?


John says the prophecy was fulfilled at the cross.

No, John did not say that about the Cross.

Blade,


Then saith Jesus unto them "all ye will be offended because of Me this night for it is written I will smite the Shepherd and the sheep of His flock shall be scattered abroad"


I beg your pardon it was Matthew who said it, nay the Lord Himself. Matthew.26.31.


Other evangelist say when the disciples fled from the cross "this was to fulfil the scripture."

Title: Re: The Jews to be kept SAFE during the Great Tribulation
Post by: Bladerunner on April 04, 2020, 04:29:56 pm
Tell us more you two old farts.  ;D 💋

The disagreement between Billy and I is simple. Billy literally and correctly reads that "all of Israel" will be saved. I believe the same yet, there are those verses that dictate just who is "all of Israel" during this time period.

The very definition of "remnant" to me is "what is left" from a previous whole. If I take out ten apples from a bushel, I no longer have a bushel but the remnant of a bushel. "What is left of a bushel"  (Google def:"a small remaining quantity of something/ remaining.")

In Zechariah 13:8-9.(KJV).."And it shall come to pass, that in all the land, saith the LORD, two parts therein shall be cut off and die; but the third shall be left therein.". In this chapter, the Lord is speaking of His people, Israel  before and during the millennium. Here two thirds of them will die...(Keep in mind that 6 million died in WWII, a scant one third of the population worldwide.)

v 9. "And I will bring the third part through the fire, and will refine them as silver is refined, and will try them as gold is tried: they shall call on my name, and I will hear them: I will say, It is my people: and they shall say, The LORD is my God."

Here we are told that He will bring the surviving 1/3 of Israel through a cleansing fire (Great Tribulation , Rev 12). 

These are and will be the remnant of Israel.... "All of Israel"

Blade


You begin in Zechariah 13 v 8


Verse 7 says
Awake O sword against My Shepherd and against the man who is My fellow saith the Lord of hosts, smite the Shepherd and the sheep will be scattered and I will turn My hand against the little ones


verse and it shall come to pass that in all the land saith the Lord 2 parts shall be cut off and die but the 1/3 shall be left therein.


So when was the Shepherd smitten and the sheep scattered?


John says the prophecy was fulfilled at the cross.

No, John did not say that about the Cross.

Blade,


Then saith Jesus unto them "all ye will be offended because of Me this night for it is written I will smite the Shepherd and the sheep of His flock shall be scattered abroad"


I beg your pardon it was Matthew who said it, nay the Lord Himself. Matthew.26.31.


Other evangelist say when the disciples fled from the cross "this was to fulfil the scripture."

Billy, Jesus was speaking to his apostles right after the last supper... The Shepard is himself and the apostles are the sheep....OH MY.....read the context. PLEASE....you are way off

Blade
Title: Re: The Jews to be kept SAFE during the Great Tribulation
Post by: Billy Evmur on April 05, 2020, 05:04:49 pm
Read what scripture says "this was to fulfil scripture"
Title: Re: The Jews to be kept SAFE during the Great Tribulation
Post by: Bladerunner on April 06, 2020, 07:14:44 pm
Read what scripture says "this was to fulfil scripture"

I tried???

Blade