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Christian Theology with DOUG and TED T. => Biblical Pre-Conception Existence Theology (PCE) => Topic started by: guest58 on July 13, 2019, 01:53:34 pm
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JOHN'S BEGINNING
For another take on John's understanding of pre-existence...
This category has to do with the apostle John's use of the word beginning in his first letter:
1 John 1:1 That which was from the beginning… the Word of life.
This introduction is very similar to the one John used in his gospel, which begins with: In the beginning was the Word. I believe that both refer to the same time, and that this time is synonymous with the time in Genesis 1:1 In the beginning. Thus these three references refer to the time before (or at the front of) the six days of the creation of the world.
1 John 2:7 I write no new commandment unto you, but an old commandment which ye had from the beginning. The old commandment is the word which ye have heard from the beginning. I can not help but think that John was alluding to Isaiah 40:21 Do you not know? HAVE YOU NOT HEARD? HAS IT NOT BEEN TOLD YOU FROM THE BEGINNING? Have you not understood SINCE THE EARTH WAS FOUNDED? which we looked at before. If he is not alluding to Isaiah, he certainly is referring to the same truth in my opinion.
1 John 2:14 I have written unto you, fathers, because ye have known Him [that is] from the beginning. It probably is not necessary, but for the last time, that is is not in the Greek text. Therefore, in Greek, it reads, known Him from the beginning.
1 John 2:24 Let that therefore abide in you, which ye have heard from the beginning. If that which ye have heard from the beginning shall remain in you, ye shall continue in the Son, and in the Father. It should be noted that in the Bible, the beginning usually refers to all the time and events that happened before Genesis 1:2, that is, the time when the angels were created and the rebellion in Paradise took place.
1 John 3:8...for the devil sinneth from the beginning.
Jamieson, Fausset and Brown's commentary says: "sinneth from the beginning - from the time that sin began; from the time that he became what he is, the devil.” This must be around the same time as In the beginning of Genesis 1:1. At least, it can not be much after.
1 John 3:11 For this is the message that ye heard from the beginning, that we should love one another.
I believe that John is referring to the loving purpose GOD has for each of us. 1 John 3:23 And this is His commandment, That we should believe on the name of His Son, Jesus Christ, and love one another, as He gave us commandment. According to2:7, we heard this commandment from the beginning.
Conclusion for John's Beginning.
When the word beginning has to do with Jesus or the devil, it means around the same time as Genesis 1:1, that is, before or at the beginning of the six day creation (depending how one translates the “was - became” in Genesis 1:2).
Are we really warranted in redefining it whenever it refers to us? I know that it has been redefined to fit in with the traditional presuppositions regarding the creation of our spirit, but does this not constitute a twisting or taking Scripture out of context?
According to preconception theology, each of these references, by the same author, in the same letter, has the same meaning.
To my mind, this is much superior to two definitions of the same word, in the same letter, by the same author.
Why did John not use two different words if he meant two different times? I do not think that John was mixed up. In fact, I think he knew very well exactly what he was saying. He seems to be very good at saying it over, and over, and over, and over…
-
JOHN'S BEGINNING
For another take on John's understanding of pre-existence...
This category has to do with the apostle John's use of the word beginning in his first letter:
1 John 1:1 That which was from the beginning… the Word of life.
This introduction is very similar to the one John used in his gospel, which begins with: In the beginning was the Word. I believe that both refer to the same time, and that this time is synonymous with the time in Genesis 1:1 In the beginning. Thus these three references refer to the time before (or at the front of) the six days of the creation of the world.
1 John 2:7 I write no new commandment unto you, but an old commandment which ye had from the beginning. The old commandment is the word which ye have heard from the beginning. I can not help but think that John was alluding to Isaiah 40:21 Do you not know? HAVE YOU NOT HEARD? HAS IT NOT BEEN TOLD YOU FROM THE BEGINNING? Have you not understood SINCE THE EARTH WAS FOUNDED? which we looked at before. If he is not alluding to Isaiah, he certainly is referring to the same truth in my opinion.
1 John 2:14 I have written unto you, fathers, because ye have known Him [that is] from the beginning. It probably is not necessary, but for the last time, that is is not in the Greek text. Therefore, in Greek, it reads, known Him from the beginning.
1 John 2:24 Let that therefore abide in you, which ye have heard from the beginning. If that which ye have heard from the beginning shall remain in you, ye shall continue in the Son, and in the Father. It should be noted that in the Bible, the beginning usually refers to all the time and events that happened before Genesis 1:2, that is, the time when the angels were created and the rebellion in Paradise took place.
1 John 3:8...for the devil sinneth from the beginning.
Jamieson, Fausset and Brown's commentary says: "sinneth from the beginning - from the time that sin began; from the time that he became what he is, the devil.” This must be around the same time as In the beginning of Genesis 1:1. At least, it can not be much after.
1 John 3:11 For this is the message that ye heard from the beginning, that we should love one another.
I believe that John is referring to the loving purpose GOD has for each of us. 1 John 3:23 And this is His commandment, That we should believe on the name of His Son, Jesus Christ, and love one another, as He gave us commandment. According to2:7, we heard this commandment from the beginning.
Conclusion for John's Beginning.
When the word beginning has to do with Jesus or the devil, it means around the same time as Genesis 1:1, that is, before or at the beginning of the six day creation (depending how one translates the “was - became” in Genesis 1:2).
Are we really warranted in redefining it whenever it refers to us? I know that it has been redefined to fit in with the traditional presuppositions regarding the creation of our spirit, but does this not constitute a twisting or taking Scripture out of context?
According to preconception theology, each of these references, by the same author, in the same letter, has the same meaning.
To my mind, this is much superior to two definitions of the same word, in the same letter, by the same author.
Why did John not use two different words if he meant two different times? I do not think that John was mixed up. In fact, I think he knew very well exactly what he was saying. He seems to be very good at saying it over, and over, and over, and over…
Be very careful for John one of two "beloved" of GOD...
Blade
-
JOHN'S BEGINNING
For another take on John's understanding of pre-existence...
This category has to do with the apostle John's use of the word beginning in his first letter:
1 John 1:1 That which was from the beginning… the Word of life.
This introduction is very similar to the one John used in his gospel, which begins with: In the beginning was the Word. I believe that both refer to the same time, and that this time is synonymous with the time in Genesis 1:1 In the beginning. Thus these three references refer to the time before (or at the front of) the six days of the creation of the world.
1 John 2:7 I write no new commandment unto you, but an old commandment which ye had from the beginning. The old commandment is the word which ye have heard from the beginning. I can not help but think that John was alluding to Isaiah 40:21 Do you not know? HAVE YOU NOT HEARD? HAS IT NOT BEEN TOLD YOU FROM THE BEGINNING? Have you not understood SINCE THE EARTH WAS FOUNDED? which we looked at before. If he is not alluding to Isaiah, he certainly is referring to the same truth in my opinion.
1 John 2:14 I have written unto you, fathers, because ye have known Him [that is] from the beginning. It probably is not necessary, but for the last time, that is is not in the Greek text. Therefore, in Greek, it reads, known Him from the beginning.
1 John 2:24 Let that therefore abide in you, which ye have heard from the beginning. If that which ye have heard from the beginning shall remain in you, ye shall continue in the Son, and in the Father. It should be noted that in the Bible, the beginning usually refers to all the time and events that happened before Genesis 1:2, that is, the time when the angels were created and the rebellion in Paradise took place.
1 John 3:8...for the devil sinneth from the beginning.
Jamieson, Fausset and Brown's commentary says: "sinneth from the beginning - from the time that sin began; from the time that he became what he is, the devil.” This must be around the same time as In the beginning of Genesis 1:1. At least, it can not be much after.
1 John 3:11 For this is the message that ye heard from the beginning, that we should love one another.
I believe that John is referring to the loving purpose GOD has for each of us. 1 John 3:23 And this is His commandment, That we should believe on the name of His Son, Jesus Christ, and love one another, as He gave us commandment. According to2:7, we heard this commandment from the beginning.
Conclusion for John's Beginning.
When the word beginning has to do with Jesus or the devil, it means around the same time as Genesis 1:1, that is, before or at the beginning of the six day creation (depending how one translates the “was - became” in Genesis 1:2).
Are we really warranted in redefining it whenever it refers to us? I know that it has been redefined to fit in with the traditional presuppositions regarding the creation of our spirit, but does this not constitute a twisting or taking Scripture out of context?
According to preconception theology, each of these references, by the same author, in the same letter, has the same meaning.
To my mind, this is much superior to two definitions of the same word, in the same letter, by the same author.
Why did John not use two different words if he meant two different times? I do not think that John was mixed up. In fact, I think he knew very well exactly what he was saying. He seems to be very good at saying it over, and over, and over, and over…
I agree with this - great post Ted
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:D