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Theology and Philosophy => Christian Theology => Topic started by: Olde Tymer on September 24, 2018, 08:27:30 am

Title: Hell's Population Clock
Post by: Olde Tymer on September 24, 2018, 08:27:30 am
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According to Jesus Christ's testimony as a credible expert witness in all matters pertaining to the afterlife; most of the world's responsible souls haven't been making it to safety when they cross over to the other side.

● Luke 13:22-24 . . And he went through the cities and villages, teaching, and journeying toward Jerusalem. Then said one unto him, Lord, are there few that be saved? And he said unto them, strive to enter in at the strait gate: for many, I say unto you, will seek to enter in, and shall not be able.

● Matt 7:13-14 . . Enter ye in at the strait gate: for wide is the gate, and broad is the way, that leadeth to destruction, and many there be which go in thereat: because strait is the gate, and narrow is the way, which leadeth unto life, and few there be that find it.

● Matt 22:14 . . For many are called, but few are chosen.

Webster's defines "many" as consisting of, or amounting to, a large but indefinite number; while "few" is defined as consisting of, or amounting to, only a small number; viz: relative to many then, few is the lesser. Bear with me while I flesh this out.

According to the US Census Bureau: as of Sep 24, 2018 @ 09:56 am New York Time, the United States population was approximately 328,656,672 with a death rate of approximately one every 12 seconds; which translates to an average of 7,200 American deaths of all ages, races, and genders during just one 24-hour calendar day.

According to 2009 US Census data; roughly 27.3% of America's daily deaths are under the age of 19, which would indicate that approximately 5,234 of the current daily death rate per 24 hours are adults.

Giving the "many" the benefit of the doubt by limiting their maximum percentage to 51%, would indicate a minimum of 2,669 American adults transferring to perdition every day: which translates to roughly 111 per hour.

That's a conservative estimate as Christ didn't really specify exact percentages to represent the quantities of "few" and "many". But just think: by the time CBS completes its half hour evening news report, a bare-bones minimum of 55 Americans become new arrivals in the fiery sector of the netherworld.

Using the ratio of 2,669 condemned souls per 328,656,672 population: extrapolating the number of condemned souls worldwide from a currently estimated global population of 7,501,122,972 people, would suggest something like 60,916 new arrivals in the fiery sector of the netherworld every 24 hours; which translates to approximately 2,538 global arrivals every sixty minutes on the clock.

That rate would fill Yankee Stadium's 51,800 seats to capacity in roughly 20 hours and 24 minutes. In other words: if the world's daily number of condemned souls started filing into the stadium at 06:00 am this morning, then by 02:24 am tomorrow, the stadium would be full to capacity.

Christmas and New Year are even worse. A study done of 26 years of death certificates shows that coronary fatalities are, on average, 11.9% higher on those days than any other days of the year; with non-heart deaths spiking to 12.2% higher.

The hell I'm describing never closes; no, not at all: it's open for business 24/7/365 nonstop and indifferent to global warming, Wall Street crashes, massive layoffs, outsourcing, tariffs, school shootings, terrorism, tsunamis, earthquakes, hurricanes, storm surges, nuclear meltdowns, air, water, and soil pollution, a mission to Mars, freeway pile-ups, brown-outs, threatened species, the price of oil, drug cartels, LGBT marriage, student debt, GMO, trade deficits, Obamacare, protests, North Korean nukes, Federal debt, factory recalls, overpopulation, desertification, genocides, revolutions, civil wars, acid rain, road rage, oil spills, conscious decoupling, ISIS, blood diamonds, fracking, twerking, and/or President Donald Trump's tweets.

If classical Christianity's perception of Jesus Christ and the hereafter is correct; then it's apparent that people never stop cascading into the netherworld's dungeons in an endless procession like the unbelievable millions of poultry broilers passing annually through Tyson chicken-processing plants on their way to Wendy's, McDonalds, Carl's Junior, Jack in the Box, Burger King, Chic-fil-A, KFC, A&W, Arby's, Dairy Queen, Taco Bell, et al; and to supermarkets and restaurants all over the USA and wherever else Tyson vends its meats. The slaughtering and the butchering never stop.
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Title: Re: Hell's Population Clock
Post by: Olde Tymer on September 26, 2018, 08:59:47 am
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Through me; the way to the eternal city.
Through me; the way to eternal sadness.
Through me; the way to lost people.

Justice moved my supreme maker:
I was shaped by divine power,
By highest wisdom, and by primal love.

Before me, nothing was created
That is not eternal: and eternally I endure.
Abandon all hope, you that enter here.


The Divine Comedy
by Dante Alighieri
Inferno: canto 3, v.1-9


Dante's poetic epic is called a comedy because it has a happy ending as opposed to a tragedy; at least for Dante anyway. The souls he and Virgil pass along the way through the Inferno portion of Dante's odyssey will never, nor anon, have a happy ending; hence the sign above the entrance to his netherworld: "Abandon all hope, you that enter here."

Webster's defines "despair' as: to no longer have any hope or belief that a situation will improve or change. Well; down in the Inferno section of Dante's concept, despair is a way of life.

One of the hardest concepts to get across is the despair that people in hell must feel in knowing that their situation is a sealed fate with no hope of relief. Dante's odyssey, though of course fiction, is useful for that purpose; especially when it's accompanied by illustrations painted by Gustave Doré.

Jesus warned people that they'd be better off facing eternity with their hands and their feet amputated, and their eyes gouged out, then to end up in a hell he called geena; a much worse place than haides. So in my estimation, Dante's descriptions, and Gustave's paintings, though disturbing enough in themselves, aren't sufficient to impress just how terrible the ultimate hell really is.


POP CLOCK UPDATE: 2 days have elapsed since beginning the thread. If the figures in post #1 are in the ball park, then something like 121,832 new arrivals have checked into the fiery sector of hades since Sept 24, 2018.
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Title: Re: Hell's Population Clock
Post by: Olde Tymer on September 28, 2018, 09:27:51 am
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People have been filtering into perdition not only since the time of Christ, but since before the Step Pyramid of Djoser, and even before the Flood. I won't speculate how many years that might be, but h.sapiens is thought by some to have achieved full behavioral modernity something like 50,000 years ago. (There's new findings suggesting that human existence goes as far back as 150-300,000 years) Anyway; whether that extends clear on back to Adam and Eve I have no clue; but just think: if it does, then Cain and others from his era have been down in the netherworld all this time.

It's difficult for the human mind to appreciate 50,000 years let alone 300,000. I've been on the Earth for just 74, and I've noticed that my childhood is so far in the past to me now as to seem more like a fantasy than a memory. But you know; when you're talking about eternity, 50,000 years isn't even a drop in the bucket. If it were a drop in the bucket, it would be a bucket with no bottom; which is roughly akin to the futility of a gnat attempting to drink up the Atlantic ocean.

But just think: time stands still in hell: it's for the now; it's an existence. People who arrived there yesterday didn't begin doing time in jail like Lindsay Lohan expecting to get out some day; nor is perdition a temporary tour of duty like shipping out to Afghanistan. No, people in hell are in it as perpetual residents; they're in a rut.

They go year, after year, after year, after year, with no relief from the discomfort: no vacations, no recreation, no reading materials, and no hobbies-- there's absolutely nothing to do but reminisce. The mental atrophy, and the boredom that must result from that kind of mindless existence is beyond estimation.

In life, everybody enjoys God's blessings; even the really bad people. We're all breathing fresh air, basking in sunshine, drinking cool water, savoring tasty foods, listening to birds chirp, star gazing at night, throwing snow balls at each other in winter, river rafting, fishing, snow skiing, tending gardens, pruning shrubs, greeting friends during the holidays, spending days with grandkids; and all that sort of thing. In the Bible's hell, there are no blessings of any kind at all: only perpetual sadness, vexation, despair, and want.

In hell's unruly society; it's reasonable to expect quarrels, bickering, hard feelings, vendettas, rivalry, selfishness, insensitivity, irritation, aggravation, and ugly words exchanged between people. Is there really any good reason to be courteous and/or respect your fellow man's human rights in the Bible's hell; or to be kind, forgiving, affable, genial, courteous, cordial, charitable, altruistic, tolerant, generous, and patient? I was once discussing the netherworld with a co-worker and he remarked: "Hell won't be so bad; I'll have plenty of friends down there". Yes, he probably will have lots of friends in hell; but I really don't think he should count on them being friendly.

And the din: think of the volume of noise down there with all the wailing and sobbing, and the screams, shrieks, yelps, howls, and gnashing teeth. I can only imagine how annoying it must be in hell with its thousands and millions of people making all that kind of racket.

But just imagine bringing with you a craving for tobacco with none available. Or longing for a cocktail with no liquor in sight. A desire for music, with no way to produce it. A skill for writing, with no pen and paper. Yearning for a walk out in nature, with no world to do it in.

People in hell will never again smell a sea breeze, sit in the shade of a tree, take deep breaths of mountain-fresh air, play at sports, hear a bird chirp, see a sunset, watch a lunar eclipse, jog in the park, strum a guitar, enjoy a Christmas dinner with loved ones; nor make little pigs of themselves gobbling barbecued spare ribs and corn on the 4th of July.

Sports and recreation are gone: no more World Series, no more Super Bowl, no more Olympics, no more Las Vegas, no more Indian casinos, no more lottery, no more Lego World, no more Sea World, no more NASCAR, no more golf, no more surfing, et al.

No baths, no showers, no sleep, no TV, no radio, no iPods, no computers, no Twitter, no texting, no FaceBook, no Instagram, no YouTube, no MySpace, no internet, no clean sheets, no breakfast, no lunch, and no dinner. No snacks, no gum, no candy, no flowers, no parks, no rivers, no snow, no seasons, no picnics, no malls, no fast food, no trades, no careers, no trendy fashions, no jewelry, no cosmetics, no concerts, no operas, and no hobbies; absolutely nothing of this world that brings people the pleasures and the satisfactions of just being alive.


POP CLOCK UPDATE: 4 days have elapsed since beginning the thread. If the figures in post #1 are in the ball park, then something like 243,664 new arrivals have checked into the fiery sector of hades since Sept 24, 2018.
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Title: Re: Hell's Population Clock
Post by: Olde Tymer on September 30, 2018, 12:36:17 pm
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● Jonah 1:17 . . Jonah was in the belly of a fish for three days and three nights

Q: Was Jonah alive in the fish?

A: Yes. (Jonah 2:1)

Q: The whole time?

A: No.

At some point in his nautical adventure Jonah went to a place called sheol (Jonah 2:2) which he sited at the bottoms of the mountains. (Jonah 2:6)

Well; the bottoms of the mountains aren't located in the tummies of fish, no; they're located down deep in the earth. So, the only way that Jonah could possibly be at the bottoms of the mountains while in the belly of a fish at the same time was for the man and his body to part company and go their separate ways.

Just before being cast ashore, Jonah prayed thus:

● Jonah 2:6 . .To the bottoms of the mountains I went down. As for the earth, its bars were upon me for time indefinite. But out of the pit you proceeded to bring up my life, O Jehovah my God.

The Hebrew word for "pit" in that verse is the very same word for pit in Ps 16:8-10; which Acts 2:25-31 verifies is speaking of putrefaction. In other words: Jonah 2:6 tells of Jonah's resurrection. (There's reason to believe that Jonah was already dead from drowning in the sea's depths before the fish showed up to swallow him.)

Christ underwent the very same afterlife experience as Jonah's. The only real difference between the two was that Christ's grave was in a rock while Jonah's grave was in a fish.

The key points in their experiences are that both were dead, both went to the bottoms of the mountains while their corpse reposed in a grave, and both were resurrected within three days and three nights. (Matt 12:40)

Q: What does the story of Jonah have to do with hell?

A: It's widely believed that when people die they cease to exist. Well; were that belief a fact; then Jesus would've ceased to exist when he passed away on the cross. As a result: he would not have been resurrected back to life, instead, Jesus would've been created back to life. Jonah's experience proves that Jesus continued to exist out of body when he pass away; and if he and Jonah did, then everyone else does too.


POP CLOCK UPDATE: 6 days have elapsed since beginning the thread. If the figures in post #1 are in the ball park, then something like 365,496 new arrivals have checked into the fiery sector of hades since Sept 24, 2018.
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Title: Re: Hell's Population Clock
Post by: Olde Tymer on October 03, 2018, 07:48:00 am
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● Ps 146:3-4 . . Put not your trust in princes, nor in the son of man, in whom there is no help. His breath goeth forth, he returneth to his earth; in that very day his thoughts perish.

Some people honestly believe the passage above teaches that people cease to exist when they pass away; but were their belief true, then Christ would've ceased to exist when he passed away on the cross and in order to restore the Lord's body back to life, it would've been necessary to create him back to existence. No; I'm pretty sure it's saying something very different. Here's a much better way to say it.

"When their breathing stops, they return to the earth, and in a moment all their plans come to an end."

Consider all those people who perished in the World Trade Center, in the Japan and Indonesia tsunamis, and the Haiti earthquake. None of them woke that day planning on it being their last on earth. No, on the contrary; they had people to see, places to go, and things to do: but before the day ended; whatever was on their minds lost its importance-- their priorities went right out the window and became no more significant than green cheese on the moon.

All their plans, their dreams, their schedules, their appointments, their schemes, their problems, their aspirations, and their loves went right down the tubes as they were suddenly confronted with a whole new reality to cope with.

While preparing for a new world tour, Michael Jackson died in his sleep. As a result; his tour wrapped on the spot.

When my eldest nephew was paroled from prison; he quit drinking, and began going to college with the goal towards becoming a counselor. For 2½ years all went well. His parole officer was happy, and my nephew was on track and getting good grades. His future looked assured. And then on the morning of Sept 25, 2015, he dropped dead to the floor of natural causes. As a result; his college education, and his hope to become a counselor, dropped dead to the floor right with him.


POP CLOCK UPDATE: 9 days have elapsed since beginning the thread. If the figures in post #1 are in the ball park, then something like 548,244 new arrivals have checked into the fiery sector of hades since Sept 24, 2018.
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Title: Re: Hell's Population Clock
Post by: Olde Tymer on October 05, 2018, 07:06:02 am
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Here in America, even the worst among the worst have the right to a lawyer, and if they can't afford one, the system will appoint a public defender for them.

But in hell; people are abandoned. For example: the names of Abraham and Lazarus are given in Luke 16:19-31, but the rich man's name isn't given. He's a forgotten man; but not me.

● Rom 8:33-34 . . Who will bring any charge against those whom God has chosen? It is God who justifies. Who is he that condemns? Christ Jesus who died? More than that, who was raised to life; who is at the right hand of God and is also interceding for us?

Thanks to Christ, I won't have to stand before God alone; but that nameless rich man? He will.


POP CLOCK UPDATE: 11 days have elapsed since beginning the thread. If the figures in post #1 are in the ball park, then something like 670,076 new arrivals have checked into the fiery sector of hades since Sept 24, 2018.
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Title: Re: Hell's Population Clock
Post by: Olde Tymer on October 07, 2018, 08:47:18 am
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Creeping up the blind side, shinning up the wall,
stealing through the dark of the night.
Climbing through a window, stepping to the floor
checking to the left and the right.
Picking up the pieces, putting them away;
something doesn't feel quite right.

Help me someone, let me out of here.
Then out of the dark was suddenly heard:
Welcome to the Home by the Sea

Coming out the woodwork, through the open door,
pushing from above and below.
Shadows with no substance, in the shape of men;
round and down and sideways they go.
Adrift without direction, eyes that hold despair
then as one they sigh and they moan:

Help us someone, let us out of here.
Living here so long undisturbed,
dreaming of the time we were free
so many years ago
before the time when we first heard:
Welcome to the Home by the Sea

Sit down . . Sit down
As we relive our lives in what we tell you

Images of sorrow, pictures of delight
things that go to make up a life.
Endless days of summer, longer nights of gloom
waiting for the morning light.
Scenes of unimportance, photos in a frame
things that go to make up a life.

Sit down . . Sit down
Cause you won't get away,
no; with us you will stay
for the rest of your days.
So sit down as we relive our lives in what we tell you.
Let us relive our lives in what we tell you.


Home By The Sea
Genesis, 1983
Phil Collins, Tony Banks, Mike Rutherford


The lyrics of that song are useful for depicting how one of the few thing that some people have to do down in the netherworld to help pass the time is tell each other about their previous lives. There is, of course, nothing to tell about their lives down there since the colloquialism "get a life" is a non sequitur in that place. Nobody has a life; nor any hope of getting one.

POP CLOCK UPDATE: 13 days have elapsed since beginning the thread. If the figures in post #1 are in the ball park, then something like 791,908 new arrivals have checked into the fiery sector of hades since Sept 24, 2018.
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Title: Re: Hell's Population Clock
Post by: Olde Tymer on October 09, 2018, 10:14:04 am
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Saturday, June 27, 2010, a 6-month-old baby girl was killed and her mother seriously injured when the pair were struck by a falling tree branch in New York City's Central Park Zoo. The girl's father was taking their picture near the sea lion exhibit when a branch above them suddenly snapped off and fell.

Tuesday, July 3, 2007; nineteen year-old Ramiro Gonzalez was returning home to Nyssa Oregon from a week-end honeymoon in northern California with his bride Idalia asleep in the back seat when their 1997 Pontiac Grand Am hit a cow twenty miles east of Burns. The Pontiac went off the road, through a fence, and burst into flames. Idalia escaped with only minor injuries, but Ramiro died at the Ste. Charles Medical Center in Bend the very next day.

Ramiro and his bride didn't get to live in a home of their own for even one single minute of their marriage-- never had a baby, never joined the PTA, never saved for college, never went to ballet lessons, nor to soccer or little league, never went on family picnics, never took home movies and photos at Christmas, Easter, or birthdays, never went to the beach and built sand castles --no, their entire future, and all their dreams of family life, were shattered in an instant by a lame-brained bovine; and Ramiro wasn't even 20 years old yet. He could've lived another fifty years.

March 20, 2008; fifty-seven year old Judy Kay Zagorski, of Pigeon, Michigan, was sitting in the front seat of her father's boat going 25 knots on the Atlantic Ocean side of Vaca Key in Florida, when a Spotted Eagle Ray, with a wingspan of 5 to 6 feet; leaped up out of the water-- for who knows what reason --and collided with Zagorski, knocking her backwards onto the deck of the boat. She died from the impact. Judy's sister, standing next to her, wasn't injured.

On a November morning in 1998, Alan Pakula climbed into his Volvo station wagon and began the 100-mile drive from Manhattan to his Long Island house. The acclaimed movie director of Sophie's Choice, All The President's Men, and The Pelican Brief, had made that trip countless times with no incident.

As the 70 year-old Pakula neared exit 49 on the Long Island Expressway just before noon, the tires of a vehicle ahead of him flipped a 7-foot piece of steel rod into the air. Within seconds, the rod shot through Pakula's windshield, smashing into his forehead, killing him almost instantly.

Death often comes when people least expect it. As a rule, they don't usually get up in the morning planning it to be their last day on earth. The 169,752 killed, and 127,294 listed as missing in more than eleven countries by the tsunami of 2004, were taken by surprise, and given no warning it was to be their last day on earth.

The 2,829 people who perished in a terrorist attack on the World Trade Center on September 11, 2001, and the 189 who died in the Pentagon, didn't go in to work expecting their lives to end before lunch that day. No, people's lives often end while they still have obligations and commitments, aspirations, things to do, places to go, and people to see; when a car accident, train wreck, act of nature, plane crash, crime, heart attack, or stroke puts an abrupt end to every plan they ever made.

Tuesday, Jan 12, 2010, a 7.0 earthquake struck Port au Prince Haiti right out of the blue subsequently causing the loss of more than 200,000 lives. A similar act of nature on March 11, 2011, left 25,000 dead and/or missing in Japan.

Okeechobee woman Dawn Johnston, 38, was killed Wednesday June 30, 2010 after part of a portable toilet crashed through her car's windshield. Dawn was driving south on SR 15 shortly after 11 a.m. when two portable toilets fell from the trailer of a pickup truck traveling north,. The portable toilets shattered when they hit the road, and a piece of one of them crashed through the woman's windshield, striking her. Johnston's car then veered off the road and collided with a tree.

A rain-saturated hillside above the Stillaguamish River on the outskirts of the rural town of Oso in the State of Washington gave way March 22, 2014 leaving behind a current death toll of 41 souls. The landslide happened to suddenly and so rapidly that nobody saw it coming and/or had the slightest chance of getting out of the way. Listed among the dead and missing was a four-month old infant.

Freak incidents like those listed above can happen to anybody in the form of a stray bullet from a drive-by, lightening strike, gas explosion, choking on a piece of meat, electrocution, earthquake, a drunk driver, a fall in the bath tub; bricks dropped from an overpass, a school shooting, or any number of out-of-the-blue surprises.

Because of the uncertainty of tomorrow, people need to start thinking about the afterlife today, while they have the chance; rather than risk being caught off guard by sudden death when there will be no time to think; and they find themselves suddenly thrust into the unseen world quite by surprise.

● Ecc 9:12 . . No man knows when his hour will come: as fish are caught in a cruel net, or birds are taken in a snare, so men are trapped by evil times that fall unexpectedly upon them.


POP CLOCK UPDATE: 15 days have elapsed since beginning the thread. If the figures in post #1 are in the ball park, then something like 913,740 new arrivals have checked into the fiery sector of hades since Sept 24, 2018.
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Title: Re: Hell's Population Clock
Post by: Olde Tymer on October 11, 2018, 11:44:02 am
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According to Matt 10:28, the body and the soul are perishable. However; though the body is perishable by any means, the soul is perishable only by divine means; i.e. the deaths of body and soul aren't necessarily simultaneous, viz: the soul lives on until such a time as God decides to give it either a thumb up or a thumb down.


POP CLOCK UPDATE: 17 days have elapsed since beginning the thread. If the figures in post #1 are in the ball park, then something like 1,035,572 new arrivals have checked into the fiery sector of hades since Sept 24, 2018.
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Title: Re: Hell's Population Clock
Post by: Olde Tymer on October 13, 2018, 06:53:16 am
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● Mark 9:47-48 . . If your eye causes you to sin, gouge it out. It is better to enter the kingdom of God half blind than to have two eyes and be thrown into hell; where the worm never dies and the fire never goes out.

The "hell" in that passage is a different Greek word than the "hell" of Luke 16:19-31. That one is haides (hah'-dace) which is an afterlife sphere where all the dead go; both the good dead and the bad dead regardless of age, race, color, gender or religious preference. This word here in Mark is geena (gheh'-en-nah) which is where only the bad dead will end up some day: likely the lake of brimstone depicted at Rev 20:11-15

Anyway; Christ's instructions didn't reveal anything new. He simply reiterated information that had already been released by an Old Testament prophet roughly 700 years before.

● Isa 66:22-24 . . From one New Moon to another and from one Sabbath to another, all mankind will come and bow down before me-- speaks the Lord. And they will go out and look upon the dead bodies of those who rebelled against Me: their worm will not die, nor will their fire be quenched, and they will be loathsome to all mankind.

That rather ghastly scene depicts a sort of tourist attraction similar to the La Brea Tar Pits museum in Los Angeles where the remains of prehistoric creatures, excavated from ancient asphalt deposits, are on display.

A worm that thrives in flame is pretty amazing, but not unreasonable. The 4-inch Pompeii worm lives in sea water temperatures of 176° Fahrenheit; hot enough to kill salmonella and sanitize an egg. So I guess if God could create a worm like the Pompeii, it shouldn't be too difficult for Him to create worms that like it even warmer.

Q: The human body is organic. So then, how can it survive in flame as perpetual nourishment for those worms?

A: The laws of nature are not absolute. They were created in the first chapter of Genesis to control the behavior of created matter, and as such are easily manipulated by the one who designed them.

For example: fire totally incinerated the cities of Sodom and Gomorrah but left unscathed a desert shrub that Moses encountered in the Sinai outback while tending his father-in-law's sheep. (Ex 3:1-3)

Compare Dan 3:8-27 where a blistering hot fire didn't even so much as singe the clothing of Shadrach, Meshach, and Abed-nego while slaying the guards that threw them in the furnace.

Q: Won't the worms eventually exhaust their food supply?

A: There are incidents in the Bible where small amounts of food stuffs were miraculously multiplied. One example is 1Kgs 17:8-16 where a tiny bit of flour and oil nourished Elijah and a widow woman, and her son, for a good many days during a time of prolonged drought.

Another incident is at 2Kgs 4:1-7 where a certain widow's husband died and left her deeply in debt. God multiplied her last pot of oil sufficiently to sell enough to pay off her debts, thereby saving her two sons from slavery.

No; I'm pretty sure those worms won't need to worry about running out of human remains with which to sustain themselves.


POP CLOCK UPDATE: 19 days have elapsed since beginning the thread. If the figures in post #1 are in the ball park, then something like 1,157,404 new arrivals have checked into the fiery sector of hades since Sept 24, 2018.
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Title: Re: Hell's Population Clock
Post by: Olde Tymer on October 15, 2018, 08:29:24 am
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● Ecc 1:2-4 . . Meaningless! Futile! complains the Teacher. Utterly meaningless! Everything is meaningless. What does a man gain from all his labor at which he toils under the sun? Generations come and generations go, but the earth remains forever.

The earth is dumber than a spatula; yet easily outlives its human potentate whose IQ is infinitely greater. Take for example the great granite monuments in Yosemite Valley. Tourists to the valley come, and tourists to the valley go; and one day the grim reaper catches up with those tourists and they're gone; yet Yosemite's great stones abide decade after decade; century after century.

Most children born this day will be dead in 100 years; and Yosemite won't even notice. Though a child born today may be intelligent enough to eventually understand quantum mechanics and play classical guitar like Andrés Segovia; yet Yosemite's sentinels-- stupid, mute, untalented, and uneducated --will easily outlast it.

● Ecc 2:15-16 . . I thought in my heart: The fate of the fool will overtake me also. What then do I gain by being intelligent? I said in my heart: This is meaningless. For the intelligent man, like the fool, will not be long remembered-- in days to come both will be forgotten. Like the fool, the intelligent man too must die.


POP CLOCK UPDATE: 21 days have elapsed since beginning the thread. If the figures in post #1 are in the ball park, then something like 1,279,236 new arrivals have checked into the fiery sector of hades since Sept 24, 2018.
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Title: Re: Hell's Population Clock
Post by: Olde Tymer on October 17, 2018, 02:13:37 pm
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Judas goats are trained for use in slaughterhouses and herd control. In stockyards, they lead sheep to slaughter; and are also used to lead other animals to specific pens and on to trucks. The term is a reference to the biblical traitor Judas Iscariot.

The phrase has also been used to describe goats utilized to locate feral goats targeted for eradication. They're usually outfitted with a transmitter, painted in red and then released. The goats then locate the remaining herds of feral goats, allowing hunters with tracking devices to find and exterminate them. The red paint marks the goat with the transmitter so the hunters know which one not to shoot.

You know what can be even worse than going to hell? Your own children following you there: and they trusted you.

Here's a sort of cute story I heard once. I don't know if it's true but I guess it's probable.

A farmer went out to the barn in the dead of night after a snowfall to sneak a pull from his liquor bottle. Just as he got to the barn door he heard something behind him. Turning, the farmer recognized his little boy coming towards him. In amazement he asked the little guy how he ever managed to find his way out to the barn in the dark. His son replied: It was easy; I walked in your footprints.

One can only imagine the anguish that parents in the netherworld must feel knowing that they inadvertently raised their children in an ideology that led them down the road to hell and all the while sincerely believing themselves doing the right thing. In other words: they actually Judas-goated their children to follow mom and dad down there. For some families, the only thing they have to look forward to in the afterlife is a sad reunion in fire and despair.


POP CLOCK UPDATE: 23 days have elapsed since beginning the thread. If the figures in post #1 are in the ball park, then something like 1,401,068 new arrivals have checked into the fiery sector of hades since Sept 24, 2018.
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Title: Re: Hell's Population Clock
Post by: Olde Tymer on October 19, 2018, 08:49:35 am
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● Luke 16:25 . . Abraham said: Son, remember

I should think that one of the negative aspects of hell is memory. How people down there retain their memories sans the brain cells they left behind with their corpse, I don't know; but they do, just as the rich man in that story is able to experience thirst sans a flesh and blood tongue.

The older one gets, the more memories they accumulate, and many of those memories haunt us with terrible regret. However, people in hell not only have to cope with their bad memories, but also the good ones too, and I should think it's remembering the good things they enjoyed in life that makes their situation only worse in the heat.

If everybody was born and raised in hell; and never once ventured out; that would be the only life they've ever known, so they wouldn't have a clue what it's like to really live. For them the old maxim "Ignorance is bliss" would certainly hold true.


POP CLOCK UPDATE: 25 days have elapsed since beginning the thread. If the figures in post #1 are in the ball park, then something like 1,522,900 new arrivals have checked into the fiery sector of hades since Sept 24, 2018.
_
Title: Re: Hell's Population Clock
Post by: Olde Tymer on October 21, 2018, 07:12:37 am
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● Gen 6:5 . . God saw that the wickedness of man was great in the earth, and that every imagination of the thoughts of his heart was only evil continually.

The thoughts of the heart are somewhat different than the thoughts that go through the mind; and are often blocked out, viz: "repressed"; defined as a mental process by which distressing thoughts, memories, or impulses that may give rise to anxiety are excluded from consciousness and left to operate in the unconscious, i.e. the subconscious which, in Freud's opinion, is a repository for socially unacceptable ideas, wishes or desires, traumatic memories, and painful emotions.

● Matt 15:19 . . Out of the heart proceed evil thoughts

So then, it's not how people's minds work that defines them, no, it's how their heart works that really defines them; and people's hearts are easily capable of hoodwinking their own consciousness.

● Jer 17:9 . .The human heart is most deceitful and desperately wicked. Who really knows how bad it is?

God is able to peer into the heart's contents. That means He will be confronting people with things about themselves that they suppressed and kept under wraps all their lives; and that's why I sometimes say only a fool would take their chances with God. They have no clue the extent of the psychological tsunami they're walking into.


POP CLOCK UPDATE: 27 days have elapsed since beginning the thread. If the figures in post #1 are in the ball park, then something like 1,644,732 new arrivals have checked into the fiery sector of hades since Sept 24, 2018.
_
Title: Re: Hell's Population Clock
Post by: Olde Tymer on October 23, 2018, 11:51:44 am
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There was a time when everyone went to the netherworld when they passed away: Jesus too because when he passed away on the cross; Jesus didn't go up, rather, he went down. (Matt 12:40, John 20:17, Acts 7:25-31).

When we take into consideration everybody who ever lived and died on this planet beginning with Adam until the day when people started going to heaven; then we're talking about a very large number of people. How did they all fit in the netherworld without overcrowding?

Well; it's evident that people exist in the afterlife as spirits. (Heb 12:22-23, 1Pet 3:18-20).

The feral man of Mark 5:1-13 and Luke 8:26-33 was possessed by a community of evil spirits who labeled themselves Legion. Webster's defines a legion as the principal unit of the Roman army comprising 3,000 to 6,000 foot soldiers with cavalry.

The legion of spirits that Christ exorcised from the man went out and possessed a herd of about 2,000 swine. That's a pretty good example of how spirits take up no room in the physical world; nor do they crowd each other. All 3,000-6,000 of those spirits managed to fit inside the bodily cargo area of just that one man.

That being the case, then the netherworld need not be a void. People can exist down there in solid rock because spirits don't need space, they just need a place.


NOTE: Any attempt to drill down to the heart of the Earth in search of the netherworld would be futile because it isn't a physical world, rather, it's a spirit world. Drilling could, and would, pass right through the very heart of the netherworld and still not find it.

POP CLOCK UPDATE: 29 days have elapsed since beginning the thread. If the figures in post #1 are in the ball park, then something like 1,766,564 new arrivals have checked into the fiery sector of hades since Sept 24, 2018.
_
Title: Re: Hell's Population Clock
Post by: Bladerunner on October 23, 2018, 07:06:24 pm
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There was a time when everyone went to the netherworld when they passed away: Jesus too because when he passed away on the cross; Jesus didn't go up, rather, he went down. (Matt 12:40, John 20:17, Acts 7:25-31).

When we take into consideration everybody who ever lived and died on this planet beginning with Adam until the day when people started going to heaven; then we're talking about a very large number of people. How did they all fit in the netherworld without overcrowding?

Well; it's evident that people exist in the afterlife as spirits. (Heb 12:22-23, 1Pet 3:18-20).

The feral man of Mark 5:1-13 and Luke 8:26-33 was possessed by a community of evil spirits who labeled themselves Legion. Webster's defines a legion as the principal unit of the Roman army comprising 3,000 to 6,000 foot soldiers with cavalry.

The legion of spirits that Christ exorcised from the man went out and possessed a herd of about 2,000 swine. That's a pretty good example of how spirits take up no room in the physical world; nor do they crowd each other. All 3,000-6,000 of those spirits managed to fit inside the bodily cargo area of just that one man.

That being the case, then the netherworld need not be a void. People can exist down there in solid rock because spirits don't need space, they just need a place.


NOTE: Any attempt to drill down to the heart of the Earth in search of the netherworld would be futile because it isn't a physical world, rather, it's a spirit world. Drilling could, and would, pass right through the very heart of the netherworld and still not find it.

POP CLOCK UPDATE: 29 days have elapsed since beginning the thread. If the figures in post #1 are in the ball park, then something like 1,766,564 new arrivals have checked into the fiery sector of hades since Sept 24, 2018.
_


After Jesus evacuated Abram's Bosom, relocated it to Heaven and renamed it to Paradise Hell increase the size of itself. Isa 5:14

Blade
Title: Re: Hell's Population Clock
Post by: Olde Tymer on October 25, 2018, 09:42:15 am
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OBJECTION: Classical Christianity's hell doesn't make sense that a loving God would torment people in a fiery prison forever and ever.

REPONSE: Human common sense is produced by a 3-pound lump of flabby organic tissue; and not even all three of those pounds are devoted to cognitive processes. On top of that, those three pounds are 60% fat. That fatty, flabby, organic tissue can alter one's personality with little more than an aneurism or a blow to the head.

Just how sensible can a fatty, flabby, organic sense really be compared to the sense of a supernatural being with enough intelligence to invent, design, and construct a fully functioning cosmos with all of its forms of life, matter, and energy? A fatty, flabby, organic sense isn't even a dunce in comparison: it's the sense of a paramecium; if even that.

● 1Cor 3:20 . .The Lord knows that the thoughts of the wise are empty.

Well; that's certainly not a very flattering evaluation. It's as much as saying that, in God's opinion, the smartest among humanity basically consists of air heads; and if that's His evaluation of the best and brightest, then where does God rank those of us with an average IQ?


POP CLOCK UPDATE: 31 days have elapsed since beginning the thread. If the figures in post #1 are in the ball park, then something like 1,888,396 new arrivals have checked into the fiery sector of hades since Sept 24, 2018.
_
Title: Re: Hell's Population Clock
Post by: Olde Tymer on October 27, 2018, 08:01:42 am
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The human body is fragile; so much so that even something as thin as the air can snuff it out.

● Isa 40:6-7 . . All flesh is grass, and all its grace is like the blossom of the field. The grass shall dry out, the blossom shall wilt, for a wind from the Lord has blown upon it; behold the people is grass.

According to a report released on March 25, 2014 by the World Health Organization; air pollution kills, on average, seven million people per annum; and is linked to one in eight deaths (12.5%) world-wide. Think of it. That percentage represents approximately 941.16 million deaths linked to air pollution per annum out of a currently estimated 7.53+ billion people.

According to a report by the public health agency of the United Nations; an estimated 4.3 million people in developing countries died in 2012 as a result of indoor air pollution, mostly from cooking inside with coal or wood stoves.

Air pollution is so lethal because it exacerbates other conditions like cardio vascular diseases, cancer, and respiratory illnesses. Were people with those conditions permitted to breathe clean air free of hazardous chemicals and toxic particulates, they would live longer; thus the arrival times of many tagged for the infernal regions would be delayed so they could enjoy life a bit longer before beginning an eternity of perpetual anguish.


POP CLOCK UPDATE: 33 days have elapsed since beginning the thread. If the figures in post #1 are in the ball park, then something like 2,010,228 new arrivals have checked into the fiery sector of hades since Sept 24, 2018.
_
Title: Re: Hell's Population Clock
Post by: Olde Tymer on October 29, 2018, 08:28:48 am
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The wrath of God is interesting. For example:

● Isa 13:9 . . Behold, the day of Christ comes-- cruel; with both wrath and fierce anger

The Hebrew word for "wrath" in that statement is 'ebrah (eb-raw') which indicates an outburst of passion. In other words: the wrath of God won't be weeping big wet crocodile tears while it's slamming the dead at the Great White Throne event depicted at Rev 20:11-15; no, they will be terminated with extreme prejudice; viz: their judgment will be administered with choler. (cf. Isa 63:1-6, Rev 19:15)

Webster's defines "fierce" as a behavior exhibited by humans and animals that inspires terror because of the wild and menacing aspect of fury in attack. Ferocity is an aspect commonly seen among roaring, snarling lions savagely attacking prey. There's neither sportsmanship nor sympathy in ferocity; only sheer terror, brutality, and blood lust.

"cruel" is defined as: disposed to inflict pain or suffering; viz: devoid of humane feelings

● Heb 10:27 . . A certain fearful expectation of . . . fiery indignation

"fiery indignation" is quite a bit more severe than ordinary indignation. It speaks of someone who is seriously ticked off; and so angry that they're actually red in the face.

There are people out there in pews all around the world who have been so coddled by sappy versions of Christianity that they have no concept of the magnitude of the lethal tsunami of rage and violence coming their way to get them.

Another interesting aspect of the wrath of God is the person appointed to administer it-- none other than the sweet little baby away in a manger.

● John 5:22-23 . .The Father judges no one, but has committed all judgment to the Son, that all should honor the Son just as they honor the Father.

● Acts 17:31 . . For God has set a day when he will judge the world with justice by the man he has appointed. He has given proof of this to all men by raising him from the dead.

● Rev 19:15 . . He shall rule them with a rod of iron: and he treads the winepress of the fierceness and wrath of Almighty God.


POP CLOCK UPDATE: 35 days have elapsed since beginning the thread. If the figures in post #1 are in the ball park, then something like 2,132,060 new arrivals have checked into the fiery sector of hades since Sept 24, 2018.
_
Title: Re: Hell's Population Clock
Post by: Bladerunner on October 29, 2018, 08:43:55 pm
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The wrath of God is interesting. For example:

● Isa 13:9 . . Behold, the day of Christ comes-- cruel; with both wrath and fierce anger

The Hebrew word for "wrath" in that statement is 'ebrah (eb-raw') which indicates an outburst of passion. In other words: the wrath of God won't be weeping big wet crocodile tears while it's slamming the dead at the Great White Throne event depicted at Rev 20:11-15; no, they will be terminated with extreme prejudice; viz: their judgment will be administered with choler. (cf. Isa 63:1-6, Rev 19:15)

Webster's defines "fierce" as a behavior exhibited by humans and animals that inspires terror because of the wild and menacing aspect of fury in attack. Ferocity is an aspect commonly seen among roaring, snarling lions savagely attacking prey. There's neither sportsmanship nor sympathy in ferocity; only sheer terror, brutality, and blood lust.

"cruel" is defined as: disposed to inflict pain or suffering; viz: devoid of humane feelings

● Heb 10:27 . . A certain fearful expectation of . . . fiery indignation

"fiery indignation" is quite a bit more severe than ordinary indignation. It speaks of someone who is seriously ticked off; and so angry that they're actually red in the face.

There are people out there in pews all around the world who have been so coddled by sappy versions of Christianity that they have no concept of the magnitude of the lethal tsunami of rage and violence coming their way to get them.

Another interesting aspect of the wrath of God is the person appointed to administer it-- none other than the sweet little baby away in a manger.

● John 5:22-23 . .The Father judges no one, but has committed all judgment to the Son, that all should honor the Son just as they honor the Father.

● Acts 17:31 . . For God has set a day when he will judge the world with justice by the man he has appointed. He has given proof of this to all men by raising him from the dead.

● Rev 19:15 . . He shall rule them with a rod of iron: and he treads the winepress of the fierceness and wrath of Almighty God.


POP CLOCK UPDATE: 35 days have elapsed since beginning the thread. If the figures in post #1 are in the ball park, then something like 2,132,060 new arrivals have checked into the fiery sector of hades since Sept 24, 2018.
_


I have read all your ramblings and would like to say that God's intentions are good and"There is no way in HELL" (pun intended) does HE wants to send anyone to HELL.

As we see in this passage:

Matt. 23:37..."O Jerusalem, Jerusalem, thou that killest the prophets, and stonest them which are sent unto thee, how often would I have gathered thy children together, even as a hen gathereth her chickens under her wings, and ye would not!"


The "Ye Would NOT" LET HIM.. You had to have it your own way.

Blade
Title: Re: Hell's Population Clock
Post by: Olde Tymer on October 31, 2018, 08:15:20 am
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● 2Thes 2:11-12 . . God will send them strong delusion, that they should believe the lie, that they all may be condemned who did not believe the truth but had pleasure in unrighteousness.

In other words: there's coming a time when God's patience will reach its reasonable limits, and He will purposely, willfully, and deliberately make sure that a certain category of people have no chance whatsoever to be spared the wrath of God.

Back when Noah was preparing the ark, no doubt his neighbors all mocked and poked fun at him like one of those deranged souls that go around with a sandwich board that reads: Repent; The End Is Near! But when the rain started, I bet those very same neighbors panicked and tried to get Noah to open up and let them in. But even had Noah wanted to; he couldn't. The hatch of the ark was sealed from the outside: and God was the only one on earth who could open it-- He chose not to.

● Rev 1:18 . . I am He who lives, and was dead, and behold, I am alive forevermore. Amen. And I have the keys of Hades and of Death.

● Rev 3:7 . .These are the words of him who is holy and true: who holds the key of David. What he opens no one can shut, and what he shuts no one can open.


POP CLOCK UPDATE: 37 days have elapsed since beginning the thread. If the figures in post #1 are in the ball park, then something like 2,253,892 new arrivals have checked into the fiery sector of hades since Sept 24, 2018.
_
Title: Re: Hell's Population Clock
Post by: Olde Tymer on November 02, 2018, 09:12:32 am
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● Acts 2:31a . . his soul was not left in hell

The Greek word for "hell" in that verse is haides (hah'-dace) which essentially means unseen. It refers to an afterlife situation irrespective of one's goodness or badness and regardless of age, race, religion, or gender.

Classical haides is divided into sections where the souls of the dead are assigned in accordance with the quality of their pre-death existence. The worst section is a deep abyss called Tartarus; which is utilized in the New Testament at 2Pet 2:4.

According to Luke 23:13, Jesus' soul vacationed in the better section of haides.


POP CLOCK UPDATE: 39 days have elapsed since beginning the thread. If the figures in post #1 are in the ball park, then something like 2,375,724 new arrivals have checked into the fiery sector of hades since Sept 24, 2018.
_
Title: Re: Hell's Population Clock
Post by: Olde Tymer on November 04, 2018, 12:03:28 pm
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A forgiven sinner is still sinful, and they'll go right on sinning same as before they were forgiven unless they undergo a radical re-design because human nature is intrinsically bad.

● Gen 6:5 . .Yhvh saw how great man's wickedness on the earth had become, and that every inclination of the thoughts of his heart was only evil all the time.

● Gen 8:21 . . Man's thoughts and actions are bent toward evil from childhood.

● Jer 13:23 . . Can the Ethiopian change his skin or the leopard its spots? Then may you also do good who are accustomed to do evil.

● Eph 2:3 . .We were by nature the children of wrath, even as others.

● John 3:7 . .You should not be surprised at my saying: you must be born again.

Well; in light of the passages above, it's certainly no surprise to me that people need to be brought to life all over again from scratch; and I'm not talking about reincarnation; no, I'm talking about an upgrade to the very core of their being so that they would, by nature, be the children of heaven rather than the children of hell.


POP CLOCK UPDATE: 41 days have elapsed since beginning the thread. If the figures in post #1 are in the ball park, then something like 2,497,556 new arrivals have checked into the fiery sector of hades since Sept 24, 2018.
_
Title: Re: Hell's Population Clock
Post by: Olde Tymer on November 06, 2018, 10:02:50 am
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Probably the first thing that most of us think of when we hear the word "hell" is everlasting torture. But the reservoir of burning sulfur depicted at Rev 20:10-15 is actually not so much a rack as it is a gallows. The reservoir is primarily an instrument for carrying out death sentences rather than life sentences.

A death sentence-- although a sentence with lasting effects --isn't perpetual; it's momentary. In other words: criminals are subjected to execution only long enough to end their lives. The primary reason we call the second death "eternal" is because it's permanent; viz: according to Dan 12:2 and John 5:28-29 there's only one resurrection allotted per person. Therefore nobody is coming back from the second death because they will have used up their one resurrection in order to face justice at the Great White Throne event.


NOTE: People walk away alive from the fire spoken of at 1Cor 3:5-15. Nobody walks away alive from the fire spoken of at Rev 20:10-15.

POP CLOCK UPDATE: 43 days have elapsed since beginning the thread. If the figures in post #1 are in the ball park, then something like 2,619,388 new arrivals have checked into the fiery sector of hades since Sept 24, 2018.
_
Title: Re: Hell's Population Clock
Post by: Olde Tymer on November 08, 2018, 09:03:35 am
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Human existence on earth is a composite of body, soul, and spirit. (Gen 2:7, 1Thes 5:23, Heb 4:12)

The body and the soul are readily destroyed by means of hell fire (Matt 10:28) but I have yet to come across a passage in the Bible teaching that the spirit is destroyed by that means; or by any means for that matter.

In what condition people will exist in the lake of brimstone depicted at Rev 20:11-15 minus a human body and a human soul I don't know. It might be that the human spirit is transferrable. What if God is able to move people's spirit around at will and attach it to a body and soul other than a human body and soul; say, the body and soul of a demonic being? The very thought of such a possibility is disturbing.


POP CLOCK UPDATE: 45 days have elapsed since beginning the thread. If the figures in post #1 are in the ball park, then something like 2,741,355 new arrivals have checked into the fiery sector of hades since Sept 24, 2018.
_
Title: Re: Hell's Population Clock
Post by: Olde Tymer on November 10, 2018, 01:51:38 pm
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COMMON ATTITUDE: I'm special; God understands me. Although He probably may not let others off; I'm sure God will make an exception for me because I'm not like other people; I'm different.

RESPONSE: Unfortunately, the Bible's God can't do that. If He were to make exceptions, God would be neither equitable, nor honest-- and worse, it would go against His grain, compromise His integrity, sin against His conscience; and cause Him to lose the world's respect. No, God doesn't grade on a curve: everyone is treated equally in God's courtroom. In a system of divine absolutes; there is neither a curve nor an exception: nobody gets any favors, nobody is special, and nobody is a protected species.

● Deut 10:17 . . Yhvh shows no partiality and accepts no bribes.

● Acts 10:34 . .Then Peter began to speak: I now realize how true it is that God is impartial.

● Rom 2:5-11 . . For there is coming a day of judgment when God, the just judge of all the world, will judge all people according to what they have done. He will give eternal life to those who persist in doing what is good, seeking after the glory and honor and immortality that God offers.

. . . But he will pour out his anger and wrath on those who live for themselves, who refuse to obey the truth; and practice evil deeds. There will be anguish and calamity for everyone who practices evil-- for the Jew first and also for the Gentile. But there will be glory and honor and peace from God for all practice good --for the Jew first and also for the Gentile. For God does not show favoritism.


POP CLOCK UPDATE: 47 days have elapsed since beginning the thread. If the figures in post #1 are in the ball park, then something like 2,863,052 new arrivals have checked into the fiery sector of hades since Sept 24, 2018.
_
Title: Re: Hell's Population Clock
Post by: Olde Tymer on November 12, 2018, 11:42:38 am
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Q: Doesn't the Bible say that God's mercy endures forever as per Ps 100:5, Ps 106:1, Ps 107:1, and Ps 118:1, et al?

A: God's mercy is always available; but His good sense knows when to say when. Examples of that are the people swept away by the hand of God in the Flood, and those burned to death by the hand of God in Sodom and Gomorrah; and the firstborn of man and beast slain by the hand of God on Passover night in Egypt.

It's possible to push God too far. For example:

● Hos 4:17 . . Ephraim is joined to idols; let him alone.

In other words: God instructed the prophet Hosea not to bother preaching in Ephraim. They were too far gone.


POP CLOCK UPDATE: 49 days have elapsed since beginning the thread. If the figures in post #1 are in the ball park, then something like 2,984,884 new arrivals have checked into the fiery sector of hades since Sept 24, 2018.
_
Title: Re: Hell's Population Clock
Post by: Olde Tymer on November 14, 2018, 10:59:27 am
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● Jonah 4:9-11 . . God said to Jonah: Do you have a right to be angry about the vine? I do; he said. I am angry enough to die. But the Lord said: You have been concerned about this vine, though you did not tend it or make it grow. It sprang up overnight and died overnight. But Nineveh has more than a hundred and twenty thousand people who cannot tell their right hand from their left, and many cattle as well. Should I not be concerned about that great city?

Had not Jonah's preaching persuaded Nineveh's adults to change their ways, 120,000 small children would have died through no fault of their own. They would have been collateral damage due to their parents' decadence.


NOTE: Though the city was spared in Jonah's day, a hundred years later in Nahum's day it was destroyed by means of war and conquest; whereby a whole new generation of minors died before their time.

Just exactly how God is able to engineer such things is a bit of a mystery; but does make one wonder where else this terrifying work of His goes on. Did God somehow have a hand in the American civil war, and the first and second world wars, and the Holocaust, and in Korea and Vietnam, and in the so-called Arab Spring, and in the pandemics, the ethnic cleansings, ISIS, the housing bubble, and the genocides of the last century, and in natural events like mighty earthquakes, tsunamis, and super storms? I really have to wonder sometimes because Jonah's God is still out there somewhere; and so-called acts of God are still taking young lives.


POP CLOCK UPDATE: 51 days have elapsed since beginning the thread. If the figures in post #1 are in the ball park, then something like 3,106,716 new arrivals have checked into the fiery sector of hades since Sept 24, 2018.
_
Title: Re: Hell's Population Clock
Post by: Olde Tymer on November 16, 2018, 07:52:26 pm
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The ordeal that Christ endured on the cross was so brief that it looks like child's play in comparison to the misery of souls in hell. His suffering barely lasted six hours (Mark 15:25, Matt 27:46-50) not even one whole day. People in hell go day, after day, after day, after day, after day, infinitum.

Q: But if Christ suffered only six hours, how can he possibly atone for people facing an eternity in hell?

A: It wasn't his torture that atoned for humanity's sins; it was the loss of his life that did the trick. Christ didn't have to go to the flames himself in order to rescue people from that terrible fate; no, he only had to die in accordance with the law of sin and death.

● Rom 6:23 . .The wages of sin is death

Individual human lives are of such low value that the most that anybody could hope to die for is just one sin. In most cases; that leaves a pretty large balance to atone for. In contrast; the value of the life of God's son is such that his death can atone for an infinite number of everybody's sins.

● 1Pet 1:18-20 . . For you know that God paid a ransom to save you from the empty life you inherited from your ancestors. And the ransom he paid was not mere gold or silver. He paid for you with the precious lifeblood of Christ, the sinless, spotless Lamb of God.

Peter called the blood of Christ two things: a ransom and precious, meaning it's like rare jewels and metals; very pricey. Nobody else's life is nearly as valuable as Christ's life. Peter would never call regular human life rare and pricey. Ordinary human lives are wholesale: they're cheap as the grass (Isa 40:6-7, 1Pet 1:24) just a dime a dozen and quite useless for redemption purposes.

Christ's life is the only life God will accept for multiple sins: and the alternative is infinite punishment because no amount of limited punishment can ever equal the value of Christ's blood because not only is a life like Christ's rare, but his is the only one like it in existence. (cf. Rom 3:9-20, Heb 4:15, 1Pet 2:22, 1John 3:9)

Serial sinners are up a creek with no paddle because they have but two lives to forfeit for sin-- the life they have now, and the one they'll have later at their resurrection; but unfortunately, one of those lives is ear-marked for Adam's sin so they can't use it to atone for any of their own sins. And when they're resurrected to stand trial at the Great White Throne event depicted at Rev 20:11-15; that'll be their last life because according to Dan 12:2 and John 5:28-29 there's only one resurrection allotted per person. And since the Bible's ratio is one life per one sin, then serial sinners will come up short and never have sufficient lives to atone for a lifetime's accumulation of sins.

The dungeons of hell can be compared to a debtor's prison.

● Matt 5:25-26 . .Come to terms quickly with your adversary before it is too late and you are dragged into court, handed over to an officer, and thrown in jail. I assure you that you won't be free again until you have paid the last penny.

The reason that hell is a debtor's prison is because the only payment for one's sins that God will accept is death. Well; it's death for each sin. So if somebody has say, 200 sins to answer for, they'll only be able to pay for one because according to Dan 12:2 & John 5:28-29 there is but one resurrection allotted per person; not 200.

If absolute justice could be satisfied with torture, then hell's inmates could look forward to a release date. But alas; such isn't to happen because the only "coinage" the Bible's God is in a position to accept in lieu of their own lives is His son's life.

Bottom line: Christ's crucifixion is the final option. Those who refuse to take advantage of it, will cross over to the other side in poverty; with literally no way in hell to pay their debts to God; thus they'll be permanently stuck in the wrong place.


POP CLOCK UPDATE: 53 days have elapsed since beginning the thread. If the figures in post #1 are in the ball park, then something like 3,228,548 new arrivals have checked into the fiery sector of hades since Sept 24, 2018.
_
Title: Re: Hell's Population Clock
Post by: Olde Tymer on November 20, 2018, 10:54:51 am
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● Matt 10:28 . . Do not be afraid of those who kill the body but cannot kill the soul; but rather fear Him which is able to destroy both soul and body in hell.

Q: If somebody is already dead, then how can hell kill their body?

A: The current hell doesn't kill the human body because for now when people die, their bodies stay here rather than going there. But out ahead in the future; people in the current hell will be resurrected to face justice at the Great White Throne event depicted at Rev 20:11-15. It is then when people's bodies will be terminated by yet another hell; and since there is but one resurrection allotted per person (Dan 12:2, John 5:28-29) then nobody is ever coming back from that hell.

OBJECTION: The final hell is depicted as a lake of fire (Rev 20:11-15). Sorry; but it's impossible to liquefy flame

RESPONSE: It's also impossible to inundate the entire planet with a global flood. However, according to Rev 20:10 and Rev 21:8, the lake consists of not only fire; but also a substance called brimstone; which Webster's defines as sulfur.

Sulfur melts at 232.36º F and boils at 832.28º F. If sulfur's temperature is maintained in that range; it could easily suffice for an impoundment consisting of both flame and liquid.


Q: What's to prevent the lake's fire from consuming the sulfur?

A: The presence of fire doesn't always indicate combustion; for example the flames in Moses' bush were non consuming. (Ex 3:1-3). I think it's safe to assume that the fire related to the lake of fire is for heating purposes only rather than incinerating.

POP CLOCK UPDATE: 57 days have elapsed since beginning the thread. If the figures in post #1 are in the ball park, then something like 3,472,212 new arrivals have checked into the fiery sector of hades since Sept 24, 2018.
_
Title: Re: Hell's Population Clock
Post by: Olde Tymer on November 22, 2018, 03:31:17 pm
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Q: Do you not know it is the kindness of God that leads men to repentance rather than threats of justice? (Rom 2:4)

A: If the Bible's God weren't so kind, then He wouldn't bother with giving His creatures advance notice of the horror in store for them in the afterlife.

● Luke 12:4-5 . . And I say unto you my friends; Be not afraid of them that kill the body, and after that have no more that they can do. But I will forewarn you whom ye shall fear: Fear Him, which after He hath killed hath power to cast into Hell; yea, I say unto you fear Him.

Was Christ wrong to instill a fear of God within people's hearts? No; I think he was 110% justified. For example: when I was working as a professional welder for the US Army Corps of Engineers, we had weekly and monthly safety meetings wherein we were shown some grisly photographs of real life industrial accidents involving burns, chain saws, punctured eyes, explosions, falls, crane collapses, suffocation, crushing, and the like. Let me tell you something: those safety meetings got our attention, and really made a sharp distinction between the fool and the wise.

● Prv 22:3 . . A prudent person foresees the danger ahead and takes precautions; the simpleton goes blindly on and suffers the consequences.

The kindness of God has given the world fair and adequate notice of what to expect in the afterlife. Those who don't care about it one way or the other would be well advised to use what time they have remaining to begin preparing themselves for the worst when they cross over to the other side.


POP CLOCK UPDATE: 59 days have elapsed since beginning the thread. If the figures in post #1 are in the ball park, then something like 3,594,044 new arrivals have checked into the fiery sector of hades since Sept 24, 2018.
_
Title: Re: Hell's Population Clock
Post by: Olde Tymer on November 24, 2018, 07:59:20 pm
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Q: According to the Bible thumpers; it's a "must" to believe in Christ's gospel in order to be spared the wrath of God. How is that fair for peoples of the world who were never afforded an opportunity to hear it?

A: In April of 2018, I watched a movie on NetFlix called "Come Sunday" based upon the spiritual career of a Christian minister named Carlton D'metrius Pearson, DD.

Mr. Pearson underwent a crisis of faith due to pondering the fate of the millions of people in the world perishing in genocides, civil wars, and whatnot who never heard, nor ever would hear, Christ's gospel. It seemed thoroughly unreasonable to him that a reputedly merciful, loving God would condemn so many uninformed people to hell just because they didn't believe in a Jesus about whom many of them likely knew nothing about.

Mr. Pearson's solution to the problem was to simply do away with hell by insisting that classical Christianity's interpretation of the New Testament is incorrect; which is remarkable seeing as how he attended Oral Roberts University and was mentored by Oral Roberts himself.

But Mr. Pearson's thinking is a bit of a puzzle to me seeing as how he was seminary-trained. It seems to me that he should've been aware of the eternal gospel; which is actually Christ's gospel in an elementary form. It reads like this:

"The heavens declare the glory of God; the skies proclaim the work of his hands. Day after day they pour forth speech; night after night they display knowledge. There is no speech or language where their voice is not heard. Their voice goes out into all the earth, their words to the ends of the world." (Ps 19:1-4)

Paul referred to that passage. (Rom 1:18-21, Rom 10:18).

During the doomsday calamities depicted in the book of Revelation, a special angel will fly throughout the world proclaiming, not the cross, rather, a reiteration of Ps 19:1-4.

"Then I saw another angel flying in midair, and he had the eternal gospel to proclaim to those who live on the earth-- to every nation, tribe, language and people. He said in a loud voice: Fear God and give Him glory, because the hour of His judgment has come. Worship him who made the heavens, the earth, the sea and the springs of water." (Rev 14:6-7)

I'm confident that there will be a pretty large number of people whose future will be decided not on the basis of their response to a pulpit pounder's preaching, rather, their response to nature's preaching.


NOTE: In the movie; Mr. Pearson asks the question: Are we more merciful than God? Well; yes, of course we are. Humanity grants itself the liberty to circumvent justice; but God can't do that. In point of fact, were God at liberty to circumvent justice, then Christ's crucifixion was needless.

POP CLOCK UPDATE: 61 days have elapsed since beginning the thread. If the figures in post #1 are in the ball park, then something like 3,715,876 new arrivals have checked into the fiery sector of hades since Sept 24, 2018.
_
Title: Re: Hell's Population Clock
Post by: Olde Tymer on November 26, 2018, 06:40:17 pm
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Heaven is sometimes depicted as a mountain with any number of roads around the base heading towards the top. Well; classical Christianity accepts only one of those roads reaches the top; viz: the rest are dead-ends, loops, terraces, circles, and cul-de-sacs, i.e. no outlets and nowhere to go except round and around or back down the mountain.

Hell is depicted as a colossal pit, deep and wide, with many roads around the rim heading towards the bottom. Well; classical Christianity accepts that every one of those roads eventually merge into one big super expressway to the bottom.

● Matt 7:13-14 . . Wide is the gate and broad is the road that leads to destruction, and many enter through it. But small is the gate and narrow the road that leads to life, and only a few find it.

How many people of all ages, races, and genders does the quantity "many" represent? Well, according to my sources there are approximately:

50 thousand Scientologists
15 million Mormons
8.2 million Jehovah's Witnesses
7.8 million Baha'i
515.9 million Buddhists
451.3 million Chinese Folk Religionists
8.4 million Confucianists
258.5 million Ethnic Religionists
974.6 million Hindus
5.6 million Jains
1.7 billion Muslims
14.1 million Jews
64.2 million New Religionists
2.8 million Shintoists
24.9 million Sikhs
14.2 million Spiritists
8.7 million Taoists
1.1 billion Atheists/Agnostics

The grand total of just those categories is 5,174,700,000

If those figures are in the ball park, and if classical Christianity is the truth; then at least 69% of the earth's current population of 7.54 billion people are on a road to hell; and no doubt some of those are people we know: our friends, our relatives, and our associates.


NOTE: Jehovah's Witnesses and Mormons are Christians in accordance with Webster's definition; but not in the classical sense.

Joseph Smith's movement is a variation; in other words: there's some classical Christianity in Mormonism, but classical Christianity comprises only a portion of Mormonism. The rest of it is extreme, to say the least.

Neither do Jehovah's Witnesses qualify as Christians in the classical sense. Charles Taze Russell's movement is a variation too. There's some classical Christianity in the Watchtower Society's doctrines, but classical Christianity comprises only a portion of Russell's doctrines; and his slant on it is very peculiar.


POP CLOCK UPDATE: 63 days have elapsed since beginning the thread. If the figures in post #1 are in the ball park, then something like 3,837,708 new arrivals have checked into the fiery sector of hades since Sept 24, 2018.
_
Title: Re: Hell's Population Clock
Post by: Olde Tymer on November 28, 2018, 07:39:46 am
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● Matt 5:9 . . Blessed are the peacemakers, for they shall be called sons of God.

Peace is actually one of the negative aspects of heaven because peace is not ideal for people who thrive in a society where behaviors like the ones listed below are the norm,

Discord, hatred, factions, cliques, mistrust, prejudice, bias, caste systems, double standards, partiality, favoritism, deceit, surmising, dishonesty, gossip, slander, sarcasm, cynicism, ridicule, envy, rivalry, resentment, avarice, greed, gossip, character assassination, kangaroo courts, complaining, tattling, meddling, confrontations, activism, quarrels, assertiveness, heated debates, chafing, trickery, grudging, stonewalling, bitterness, silent treatments,

. . . revenge, stubbornness, cold shouldering, snobbery, egotism, dominance, demeaning comments, pecking orders, rebellion, arrogance, attitudes, subterfuge, treachery, betrayal, suspicion, conceit, vanity, superiority complexes, depression, melancholy, panic attacks, bi-polar disorders, antisocial behaviors, sociopaths, crime, war, despotism, oppression, injustice, human rights abuses, character assassination, toxic rejoinders, smart-Alek retorts, snide remarks, etc, etc, et al, and ad nausea.

In addition; there are stand-up fighters for whom every disagreement is either an insult or an act of war. And when they're angry, they just have to give you a piece of their mind. Those people would really be a fish out of water in heaven.

I've heard it said that heaven is a place prepared for a prepared people; i.e. people conditioned for heaven; viz: undergone changes and/or modifications so as to make them suitable for heaven. People whose personalities are by nature detrimental to peace are going to miss the boat if they cross over to the next life in their natural condition.


POP CLOCK UPDATE: 65 days have elapsed since beginning the thread. If the figures in post #1 are in the ball park, then something like 3,959,540 new arrivals have checked into the fiery sector of hades since Sept 24, 2018.
_
Title: Re: Hell's Population Clock
Post by: Olde Tymer on November 30, 2018, 07:17:01 pm
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It's easy to assume that only really bad people are in hell. But according to Matt 7:23-27, John 3:3-8, John 3:14-20, John 3:36, and Rev 20:11-15, anybody can be there; both the good, the bad, and the not so bad-- bikers, bakers, lawyers, welders, actors and actresses, housewives, bankers, heavy equipment operators, loggers, convicts, celebrities, homeless bums, clergy, prostitutes, drug lords, postmen, Presidents, Kings,

. . . statesmen, astronauts, school teachers, scientists, nurses, doctors, chemists, machinists, carpenters, waiters, hotel managers, cops, judges, nuns, priests, Popes, deacons, salesmen, Miss Americas, news anchors, weathermen, and birdwatchers, et al --people from every walk, every career, every religion, every culture, every language, every ethnic, every craft, and every status: they're all in danger of the sum of all fears.

● Rev 20:12 . . I saw the dead, great and small, standing before the throne, and books were opened.

Because when you strip away their gender, their titles, their distinctions, their privileges, and their entitlements; and stand them before God naked; people are only flesh and blood creatures-- naked apes, just human beings; and human beings are intrinsically sinful beings whether inbred or bred to perfection.

● Gen 8:21 . . Man's thoughts and actions are bent toward evil from childhood.

● Ps 58:3 . . Even from birth the wicked go astray; from the womb they are wayward and speak lies.

● Eph 2:3 . .We were by nature objects of wrath.


POP CLOCK UPDATE: 67 days have elapsed since beginning the thread. If the figures in post #1 are in the ball park, then something like 4,081,372 new arrivals have checked into the fiery sector of hades since Sept 24, 2018.
_
Title: Re: Hell's Population Clock
Post by: Olde Tymer on December 02, 2018, 08:47:24 am
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People tend to avoid thinking about the hereafter. Thus they become like a frog boiled to death by starting it out in cold water.

● Ecc 11:9 . . Rejoice, young man, during your childhood, and let your heart be pleasant during the days of young manhood. And follow the impulses of your heart and the desires of your eyes. Yet know that God will bring you to judgment for all these things.

Solomon may not have been 100% right about everything, but he was sure right about that.

● Acts 17:30-31 . . God commands all people everywhere to repent. He has set a day when He will judge the world with justice by the man He has appointed. He has given proof of this to all men by raising him from the dead.

● Rom 2:16 . . God will judge men's secrets through Jesus Christ, as my gospel declares.


POP CLOCK UPDATE: 69 days have elapsed since beginning the thread. If the figures in post #1 are in the ball park, then something like 4,203,204 new arrivals have checked into the fiery sector of hades since Sept 24, 2018.
_
Title: Re: Hell's Population Clock
Post by: Olde Tymer on December 04, 2018, 09:34:11 am
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POSIT: Christ is compassionate and would never run an eternal torture mill for his lost sheep.

RESPONSE: Christ doesn't have any lost sheep. All the sheep that God entrusted to His son's care are safe and sound.

● John 10:9 . . I am the gate; whoever enters through me shall be saved.

Were Christ a so-so shepherd; then he wouldn't dare say "shall be" saved; no, he'd have to tone it down a bit and say "can be" saved. That would leave him some room for error. But when Christ says "shall be" he's claiming a 0.0% failure rate.

● John 10:27-28 . . My sheep hear my voice, and I know them, and they follow me: and I give unto them eternal life; and they shall never perish, neither shall any man pluck them out of my hand.


POSIT: Christ's sheep are not all "safe and sound", no; not when they have the free will to pluck themselves out of his hand.

RESPONSE: The Father's free will trumps the sheep's free will.

● John 6:39 . .This is the will of the one who sent me; that I should not lose anything of what He gave me.

Christ's sheep are among the things that God has given him (John 10:27-30).

So then, were Christ to lose even one of those sheep, he would disappoint the one who sent him. But Christ never fails to satisfy his Father's will.

● John 8:29 . .The one who sent me is with me. He has not left me alone, because I always do what is pleasing to Him.

Were Christ to lose even one of the sheep in his care, he wouldn't be able to say that he "always" does what is pleasing to Him.


FYI: Not all sheep are Christ's sheep; only his believing followers qualify.

● Eph 1:13 . . And you also were included in Christ when you heard the word of truth, the gospel of your salvation. Having believed, you were marked in him with a seal, the promised Holy Spirit

Disbelievers are not sealed; no, their neck is in a noose.

● John 3:18 . . He who believes in him is not condemned; but he who disbelieves is condemned already.

When people say that it's possible for Jesus to lose sheep; they are actually casting a vote of no-confidence in his claim to be the good shepherd. In their mind's eye, he's not an exceptional shepherd; he's just another run-of-the-mill cowpoke.


POP CLOCK UPDATE: 71 days have elapsed since beginning the thread. If the figures in post #1 are in the ball park, then something like 4,325,036 new arrivals have checked into the fiery sector of hades since Sept 24, 2018.
_
Title: Re: Hell's Population Clock
Post by: Olde Tymer on December 06, 2018, 11:49:58 am
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Q: Isn't Judaism equally as useful as Christianity for sinners seeking God's forgiveness? Isn't that the whole purpose of Yom Kippur, a.k.a. the Day of Atonement?

A: Pinning one's hopes on the Day Of Atonement is futile. For one thing: there's no one to perform the ritual seeing as how there is neither a Temple nor a fully functioning Levitical priesthood on duty in Jerusalem at this time. In point of fact, neither of those two essential elements of the Day of Atonement have been in Jerusalem since 70 AD. But that's not the worst of it.

There is a special goat involved in Yom Kippur commonly called a scapegoat, which Webster's defines as a person who is unfairly blamed for something that others have done; in other words: a fall guy. But that does not quite accurately define Yom Kippur's special goat. It's actually an escaping goat; viz: a fugitive; here's why.

It's a biblical axiom that the soul that sins, it shall die, i.e. the wages of sin is death (Ezek 18:20, Rom 6:23). Well; the special goat is allowed to live rather than executed, so justice for the worshippers' sins remains pending; hanging over their heads like a sword of Damocles.


NOTE: Leaving a goat out in a wilderness place to fend for itself isn't a death sentence. No; far from it. Goats are survivors. They can get by in environments that quite a few other species would find quite disagreeable. And though the Jews were in a wilderness place during their wanderings, there was vegetation enough to nourish the herds. (Ex 34:3)

Yom Kippur's purpose then, isn't to exonerate the people; rather, to remind the people that although Yom Kippur's ritual sanitizes them as per Lev 16:30, their sins are still on the books, yet to be brought to justice.

● Ex 34:6-7 . . Yhvh, Yhvh God: compassionate and gracious, slow to anger, and abounding in loving kindness and truth; who keeps loving kindness for thousands, who forgives iniquity, transgression and sin; yet He will by no means leave the guilty unpunished

● Nahum 1:3 . . Yhvh is slow to anger, and great in power, and will not at all acquit the wicked

Looking at those two scriptures one cannot help but scratch their head and wonder how it's possible that God forgives the guilty, and yet at the same time does not acquit the guilty. Well; the answer to that is: forgiveness and acquittal are two very different things in the Old Testament.

In other words; though God forgave He did not forget; viz: the covenant that Moses' people agreed upon with God does not permit Him to expunge the guilty party's record; viz: forgiveness as per the covenant is merely a reprieve; which Webster's defines as: to delay the punishment of someone; such as a prisoner who is sentenced to death.

Christ's crucifixion is retroactive (Rom 3:23-26) and that's because it was settled upon even before the cosmos (1Pet 1:18-20, Rev 13:8). In other words; all the sins that Moses' people committed in the past that could not be acquitted back then are acquitted by a human sacrifice that is far and away superior to Yom Kippur's.

● Isa 53:5-6 . . He was pierced for our transgressions, he was crushed for our iniquities; the punishment that brought us peace was upon him, and by his wounds we are healed. We all, like sheep, have gone astray, each of us has turned to his own way; and the Yhvh has laid on him the iniquity of us all.

● Acts 13:38-39 . . My brothers, I want you to know that through Jesus the forgiveness of sins is proclaimed to you. Through him everyone who believes is justified from everything you could not be justified from by the law of Moses.

The koiné Greek word translated "justified" is dikaioo (dik-ah-yo'-o) which basically means to adjudge as righteous, i.e. innocent. So in Christ, people obtain both forgiveness and innocence, whereas in Yom Kippur the most they can obtain is forgiveness.


NOTE: Never, ever, wish your Jewish friends and/or associates a pleasant Yom Kippur. It's okay to wish them a satisfactory Yom Kippur but never a pleasant one because it's not a feel-good day like Christmas and birthdays.

Quite the contrary Yom Kippur is specifically a day to be depressed; viz: a day of sadness and self-affliction; as per Lev 16:29-31, Lev 16:31, Lev 23:27, and Lev 23:32, which is from a Hebrew word meaning to mistreat, humiliate, oppress, break the spirit, demean, abuse, weaken, injure, abase, etc. Jews that think and/or speak well of themselves on that day accrue an instant curse upon themselves. (Deut 27:26)


POP CLOCK UPDATE: 73 days have elapsed since beginning the thread. If the figures in post #1 are in the ball park, then something like 4,446,868 new arrivals have checked into the fiery sector of hades since Sept 24, 2018.
_
Title: Re: Hell's Population Clock
Post by: Bladerunner on December 06, 2018, 07:46:52 pm
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Q: Isn't Judaism equally as useful as Christianity for sinners seeking God's forgiveness? Isn't that the whole purpose of Yom Kippur, a.k.a. the Day of Atonement?

A: Pinning one's hopes on the Day Of Atonement is futile. For one thing: there's no one to perform the ritual seeing as how there is neither a Temple nor a fully functioning Levitical priesthood on duty in Jerusalem at this time. In point of fact, neither of those two essential elements of the Day of Atonement have been in Jerusalem since 70 AD. But that's not the worst of it.

There is a special goat involved in Yom Kippur commonly called a scapegoat, which Webster's defines as a person who is unfairly blamed for something that others have done; in other words: a fall guy. But that does not quite accurately define Yom Kippur's special goat. It's actually an escaping goat; viz: a fugitive; here's why.

It's a biblical axiom that the soul that sins, it shall die, i.e. the wages of sin is death (Ezek 18:20, Rom 6:23). Well; the special goat is allowed to live rather than executed, so justice for the worshippers' sins remains pending; hanging over their heads like a sword of Damocles.


NOTE: Leaving a goat out in a wilderness place to fend for itself isn't a death sentence. No; far from it. Goats are survivors. They can get by in environments that quite a few other species would find quite disagreeable. And though the Jews were in a wilderness place during their wanderings, there was vegetation enough to nourish the herds. (Ex 34:3)

Yom Kippur's purpose then, isn't to exonerate the people; rather, to remind the people that although Yom Kippur's ritual sanitizes them as per Lev 16:30, their sins are still on the books, yet to be brought to justice.

● Ex 34:6-7 . . Yhvh, Yhvh God: compassionate and gracious, slow to anger, and abounding in loving kindness and truth; who keeps loving kindness for thousands, who forgives iniquity, transgression and sin; yet He will by no means leave the guilty unpunished

● Nahum 1:3 . . Yhvh is slow to anger, and great in power, and will not at all acquit the wicked

Looking at those two scriptures one cannot help but scratch their head and wonder how it's possible that God forgives the guilty, and yet at the same time does not acquit the guilty. Well; the answer to that is: forgiveness and acquittal are two very different things in the Old Testament.

In other words; though God forgave He did not forget; viz: the covenant that Moses' people agreed upon with God does not permit Him to expunge the guilty party's record; viz: forgiveness as per the covenant is merely a reprieve; which Webster's defines as: to delay the punishment of someone; such as a prisoner who is sentenced to death.

Christ's crucifixion is retroactive (Rom 3:23-26) and that's because it was settled upon even before the cosmos (1Pet 1:18-20, Rev 13:8). In other words; all the sins that Moses' people committed in the past that could not be acquitted back then are acquitted by a human sacrifice that is far and away superior to Yom Kippur's.

● Isa 53:5-6 . . He was pierced for our transgressions, he was crushed for our iniquities; the punishment that brought us peace was upon him, and by his wounds we are healed. We all, like sheep, have gone astray, each of us has turned to his own way; and the Yhvh has laid on him the iniquity of us all.

● Acts 13:38-39 . . My brothers, I want you to know that through Jesus the forgiveness of sins is proclaimed to you. Through him everyone who believes is justified from everything you could not be justified from by the law of Moses.

The koiné Greek word translated "justified" is dikaioo (dik-ah-yo'-o) which basically means to adjudge as righteous, i.e. innocent. So in Christ, people obtain both forgiveness and innocence, whereas in Yom Kippur the most they can obtain is forgiveness.


NOTE: Never, ever, wish your Jewish friends and/or associates a pleasant Yom Kippur. It's okay to wish them a satisfactory Yom Kippur but never a pleasant one because it's not a feel-good day like Christmas and birthdays.

Quite the contrary Yom Kippur is specifically a day to be depressed; viz: a day of sadness and self-affliction; as per Lev 16:29-31, Lev 16:31, Lev 23:27, and Lev 23:32, which is from a Hebrew word meaning to mistreat, humiliate, oppress, break the spirit, demean, abuse, weaken, injure, abase, etc. Jews that think and/or speak well of themselves on that day accrue an instant curse upon themselves. (Deut 27:26)


POP CLOCK UPDATE: 73 days have elapsed since beginning the thread. If the figures in post #1 are in the ball park, then something like 4,446,868 new arrivals have checked into the fiery sector of hades since Sept 24, 2018.
_


You said:"Isn't Judaism equally as useful as Christianity for sinners seeking God's forgiveness?"

NO and another NO...Judaism does not believe in Jesus Christ and without Jesus Christ, you CanNOT get Salvation. At least, not in this Dispensation period of GRACE.


Bladed
Title: Re: Hell's Population Clock
Post by: Olde Tymer on December 08, 2018, 10:31:46 am
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I know of the preacher who was asked by Audie Murphy's widow Pamela to speak at her husband's funeral. Audie Murphy, as you may already know, was a 32nd degree Scottish Rite Mason and a Shriner; but he wasn't a Christian.

In amazement, the pastor asked Mrs. Murphy why she chose a Christian to speak at her husband's funeral.

Although Audie himself wasn't a Christian, Pamela was; and she explained that the Hollywood crowd would be there the day of his funeral, and having hob-nobbed with them during her husband's acting career, she was fully aware that many of them were rarely confronted with something serious about the afterlife.

Well; they got both barrels that day, and were very annoyed because they were expecting the usual sappy, feel-good rhetoric to which pampered celebrities are accustomed.

Some may feel that hell isn't an appropriate topic at a funeral. But I think that, other than Xmas and Easter, you couldn't pick a better time to bring it up, especially since Christ said that the majority ends up there.

● Ecc 7:2 . . It is better to go to a house of mourning than to go to a house of gaiety, for death is the destiny of every man; the living should take this seriously.

According to the Bible; not many great people are called (1Cor 1:26). If that's true, then we have to expect that the majority of the world's best and brightest achievers-- the really big names in sports, science, medicine, law, politics, technology, business, industry, religion, entertainment, and education, etc --don't, and won't, make it to safety when they pass on.

As I watched some of the splendor and pomp of former President Gerald Ford's funeral back in January of 2007, I couldn't help but wonder if he was in a position to really appreciate it; as I suspect people in hell would certainly no longer really care anymore whether they were given an unknown pauper's disposal in a City incinerator, or reverently placed in a grand tomb in the National Cemetery with world-wide television coverage.


POP CLOCK UPDATE: 75 days have elapsed since beginning the thread. If the figures in post #1 are in the ball park, then something like 4,568,700 new arrivals have checked into the fiery sector of hades since Sept 24, 2018.
_
Title: Re: Hell's Population Clock
Post by: Olde Tymer on December 10, 2018, 09:31:22 am
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● Deut 27:26 . . Cursed be anyone who does not confirm the words of this law by doing them.

One thing that must be emphasized is that the curse is irrevocable; so it's very important to come to grips with it; and the sooner the better.

● Matt 5:18 . . For assuredly, I say to you: till heaven and earth pass away, not one jot or one tittle will by any means pass from the law till all is fulfilled.

In other words: whoever deserves that curse is absolutely certain to get it.

In point of fact, Deut 27:26 is grammatically present tense rather than future, indicating that the curse is instant-- no delay and no waiting period. i.e. it's already on the books hanging over people's heads like a guillotine just waiting for an officer to give the executioner a signal to let go the rope keeping the blade in check.


POP CLOCK UPDATE: 77 days have elapsed since beginning the thread. If the figures in post #1 are in the ball park, then something like 4,690,532 new arrivals have checked into the fiery sector of hades since Sept 24, 2018.
_
Title: Re: Hell's Population Clock
Post by: Bladerunner on December 10, 2018, 08:16:38 pm
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● Deut 27:26 . . Cursed be anyone who does not confirm the words of this law by doing them.

One thing that must be emphasized is that the curse is irrevocable; so it's very important to come to grips with it; and the sooner the better.

● Matt 5:18 . . For assuredly, I say to you: till heaven and earth pass away, not one jot or one tittle will by any means pass from the law till all is fulfilled.

In other words: whoever deserves that curse is absolutely certain to get it.

In point of fact, Deut 27:26 is grammatically present tense rather than future, indicating that the curse is instant-- no delay and no waiting period. i.e. it's already on the books hanging over people's heads like a guillotine just waiting for an officer to give the executioner a signal to let go the rope keeping the blade in check.


POP CLOCK UPDATE: 77 days have elapsed since beginning the thread. If the figures in post #1 are in the ball park, then something like 4,690,532 new arrivals have checked into the fiery sector of hades since Sept 24, 2018.
_


  Fortunately for us, Olde Tymer, we during this dispensation of Grace are not under the "Law of Moses".

Blade
Title: Re: Hell's Population Clock
Post by: Olde Tymer on December 12, 2018, 10:19:57 am
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POSIT: The Old Testament's God abhors human sacrifices. Therefore, He couldn't possibly approve of the New Testament's cross. For example: Jer 32:33-35 and Deut 12:31.

RESPONSE: The Old Testament prohibitions related to human sacrifices all pertain to underage children rather than consenting adults, e.g. Lev 18:21, Lev 20:2-5, Deut 12:31, Deut 18:10, cf. 2Kgs 16:3, 2Kgs 17:31, 2Kgs 23:10, 2Kgs 21:6, Ps 106:34, Ezk 20:31, Ezk 23:37, Jer 7:31, Jer 19:4, and Jer 32:35.

The Old Testament predicted human sacrifice; with God's full approval and participation no less.

● Isa 53:6 . . The Lord has laid on him the iniquity of us all.

● Isa 53:10 . . It was The Lord's will to crush him and cause him to suffer . . .The Lord makes his life a guilt offering.


POP CLOCK UPDATE: 79 days have elapsed since beginning the thread. If the figures in post #1 are in the ball park, then something like 4,812,364 new arrivals have checked into the fiery sector of hades since Sept 24, 2018.
_
Title: Re: Hell's Population Clock
Post by: Olde Tymer on December 14, 2018, 07:51:07 am
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Q: Can you cite an Old Testament example where God approved human sacrifice?

A: Abraham lived a pretty good number of years before Israel's covenanted law was instituted. Therefore, he wasn't obligated to comply with it because biblical law doesn't have ex post facto jurisdiction; viz: it isn't retroactive. (Deut 5:2-4, Rom 4:15, Rom 5:13, and Gal 3:17)

So then, Abraham was in a position to offer a human sacrifice without incurring guilt; which he did.

● Gen 22:1-2 . . Now it came about after these things, that God tested Abraham, and said to him: Abraham! And he said: Here I am. And He said: Take now your son, your only son, whom you love, Isaac, and go to the land of Moriah; and offer him there as a burnt offering on one of the mountains of which I will tell you.

Did Abraham slay Isaac? No, but did Abraham offer Isaac? Yes.

● Gen 22:9 . .Then they came to the place of which God had told him. And Abraham built an altar there and placed the wood in order; and he bound Isaac his son and laid him on the altar, upon the wood.

You see, once a gift dedicated to God is placed on an altar, it's a done deal-- whether the offering is dead or alive makes no difference. In point of fact, the letter to Hebrews credits Abraham with offering his son in obedience to God's command.

● Heb 11:17 . . By faith Abraham, when he was tested, offered up Isaac, and he who had received the promises offered up his only begotten son

Had God disapproved human sacrifice, He would've stopped Abraham before Isaac was laid on the altar.

So then, the next question is: was Isaac a consenting adult?

Well; according to Gen 22:6-7, Isaac was old enough to shoulder a load of wood; so he wasn't a little boy like so many people like to think he was. Plus, he was mature enough to understand the particulars of a burnt offering.

If the narrative's chronology is tight, then the next event in Isaac's life was the death of his mother at 127 (Gen 23:1-2). She was 90 when Isaac was born (Gen 17:17) making him quite possibly around 37 at the time of the Akedah.

Another Old Testament example is located in the 53rd chapter of Isaiah.


NOTE: According to Gen 18:23-33, Abraham wasn't above challenging God's sense of right and wrong. Had the old boy seriously believed that offering his son Isaac as a burnt offering was wrong, he would've said something; in point of fact, he had three days to think about it. (Gen 22:4)

POP CLOCK UPDATE: 81 days have elapsed since beginning the thread. If the figures in post #1 are in the ball park, then something like 4,934,196 new arrivals have checked into the fiery sector of hades since Sept 24, 2018.
_
Title: Re: Hell's Population Clock
Post by: Bladerunner on December 14, 2018, 07:31:15 pm
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Q: Can you cite an Old Testament example where God approved human sacrifice?

A: Abraham lived a pretty good number of years before Israel's covenanted law was instituted. Therefore, he wasn't obligated to comply with it because biblical law doesn't have ex post facto jurisdiction; viz: it isn't retroactive. (Deut 5:2-4, Rom 4:15, Rom 5:13, and Gal 3:17)

So then, Abraham was in a position to offer a human sacrifice without incurring guilt; which he did.

● Gen 22:1-2 . . Now it came about after these things, that God tested Abraham, and said to him: Abraham! And he said: Here I am. And He said: Take now your son, your only son, whom you love, Isaac, and go to the land of Moriah; and offer him there as a burnt offering on one of the mountains of which I will tell you.

Did Abraham slay Isaac? No, but did Abraham offer Isaac? Yes.

● Gen 22:9 . .Then they came to the place of which God had told him. And Abraham built an altar there and placed the wood in order; and he bound Isaac his son and laid him on the altar, upon the wood.

You see, once a gift dedicated to God is placed on an altar, it's a done deal-- whether the offering is dead or alive makes no difference. In point of fact, the letter to Hebrews credits Abraham with offering his son in obedience to God's command.

● Heb 11:17 . . By faith Abraham, when he was tested, offered up Isaac, and he who had received the promises offered up his only begotten son

Had God disapproved human sacrifice, He would've stopped Abraham before Isaac was laid on the altar.

So then, the next question is: was Isaac a consenting adult?

Well; according to Gen 22:6-7, Isaac was old enough to shoulder a load of wood; so he wasn't a little boy like so many people like to think he was. Plus, he was mature enough to understand the particulars of a burnt offering.

If the narrative's chronology is tight, then the next event in Isaac's life was the death of his mother at 127 (Gen 23:1-2). She was 90 when Isaac was born (Gen 17:17) making him quite possibly around 37 at the time of the Akedah.

Another Old Testament example is located in the 53rd chapter of Isaiah.


NOTE: According to Gen 18:23-33, Abraham wasn't above challenging God's sense of right and wrong. Had the old boy seriously believed that offering his son Isaac as a burnt offering was wrong, he would've said something; in point of fact, he had three days to think about it. (Gen 22:4)

POP CLOCK UPDATE: 81 days have elapsed since beginning the thread. If the figures in post #1 are in the ball park, then something like 4,934,196 new arrivals have checked into the fiery sector of hades since Sept 24, 2018.
_



I think there was something different going on here.

God had already told Abraham that Isaac would be the one who all the nations came from. Now, He tells him to sacrifice Him prior to his promise.... This simply was a way for GOD to test Abraham faith in HIM. One Abraham's side, He knew that if He killed Isaac, then God would have to resurrect him if His Promise was to be keep. Abraham loved and had faith in GOD. This is the reason why He was ready to sacrifice His son so readily without argument.

Blade

Title: Re: Hell's Population Clock
Post by: Olde Tymer on December 16, 2018, 09:08:02 am
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● Ex 20:5 . . I, the Lord your God, am a jealous God, visiting the iniquity of the fathers on the children, on the third and the fourth generations of those who hate Me.

Q: How is that fair? holding children responsible for what their parents do?

A: Ex 20:5-- along with Ex 34:7, Num 14:18, and Deut 5:9 --is often construed to mean that children are held responsible for their parents' sins; but that isn't it. What we're looking at here is collateral damage. It is apparently God's prerogative to get back at people by going after their posterity and/or the people they govern.

There's a horrific example of collateral damage located at Num 16:25-34.

Another is the Flood. No doubt quite a few underage children drowned in that event due to their parents' decadence.

The same happened to the children in Sodom and Gomorrah.

Ham's punishment for humiliating his father Noah was a curse upon his son Canaan.

A hundred and twenty thousand youngsters, along with livestock, would've perished in Nineveh had not the adults responded favorably to Jonah's preaching.

During Moses' face-off with Pharaoh, God moved against the man's firstborn son along with all those of his subjects.

There are times when God chooses to judge people by going after not only themselves; but also the things that pertain to them; including, but not limited to, their progeny. I don't quite understand the logic of that kind of justice; but then again: I don't try; I just go along with it; primarily because it's futile to find fault with God-- it's a foregone conclusion that even if He's in the wrong; you'll come out the loser.

● Isa 45:9 . . Destruction is certain for those who argue with their creator. Does a clay pot ever argue with its maker? Does the clay dispute with the one who shapes it, saying: Stop, you are doing it wrong! Does the pot exclaim: How clumsy can you be!


POP CLOCK UPDATE: 83 days have elapsed since beginning the thread. If the figures in post #1 are in the ball park, then something like 5,056,028 new arrivals have checked into the fiery sector of hades since Sept 24, 2018.
_
Title: Re: Hell's Population Clock
Post by: Bladerunner on December 17, 2018, 06:55:55 pm
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● Ex 20:5 . . I, the Lord your God, am a jealous God, visiting the iniquity of the fathers on the children, on the third and the fourth generations of those who hate Me.

Q: How is that fair? holding children responsible for what their parents do?

A: Ex 20:5-- along with Ex 34:7, Num 14:18, and Deut 5:9 --is often construed to mean that children are held responsible for their parents' sins; but that isn't it. What we're looking at here is collateral damage. It is apparently God's prerogative to get back at people by going after their posterity and/or the people they govern.

There's a horrific example of collateral damage located at Num 16:25-34.

Another is the Flood. No doubt quite a few underage children drowned in that event due to their parents' decadence.

The same happened to the children in Sodom and Gomorrah.

Ham's punishment for humiliating his father Noah was a curse upon his son Canaan.

A hundred and twenty thousand youngsters, along with livestock, would've perished in Nineveh had not the adults responded favorably to Jonah's preaching.

During Moses' face-off with Pharaoh, God moved against the man's firstborn son along with all those of his subjects.

There are times when God chooses to judge people by going after not only themselves; but also the things that pertain to them; including, but not limited to, their progeny. I don't quite understand the logic of that kind of justice; but then again: I don't try; I just go along with it; primarily because it's futile to find fault with God-- it's a foregone conclusion that even if He's in the wrong; you'll come out the loser.

● Isa 45:9 . . Destruction is certain for those who argue with their creator. Does a clay pot ever argue with its maker? Does the clay dispute with the one who shapes it, saying: Stop, you are doing it wrong! Does the pot exclaim: How clumsy can you be!


POP CLOCK UPDATE: 83 days have elapsed since beginning the thread. If the figures in post #1 are in the ball park, then something like 5,056,028 new arrivals have checked into the fiery sector of hades since Sept 24, 2018.
_


Of course you did...Did WHAT? Misread it,,,,,,"you said .."on the third and the fourth generations of those who hate Me.[/b]

try reading it literally!

Blade


Title: Re: Hell's Population Clock
Post by: Olde Tymer on December 18, 2018, 07:09:27 am
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Q: Doesn't Acts 2:24-33 say Christ went to hell at his death?

A: The koiné Greek word for "hell" in that passage of the KJV is haides [haw'-dace) a.k.a. hades, which is an ambiguous word for the netherworld-- an afterlife sphere where everybody goes when they pass on; both the good and the bad and the young and the old. Although haides can include fiery suffering in the afterlife (e.g. Luke 16:23) it doesn't always mean that because the netherworld location to which Christ departed was pleasant.

● Luke 23:39-43 . . One of the criminals hanging beside him scoffed: So you're the Messiah, are you? Prove it by saving yourself-- and us, too, while you're at it! But the other criminal protested: Aren't you afraid of God? Not even when you're dying? We deserve to die for our evil deeds, but this man hasn't done anything wrong. Then he said: Jesus, remember me when you come into your kingdom. And Jesus replied: I assure you; today you will be with me in paradise.

The koiné Greek word for "paradise" is paradeisos (par-ad'-i-sos) which means: a park; defined as: 1) a tract of land that often includes lawns, woodland, and pasture attached to a country house and is used as a game preserve and for recreation, and/or 2) a piece of ground in or near a city or town kept for ornament and recreation, and/or 3) an area maintained in its natural state as a public property.

Q: If Jesus went to paradise on the day of his death, then why did he tell Mary Magdalene three days later at John 20:17 that he had not yet ascended to his Father?

A: Paradise is structured somewhat like the Pacific Crest Trail (a.k.a. PCT) which traverses the north/south length of three states-- California, Oregon, and Washington. No matter which of the three states you might encounter trekkers at any given moment-- whether south in Campo San Diego, or crossing the Bridge Of The Gods in Cascade Locks Oregon, or Snoqualmie Pass Washington --they're all on the very same PCT.

Paradise is sort of like that. There's a section underground (Matt 12:40, Luke 16:19-31) another in a celestial region called the third heaven (2Cor 12:2-4) and yet another section located up in God's neck of the woods. (Rev 2:7)

According to Matt 12:40, John 20:17, and Acts 2:24-32; Christ didn't go up during his demise, rather, he went down. I'm guessing the section of paradise to which he and the other guy departed was the very same one where Abraham and Lazarus were situated in the 16th chapter of Luke.


POP CLOCK UPDATE: 85 days have elapsed since beginning the thread. If the figures in post #1 are in the ball park, then something like 5,177,860 new arrivals have checked into the fiery sector of hades since Sept 24, 2018.
_
Title: Re: Hell's Population Clock
Post by: Bladerunner on December 19, 2018, 09:36:36 pm
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Q: Doesn't Acts 2:24-33 say Christ went to hell at his death?

A: The koiné Greek word for "hell" in that passage of the KJV is haides [haw'-dace) a.k.a. hades, which is an ambiguous word for the netherworld-- an afterlife sphere where everybody goes when they pass on; both the good and the bad and the young and the old. Although haides can include fiery suffering in the afterlife (e.g. Luke 16:23) it doesn't always mean that because the netherworld location to which Christ departed was pleasant.


 You are reading about the Hades from Greek methology and I will give you GOD's WORD about HELL...Luk 16:19
Here, Jesus' words tells us about hell through the rich-man.


● Luke 23:39-43 . . One of the criminals hanging beside him scoffed: So you're the Messiah, are you? Prove it by saving yourself-- and us, too, while you're at it! But the other criminal protested: Aren't you afraid of God? Not even when you're dying? We deserve to die for our evil deeds, but this man hasn't done anything wrong. Then he said: Jesus, remember me when you come into your kingdom. And Jesus replied: I assure you; today you will be with me in paradise.

Again through Luke 23:39-43, we see that Jesus is in Abram's Bosom. This is a holding place for those souls who followed the law as best they could and having faith in God (the father from the OT), This is what Jesus will call Paradise. When He leaves in three days he will take the captives with him. This will be the entire resurrection of those in Abram's Bosom to Heaven named Paradise by JESUS and Paul. (2co 12-4, Rev 2-7)




The koiné Greek word for "paradise" is paradeisos (par-ad'-i-sos) which means: a park; defined as: 1) a tract of land that often includes lawns, woodland, and pasture attached to a country house and is used as a game preserve and for recreation, and/or 2) a piece of ground in or near a city or town kept for ornament and recreation, and/or 3) an area maintained in its natural state as a public property.

 Strong's G387-Paradeisos....(παράδεισος parádeisos, par-ad'-i-sos; of Oriental origin (compare H6508); a park, i.e. (specially), an Eden (place of future happiness, "paradise"):—paradise.)
Don't know where you got your def. but here is the Strong's definition of the G387--Paradeisos.   Is this not what Heaven is suppose to be.


Q: If Jesus went to paradise on the day of his death, then why did he tell Mary Magdalene three days later at John 20:17 that he had not yet ascended to his Father?

When Jesus died, He went to Abram's Bosom. While not a paradise, not a bad place. after three days, He had not ascended to His Father although He did have his transfigured body.  We see this throughout the next 40 days he is on earth. He appears within the upper room even thought the door is locked and not by walking through the walls,but by simply appearing in the middle of the room. Scientifically, this is one of the extra dimensions this transfigured body has (time). (We will be like that one day as we will see HIM as HE is.)



A: Paradise is structured somewhat like the Pacific Crest Trail (a.k.a. PCT) which traverses the north/south length of three states-- California, Oregon, and Washington. No matter which of the three states you might encounter trekkers at any given moment-- whether south in Campo San Diego, or crossing the Bridge Of The Gods in Cascade Locks Oregon, or Snoqualmie Pass Washington --they're all on the very same PCT.

Paradise is sort of like that. There's a section underground (Matt 12:40, Luke 16:19-31) another in a celestial region called the third heaven (2Cor 12:2-4) and yet another section located up in God's neck of the woods. (Rev 2:7)

You dare to compare something on earth to Rev 2:7 :"He that hath an ear, let him hear what the Spirit saith unto the churches; To him that overcometh will I give to eat of the tree of life, which is in the midst of the paradise of God."



According to Matt 12:40, John 20:17, and Acts 2:24-32; Christ didn't go up during his demise, rather, he went down. I'm guessing the section of paradise to which he and the other guy departed was the very same one where Abraham and Lazarus were situated in the 16th chapter of Luke.[/size]

Until Jesus' death, all souls believing in GOD and following the law as best as they could went to Abram's Bosom. After the Death, Burial and Resurrection  (1 Cor 15:1-4) of Jesus Christ, all death results in burial of the body and the souls resides in a special place in heaven until Jesus returns to collect His Bride. The Harpazo-Rapture


POP CLOCK UPDATE: 85 days have elapsed since beginning the thread. If the figures in post #1 are in the ball park, then something like 5,177,860 new arrivals have checked into the fiery sector of hades since Sept 24, 2018.
_
[/font]

There are a lot more people to find their way to that area Old Timer in the LITTLE time we all have left.. In fact the Bible tells us that Hell has increase in size.  Isa 5:14

Blade


Title: Re: Hell's Population Clock
Post by: Olde Tymer on December 20, 2018, 07:53:47 am
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As if hell isn't bad enough, people are in it as their selves; viz: they are never going to be free from their own personalities-- their phobias, their hang-ups, their inner conflicts, their memories, their anger, their hostility, their rivalries, their prejudice, their bias, their angst, their gender issues, their resentments, their regrets, their disappointments, their bitterness, their animosity, their passions, and their appetites.

Hell is even more of a hell than you might think because, having missed out on the regeneration about which Christ spoke at John 3:3-8, people take who they are right along with them down there.

Thus; suicide is not a good way to relieve depression. Depressed people and/or despondent people, take that low state of mind right along with them to the other side; and their sorrow will be even more intensified in fire when they realize that as bad as things were up here on the surface, their situation up here wasn't nearly as bad as their situation down below.

You can escape poor health via death, you can escape credit card debt, you can escape an abusive spouse, you can escape taxes, you can escape a physical handicap, you can escape pimples, you can escape a bully, you can escape despots and tyrants, you can escape a life of neither promise nor future, you can escape prison, you can escape grinding poverty, and you can escape the Mafioso; but nobody can escape themselves.

"You've made this day a special day, by just your being you.
There's no person in the whole world like you;
And I like you just the way you are."

(Fred Rogers, a.k.a. Mister Rogers)

Well; I appreciate Fred's work with children; but the fact of the matter is: there are grown-ups out there who do not feel special nor do they particularly like the way they are; and that's never going to change should they end up in the wrong place when they leave this life.

POP CLOCK UPDATE: 87 days have elapsed since beginning the thread. If the figures in post #1 are in the ball park, then something like 5,299,692 new arrivals have checked into the fiery sector of hades since Sept 24, 2018.
_
Title: Re: Hell's Population Clock
Post by: Olde Tymer on December 22, 2018, 09:56:07 am
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Q: What sane father would condemn His own children to eternal punishment simply because they don't agree with him?

A: While visiting Athens, Paul said the below:

"For in Him we live and move and have our being. As some of your own poets have said: We are his offspring. Therefore since we are God's offspring . . . yada, yada, yada." (Acts 17:27-29)

From that passage, quite a few folk have concluded that humanity is God's progeny the same as Christ. But we know for a fact that humanity's association with God isn't by means of biological reproduction. Humanity is God's handiwork; His creation. (Gen 1:26-27, Gen 2:7, Matt 19:4)

So, in order for individuals to get in God's family, and thus be counted as His bona fide posterity, they have to undergo a special adoption process.

"When the fulness of the time came, God sent forth His son-- born of a woman, born under the Law --in order that He might redeem those who were under the Law, that we might receive the adoption as sons." (Gal 4:3-6)

But in order to get in on that particular adoption, people have to first undergo creation all over again.

"As many as received Him, to them He gave the right to become children of God, even to those who believe in His name, who were born not of blood, nor of the will of the flesh, nor of the will of man, but of God." (John 1:12-13)

"Don't be surprised at my statement that you must be born again." (John 3:7)

Bottom line: God doesn't condemn the members of His own family to eternal punishment; but He won't hesitate to condemn yours if they neglect to follow Christ's instructions.

"I assure you: unless you are born again, you can never see the Kingdom of God." (John 3:3)


POP CLOCK UPDATE: 89 days have elapsed since beginning the thread. If the figures in post #1 are in the ball park, then something like 5,299,692 new arrivals have checked into the fiery sector of hades since Sept 24, 2018.
_
Title: Re: Hell's Population Clock
Post by: Olde Tymer on December 24, 2018, 09:47:28 am
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I was once challenged by an Atheist that if I believed so strongly in the existence of a hell; then what was I doing for people down there.

Well; I had to tell the Atheist that although it isn't God's wishes that people end up suffering in hell, it is His wishes that they suffer once they get there. So that even if it were in my power to do something to make their situation a bit more tolerable and/or a bit more comfortable-- which it isn't --I wouldn't dare attempt to circumvent God's wishes; and neither would Christ.

● John 4:34 . . My food is to do the will of Him that sent me.

● John 8:29 . . And he that sent me is with me: the Father hath not left me alone; for I do always those things that please him.

● John 10:30 . . I and my Father are unified.

That means Christ wouldn't have protested, nor interfered, in either Noah's Flood or the fiery destruction of Sodom and Gomorrah; even though a number of infants and underage children went to their deaths as collateral damage in both events.

● John 5:19 . .Whatever the Father does, the Son also does.


POP CLOCK UPDATE: 91 days have elapsed since beginning the thread. If the figures in post #1 are in the ball park, then something like 5,543,356 new arrivals have checked into the fiery sector of hades since Sept 24, 2018.
_
Title: Re: Hell's Population Clock
Post by: Olde Tymer on December 26, 2018, 10:10:57 am
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Many years ago-- when I was a young single guy in his early twenties, living alone in a cheap rental --as I was listening to a radio preacher talk about hell, something in my mind took over; and I had the strangest sensation of falling off the earth into an abyss and nobody cared, nor did anybody miss me, nor did my disappearance cause any alarm nor make any difference.

The freeways remained busy with frustrated drivers and honking horns, people still got up to go to work, shoppers crowded the supermarkets and department stores, kids caught their buses to school, birds kept right on chirping, grass kept on growing, ocean waves went on rolling onto the beach, trains kept running, airlines kept flying, clouds moved across the sky; and all that.

My absence changed nothing nor disturbed anyone nor anything. The world was utterly indifferent; it kept right on turning, clocks went on ticking; and nature and man went right on with their business as usual without the slightest hiccup. At that moment I realized just how alone and how obscure people must feel when they exhale their final breath and cross over to the other side.

Back in March of 2015, Andrew Getty, an heir to J. Paul Getty's oil fortune, died at the age of 47. In life, Andrew had many friends. You know how many accompanied him on his journey across the river Styx? Nary a one.

You gotta walk that lonesome valley,
You gotta walk it by yourself,
Nobody here can walk it for you,
You gotta walk it by yourself.

(Woody Guthrie)

POP CLOCK UPDATE: 93 days have elapsed since beginning the thread. If the figures in post #1 are in the ball park, then something like 5,665,188 new arrivals have checked into the fiery sector of hades since Sept 24, 2018.
_
Title: Re: Hell's Population Clock
Post by: Bladerunner on December 26, 2018, 11:26:12 pm
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Many years ago-- when I was a young single guy in his early twenties, living alone in a cheap rental --as I was listening to a radio preacher talk about hell, something in my mind took over; and I had the strangest sensation of falling off the earth into an abyss and nobody cared, nor did anybody miss me, nor did my disappearance cause any alarm nor make any difference.

The freeways remained busy with frustrated drivers and honking horns, people still got up to go to work, shoppers crowded the supermarkets and department stores, kids caught their buses to school, birds kept right on chirping, grass kept on growing, ocean waves went on rolling onto the beach, trains kept running, airlines kept flying, clouds moved across the sky; and all that.

My absence changed nothing nor disturbed anyone nor anything. The world was utterly indifferent; it kept right on turning, clocks went on ticking; and nature and man went right on with their business as usual without the slightest hiccup. At that moment I realized just how alone and how obscure people must feel when they exhale their final breath and cross over to the other side.

Back in March of 2015, Andrew Getty, an heir to J. Paul Getty's oil fortune, died at the age of 47. In life, Andrew had many friends. You know how many accompanied him on his journey across the river Styx? Nary a one.

You gotta walk that lonesome valley,
You gotta walk it by yourself,
Nobody here can walk it for you,
You gotta walk it by yourself.

(Woody Guthrie)

POP CLOCK UPDATE: 93 days have elapsed since beginning the thread. If the figures in post #1 are in the ball park, then something like 5,665,188 new arrivals have checked into the fiery sector of hades since Sept 24, 2018.
_


I disagree Ole Timer..You said:
You gotta walk that lonesome valley,
You gotta walk it by yourself,
Nobody here can walk it for you,
You gotta walk it by yourself.
(Woody Guthrie)"

One always has someone to talk to, someone to cry to, someone to tell their sad stories and someone who will bring you up from the very lows you have fallen to. The Holy Spirit is who I speak of and to get HIM there is another to believe and have faith in first. Jesus Christ  (1 Cor 15:1-4)

Blade

Title: Re: Hell's Population Clock
Post by: Olde Tymer on December 28, 2018, 08:00:22 am
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When people waken at night within a burning home, and the hallways are obscured by smoke and fire: at that moment, all things-- appointments, charge card balances, student debt, retirement, the glass ceiling, GMO, women's rights, LGBT marriage, Obama care, abortion, water on Mars, illegal immigration, Hillary's emails, President Trump's wall, #MeToo, ISIS, Kim Jong-un, Carrington events, the San Andreas fault, Dow-Jones, Dancing With The Stars, who's at fault for Benghazi, or who's playing in the Super Bowl; whatever --pale in comparison to the importance of finding a way out before it's too late.

In the face of imminent death; with the flames of hell already licking around your naked legs; it's at a time like that when you'd better hope to God that your spiritual leaders haven't steered you down the wrong road because there will be neither time nor opportunity to seek a second opinion.


POP CLOCK UPDATE: 95 days have elapsed since beginning the thread. If the figures in post #1 are in the ball park, then something like 5,787,020 new arrivals have checked into the fiery sector of hades since Sept 24, 2018.
_
Title: Re: Hell's Population Clock
Post by: Olde Tymer on December 30, 2018, 01:01:01 pm
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● Gen 6:5 . .And God saw that the wickedness of man was great in the earth, and that every imagination of the thoughts of his heart was only evil continually.

It's freaky to contemplate that the Bible's God has a way to eavesdrop on one's mental processes on a level with which we are mostly unfamiliar.

● Matt 15:18-19 . . For out of the heart proceed evil thoughts

So then, it's not how your mind works that defines you, no, it's how your heart works that defines you; and a man's heart is easily capable of hoodwinking his own consciousness.

● Jer 17:9 . . The human heart is most deceitful and desperately wicked. Who really knows how bad it is?

There is a part of us that psychology labels the subconscious; which in Freud's opinion is a repository for socially unacceptable ideas, wishes or desires, traumatic memories, and painful emotions put out of mind by the mechanism of psychological repression. However, the contents do not necessarily have to be solely negative.

In the psychoanalytic view, the subconscious is a force that can only be recognized by its effects-- in other words: your mind's thoughts can be construed not as replicas of your hearts thoughts; but rather, as symptoms of your heart's thoughts.

The key word in the above is repression. God is able to de-suppress those repressed contents and submit them as evidence in the prosecution's case against the accused. That means He will be confronting people with things that they never before really knew about themselves; and that's why I sometimes say only a fool would take their chances with the Bible's God. They have no clue the extent of the psychological tsunami they're walking into.


POP CLOCK UPDATE: 97 days have elapsed since beginning the thread. If the figures in post #1 are in the ball park, then something like 5,908,852 new arrivals have checked into the fiery sector of hades since Sept 24, 2018.
_
Title: Re: Hell's Population Clock
Post by: Olde Tymer on January 01, 2019, 09:44:34 am
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● Luke 12:15-20 . . A man's life does not consist in the abundance of his possessions. And he told them this parable:

. . .The ground of a certain rich man produced a good crop. He thought to himself: What shall I do? I have no place to store my crops. Then he said: This is what I'll do. I will tear down my barns and build bigger ones, and there I will store all my grain and my goods. And I'll say to myself; You have plenty of good things laid up for many years. Take life easy; eat, drink and be merry.

. . . But God said to him: You fool! This very night your life will be demanded from you. Then who will get what you have prepared for yourself?

That is one of the futilities of success in this world. Everybody knows it, but moguls like Mark Zuckerberg, Steve Jobs, Phil Knight, Paul Allen, Bill Gates, and Warren Buffet et al never seem to take it to heart until they've got one foot in the grave.

I once heard a story about a very wealthy man who died. His surviving relatives were all called to the reading of the man's will while the media waited outside. When the reading was over, the media asked the man's kin how much he left. They replied: He left it all.

Yes, of course he left it all; even the clothing he wore to his own funeral.

The paintings of Gustave Doré, illustrating portions of Dante's Inferno, depict lost souls 100% stark naked-- clothed with nary a stitch --as they should be because no doubt they are.

The Beetles once complained in song: Money can't buy me love. Well; it couldn't buy them time either-- John is gone, and so is George.

● Ecc 2:14-16 . .The wise man has eyes in his head, while the fool walks in the darkness; but I came to realize that the same fate overtakes them both.

. . .Then I thought in my heart: The fate of the fool will overtake me also. What then do I gain by being wise? For the wise man, like the fool, will not be long remembered; in days to come both will be forgotten. Like the fool, the wise man too must die.


POP CLOCK UPDATE: 99 days have elapsed since beginning the thread. If the figures in post #1 are in the ball park, then something like 6,030,684 new arrivals have checked into the fiery sector of hades since Sept 24, 2018.
_
Title: Re: Hell's Population Clock
Post by: Olde Tymer on January 03, 2019, 12:35:18 pm
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According to Siddhartha Gautama, the inventor of Buddhism, there is no personal "soul" that continues to exist beyond the demise of one's organic body; ergo: one's original self no longer exists after death.

Q: So then in Buddhist rebirth; what is reborn if not the person?

A: Buddhist rebirth is not a resurrection, rather, a reincarnation; viz: a rearrangement of the karmic matter that was once a particular individual. The complete teaching is a bit complex but in a nutshell, Buddhists can expect to return as either gods, asuras, hungry ghosts, hell beings, animals, and/or humans.

In addition: reincarnation doesn't stop with one event; but is potentially a cycle of birth, misery, and death called samsara.

Christianity allots but one physical return per person (Dan 12:2, John 5:29, Rev 20:5-6). So then, those who undergo a second death in the reservoir of brimstone depicted at Rev 20:10-15 won't be coming back for a do-over because they will have used up their one allotted resurrection in order to face justice at the Great White Throne.


POP CLOCK UPDATE: 101 days have elapsed since beginning the thread. If the figures in post #1 are in the ball park, then something like 6,152,516 new arrivals have checked into the fiery sector of hades since Sept 24, 2018.
_
Title: Re: Hell's Population Clock
Post by: Olde Tymer on January 05, 2019, 08:27:59 pm
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POSIT: Since God created us the way we are; then He is ultimately responsible for our conduct.

RESPONSE: Some years ago I went into a music store in San Diego and noticed that one of the store's glass display cases contained a rather large variety of curious bottles. So I asked the clerk what they were. He said they were bongs. You mean for smoking dope? I asked. He replied: Yes; that is their purpose. So I responded: But isn't dope illegal? He replied: Yes, dope is illegal, however we don't sell dope; we only sell the means to smoke it. You see; the responsibility for smoking dope was on the end-users of bongs rather than upon the sellers of bongs.

In a similar incident, I went into an electronics store to purchase a mobile CB radio and noticed an array of devices in the display case that I didn't recognize. The clerk told me they were linear amplifiers; which, he said, are devices for boosting a standard 5-watt CB's signal strength. I asked the clerk if that was legal. He said no, it isn't legal to boost the standard signal. However, he said: it isn't illegal to own equipment with the capability to do so. In other words; the law placed the responsibility for boosting CB signals on the end-user of linear amplifiers rather than the sellers of linear amplifiers.

What I'm getting at is: God created humanity with the capability to make bad choices. But at the same time, He created humanity with the capability to make good choices too. In the incident involving the tree of the knowledge of good and evil; Adam chose poorly. Does it make sense to blame God for Adam's choice? No; he was fully advised of both the ban and the consequence.

But you see: so-called "product liability" is a convenient way of blaming others for our own failings. In other words: product liability's proponents insist that the availability of things like forbidden fruit, bongs, and linear amplifiers constitutes enablement. So these days instead of saying "The devil made me do it; therefore my conduct is his fault" now people say "I was provided the means to do it; therefore my conduct is the provider's fault."

Many of the liquid products we have under our sinks and out in the garage are toxic; so manufacturers put warning labels on them. Now; placing those products for sale to the public constitutes enablement, but they're assuming you're intelligent enough to read the warning labels they put on the containers. If you ignore the warning labels; it's your own fault for being stupid.

A smart man won't test the limits, nor push his luck, nor tempt fate; viz: he won't eat forbidden fruit, smoke dope, boost his CB radio's output above the legal limits, or swallow toilet bowl cleaner and Prestone engine coolant just because those toxic products are available.


POP CLOCK UPDATE: 103 days have elapsed since beginning the thread. If the figures in post #1 are in the ball park, then something like 6,274,348 new arrivals have checked into the fiery sector of hades since Sept 24, 2018.
_
Title: Re: Hell's Population Clock
Post by: Olde Tymer on January 07, 2019, 10:35:39 am
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● Rev 20:11-15 . . I saw a great white throne, and Him that sat on it, from whose face the earth and the heaven fled away; and there was found no place for them. And I saw the dead, small and great, stand before God; and the books were opened: and another book was opened, which is the book of life. And if anyone's name was not found written in the book of life, he was thrown into the lake of fire.

According to Rev 20:10, the lake of fire consists of brimstone; defined by Webster's as sulfur; which liquifies at around 239.38° F and boils at around 832.3° F.

Molten sulfur assumes a dark red color at around 392° F which, in all likelihood, enhances the lake's fiery appearance.

Q: What if people's execution in the brimstone isn't quick? I mean: the day of Adam's death began the moment he tasted the forbidden fruit; yet he continued to survive outside the garden of Eden for another 800 years after the birth of his son Seth. (Gen 5:4)

A: That is a distinct possibility.


POP CLOCK UPDATE: 105 days have elapsed since beginning the thread. If the figures in post #1 are in the ball park, then something like 6,396,180 new arrivals have checked into the fiery sector of hades since Sept 24, 2018.
_
Title: Re: Hell's Population Clock
Post by: Olde Tymer on January 09, 2019, 10:52:13 am
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Q: At Matt 16:18, Jesus said: "You are Peter, and upon this rock I will build my church; and the gates of the netherworld shall not prevail against it." What is the meaning of that verse?

A: Basically it's saying that should one of Christ's true believing followers slip through a crack and end up in the wrong place, they will be able to stroll right on out of there like a tourist in Paris; likely guided on their journey by a celestial being, maybe similar to Peter's experience when he escaped jail in Acts 12:3-11.

I should point out that if any one particular church were the "my church" that Christ spoke of in Matt 16:18, then none of its members-- not one --would end up in hell; but I suspect that all churches, regardless of their denominational affiliation, expect to lose a number of their followers to an uncertain fate; which reminds me of a line from the movie AVATAR spoken by Colonel Miles Quaritch, played by Stephen Lang, that goes like this:

It is my job to keep you alive.
I will not succeed . . not with all of you.


POP CLOCK UPDATE: 107 days have elapsed since beginning the thread. If the figures in post #1 are in the ball park, then something like 6,518,012 new arrivals have checked into the fiery sector of hades since Sept 24, 2018.
_
Title: Re: Hell's Population Clock
Post by: Bladerunner on January 10, 2019, 10:14:16 pm
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Q: At Matt 16:18, Jesus said: "You are Peter, and upon this rock I will build my church; and the gates of the netherworld shall not prevail against it." What is the meaning of that verse?

A: Basically it's saying that should one of Christ's true believing followers slip through a crack and end up in the wrong place, they will be able to stroll right on out of there like a tourist in Paris; likely guided on their journey by a celestial being, maybe similar to Peter's experience when he escaped jail in Acts 12:3-11.

I should point out that if any one particular church were the "my church" that Christ spoke of in Matt 16:18, then none of its members-- not one --would end up in hell; but I suspect that all churches, regardless of their denominational affiliation, expect to lose a number of their followers to an uncertain fate; which reminds me of a line from the movie AVATAR spoken by Colonel Miles Quaritch, played by Stephen Lang, that goes like this:

It is my job to keep you alive.
I will not succeed . . not with all of you.


POP CLOCK UPDATE: 107 days have elapsed since beginning the thread. If the figures in post #1 are in the ball park, then something like 6,518,012 new arrivals have checked into the fiery sector of hades since Sept 24, 2018.
_


This was Jesus telling Peter that HE will build His Church upon this ROCK (in the Name of Jesus Christ).

 No, Peter's name meant STONE

Blade
Title: Re: Hell's Population Clock
Post by: Olde Tymer on January 11, 2019, 09:06:28 am
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I once heard of a preacher asked by a young member of his congregation what he would have to do bad enough to wind up in hell.

The preacher answered: You don't have to do anything particularly bad to go to hell; no, just bide your time and you'll wind up there without even trying because hell is the default.


POP CLOCK UPDATE: 109 days have elapsed since beginning the thread. If the figures in post #1 are in the ball park, then something like 6,639,844 new arrivals have checked into the fiery sector of hades since Sept 24, 2018.
_
Title: Re: Hell's Population Clock
Post by: Olde Tymer on January 13, 2019, 10:01:25 am
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There's been a quite a bit of flap in the media of late about a gender issue called misogyny-- defined by Webster's as hatred of women --while very little flap about misandry; defined by Webster's as hatred of men.

In the end, it will be a man who casts women with gender-related anger into the lake of brimstone depicted at Rev 20:10-15 and permanently ruins any chances they might have had for happiness in the future. For all eternity, condemned man haters will grind their teeth with hot tears and white-knuckled fury that they ultimately lost out on everything because of one lone male's obsessive control over their lives.

● John 5:22-23 . .The Father judges no one, but has committed all judgment to the Son, that all should honor the Son just as they honor the Father.

● Acts 17:31 . . God has set a day when he will judge the world with justice by the man he has appointed


NOTE: Misandry and feminism aren't joined at the hip; viz: not all feminists hate men. Classical feminism is typically peaceful, objective, and political while misandry is typically malicious, emotional, and personal; i.e. classical feminism is typically persuasive and diplomatic, while misandry is typically demanding, hostile, implacable, and unreasonable. Classical feminism seeks equality with men, while misandry seeks to destroy men.

Seeing as how heaven is a place of peace, then bitter people seething with unresolved gender issues cannot be allowed there because they would turn heaven into a world of hatred, complaining, quarreling, and discontent like they've made the Earth.


POP CLOCK UPDATE: 111 days have elapsed since beginning the thread. If the figures in post #1 are in the ball park, then something like 6,761,676 new arrivals have checked into the fiery sector of hades since Sept 24, 2018.
_
Title: Re: Hell's Population Clock
Post by: Bladerunner on January 13, 2019, 08:27:59 pm
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There's been a quite a bit of flap in the media of late about a gender issue called misogyny-- defined by Webster's as hatred of women --while very little flap about misandry; defined by Webster's as hatred of men.

In the end, it will be a man who casts women with gender-related anger into the lake of brimstone depicted at Rev 20:10-15 and permanently ruins any chances they might have had for happiness in the future. For all eternity, condemned man haters will grind their teeth with hot tears and white-knuckled fury that they ultimately lost out on everything because of one lone male's obsessive control over their lives.

● John 5:22-23 . .The Father judges no one, but has committed all judgment to the Son, that all should honor the Son just as they honor the Father.

● Acts 17:31 . . God has set a day when he will judge the world with justice by the man he has appointed


NOTE: Misandry and feminism aren't joined at the hip; viz: not all feminists hate men. Classical feminism is typically peaceful, objective, and political while misandry is typically malicious, emotional, and personal; i.e. classical feminism is typically persuasive and diplomatic, while misandry is typically demanding, hostile, implacable, and unreasonable. Classical feminism seeks equality with men, while misandry seeks to destroy men.

Seeing as how heaven is a place of peace, then bitter people seething with unresolved gender issues cannot be allowed there because they would turn heaven into a world of hatred, complaining, quarreling, and discontent like they've made the Earth.


POP CLOCK UPDATE: 111 days have elapsed since beginning the thread. If the figures in post #1 are in the ball park, then something like 6,761,676 new arrivals have checked into the fiery sector of hades since Sept 24, 2018.
_


Olde Tymer.....tell me you are not preaching this garbage:"In the end, it will be a man who casts women with gender-related anger into the lake of brimstone depicted at Rev 20:10-15 and permanently ruins any chances they might have had for happiness in the future. For all eternity, condemned man haters will grind their teeth with hot tears and white-knuckled fury that they ultimately lost out on everything because of one lone male's obsessive control over their lives."

I would suggest staying with scripture and letting GOD decide who HE wants to throw into the Lake of Fire.

Blade
Title: Re: Hell's Population Clock
Post by: Olde Tymer on January 15, 2019, 02:44:04 pm
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Whether death in the lake of brimstone depicted at Rev 20:10-15 is quick or slow; surely either way no one wants such a fate in their future. It would be better to avoid the lake altogether and take up residence in the new cosmos where everyone is immortal and enjoying life to the fullest in a world where there is neither war, nor crime, nor poverty, nor hate, discontent, nor sickness.

The first death is mandatory, but not the second; there's a God-given way for people to get out of it that requires no merit on their part.

● 2Cor 5:19 . . God was in Christ reconciling the world to Himself, not counting their trespasses against them.
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In other words: when God makes peace with a sinner, He stops building an indictment against them and the previous indictment is thrown out; or rather I should say: it's resolved by means of Christ's crucifixion.

● Isa 53:6 . .We all, like sheep, have gone astray, each of us has turned to his own way; and The Lord has laid on him the iniquity of us all.

● 1John 2:2 . . He is the propitiation for our sins: and not for ours only, but also for the sins of the whole world.


POP CLOCK UPDATE: 113 days have elapsed since beginning the thread. If the figures in post #1 are in the ball park, then something like 6,883,508 new arrivals have checked into the fiery sector of hades since Sept 24, 2018.
_
Title: Re: Hell's Population Clock
Post by: Bladerunner on January 15, 2019, 10:31:25 pm
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Whether death in the lake of brimstone depicted at Rev 20:10-15 is quick or slow; surely either way no one wants such a fate in their future. It would be better to avoid the lake altogether and take up residence in the new cosmos where everyone is immortal and enjoying life to the fullest in a world where there is neither war, nor crime, nor poverty, nor hate, discontent, nor sickness.

The first death is mandatory, but not the second; there's a God-given way for people to get out of it that requires no merit on their part.

● 2Cor 5:19 . . God was in Christ reconciling the world to Himself, not counting their trespasses against them.
 .
In other words: when God makes peace with a sinner, He stops building an indictment against them and the previous indictment is thrown out; or rather I should say: it's resolved by means of Christ's crucifixion.

● Isa 53:6 . .We all, like sheep, have gone astray, each of us has turned to his own way; and The Lord has laid on him the iniquity of us all.

● 1John 2:2 . . He is the propitiation for our sins: and not for ours only, but also for the sins of the whole world.


POP CLOCK UPDATE: 113 days have elapsed since beginning the thread. If the figures in post #1 are in the ball park, then something like 6,883,508 new arrivals have checked into the fiery sector of hades since Sept 24, 2018.
_


Ole TImer...You sent this mail to me and I thought it was appropriate for others to see.

Ole Timersaid:".

Women are not a protected species. There are just as many, if not more, women in hell as men. God is not biased.

I don't know how old you are Bladerunner, nor the condition of your health; but I suggest using what time you have remaining to prepare yourself for the worst when you pass on to the other side."

It is so sad, that your heart seems to be that hard......

Blade


_
Title: Re: Hell's Population Clock
Post by: Bladerunner on January 15, 2019, 10:46:24 pm
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Whether death in the lake of brimstone depicted at Rev 20:10-15 is quick or slow; surely either way no one wants such a fate in their future. It would be better to avoid the lake altogether and take up residence in the new cosmos where everyone is immortal and enjoying life to the fullest in a world where there is neither war, nor crime, nor poverty, nor hate, discontent, nor sickness.

The first death is mandatory, but not the second; there's a God-given way for people to get out of it that requires no merit on their part.

● 2Cor 5:19 . . God was in Christ reconciling the world to Himself, not counting their trespasses against them.
 .
In other words: when God makes peace with a sinner, He stops building an indictment against them and the previous indictment is thrown out; or rather I should say: it's resolved by means of Christ's crucifixion.

● Isa 53:6 . .We all, like sheep, have gone astray, each of us has turned to his own way; and The Lord has laid on him the iniquity of us all.

● 1John 2:2 . . He is the propitiation for our sins: and not for ours only, but also for the sins of the whole world.


POP CLOCK UPDATE: 113 days have elapsed since beginning the thread. If the figures in post #1 are in the ball park, then something like 6,883,508 new arrivals have checked into the fiery sector of hades since Sept 24, 2018.
_


Ole TImer...You sent this mail to me and I thought it was appropriate for others to see.

Ole Timersaid:".

Women are not a protected species. There are just as many, if not more, women in hell as men. God is not biased.

I don't know how old you are Bladerunner, nor the condition of your health; but I suggest using what time you have remaining to prepare yourself for the worst when you pass on to the other side."

It is so sad, that your heart seems to be that hard......

Blade


_

There will be many who do not die the first death. 1 thes 4:16-17

Blade
Title: Re: Hell's Population Clock
Post by: Olde Tymer on January 17, 2019, 08:26:09 am
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● Luke 16:24-26 . . Father Abraham, have mercy on me, and send Lazarus so that he may dip the tip of his finger in water and cool off my tongue, for I am in agony in this flame. But Abraham said: Between us and you there is a great chasm fixed, so that those who wish to come over from here to you will not be able, and that none may cross over from there to us.

The Greek word for "great chasm" refers to a nondescript space, viz: a gap, without really specifying width, depth, or design. The distance across can't be too much otherwise Abraham and the rich man would've had trouble hearing and understanding one another's speech. Apparently translators assumed the gap was large so they added the word "great". It seems far more likely to me that the chasm Abraham spoke of is a sort of crevasse just wide enough to prevent pedestrian traffic and deep enough to discourage attempts.

Anyway, point being: I'm heaven-bound; but I'm not so sure about many of my friends, relatives, and associates. If they fail to make the cut, I'm crossing my fingers that there will be some way that I can contact them in the afterlife after we've all passed on. It disturbs me to think there's a possibility I might not be allowed to see any of them ever again until the day of our final good-byes during the event planned for Rev 20:11-15.


POP CLOCK UPDATE: 115 days have elapsed since beginning the thread. If the figures in post #1 are in the ball park, then something like 7,005,340 new arrivals have checked into the fiery sector of hades since Sept 24, 2018.
_
Title: Re: Hell's Population Clock
Post by: Bladerunner on January 17, 2019, 10:33:40 am
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● Luke 16:24-26 . . Father Abraham, have mercy on me, and send Lazarus so that he may dip the tip of his finger in water and cool off my tongue, for I am in agony in this flame. But Abraham said: Between us and you there is a great chasm fixed, so that those who wish to come over from here to you will not be able, and that none may cross over from there to us.

The Greek word for "great chasm" refers to a nondescript space, viz: a gap, without really specifying width, depth, or design. The distance across can't be too much otherwise Abraham and the rich man would've had trouble hearing and understanding one another's speech. Apparently translators assumed the gap was large so they added the word "great". It seems far more likely to me that the chasm Abraham spoke of is a sort of crevasse just wide enough to prevent pedestrian traffic and deep enough to discourage attempts.

Anyway, point being: I'm heaven-bound; but I'm not so sure about many of my friends, relatives, and associates. If they fail to make the cut, I'm crossing my fingers that there will be some way that I can contact them in the afterlife after we've all passed on. It disturbs me to think there's a possibility I might not be allowed to see any of them ever again until the day of our final good-byes during the event planned for Rev 20:11-15.


POP CLOCK UPDATE: 115 days have elapsed since beginning the thread. If the figures in post #1 are in the ball park, then something like 7,005,340 new arrivals have checked into the fiery sector of hades since Sept 24, 2018.
_



Ole Timer....,you said:" until the day of our final good-byes during the event planned for Rev 20:11-15"

Do you plan on being in that last group to be judged by Jesus. Just for the record, I am not going to be there as I follow the WORD of GOD. According to the WORD of GOD, the Church (Bride of Christ) is long in Heaven in translated Bodies, already judged for their works after having been saved in the BEMA SEAT Judgement.

LIKE the ROC, are you saying we can converse with the dead?????? The dead in Jesus (His Bride) are in Heaven in a special place awaiting the Harpozo (Rapture) to take place where they will be reunited with their bodies that are still on earth in graves. Do you not believe in that???

Rev 20:11-15 is for those unbelievers and those that are to be judged on their works.   

According to you, just what do we all need to do to get to heaven???????? Be specific now so we know where your position is.

Thank You Sir:

Blade

Title: Re: Hell's Population Clock
Post by: Olde Tymer on January 19, 2019, 04:22:54 pm
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During the 16th century, an Italian man named Niccolò Machiavelli wrote a political treatise titled The Prince. It's main theme is how to get power, and once you've got it; how to keep it.

The book's instructions apply to all forms of power whether in business, in government, the military, the mafioso, school boards, investment banking, and even religion and church management practices.

You might be surprised at the number and variety of famous, respectable people who've been influenced by The Prince, not only in the past, but right up to the very present. Machiavelli's book, like Sun Tzu's book The Art Of War, is timeless.

However; there's a hitch. Machiavelli's ideas work best when employed by monsters, i.e. sociopaths: because it's necessary to sacrifice integrity and conscience to make them work; i.e. it's necessary to become cruel, inhumane, and thoroughly indifferent to the principles of trust and honesty.

The word "Machiavellian" is in Webster's defined as: marked by cunning, duplicity, or bad faith, i.e. not guided by, or showing a concern for, what is right in respect to social norms and acceptable behavior.

In other words: it's not what's right that counts with Machiavellian personalities; it's what works, viz: they practice a sort of moral flexibility.

The Bible describes heaven as a place of peace. I think it goes without saying that Machiavellian personalities are not allowed there. For one, they would make heaven unbearable for the decent folk. For another, they would not fit in. And for another, their way of life would just end up turning heaven into another world like the one we're already living in.


POP CLOCK UPDATE: 117 days have elapsed since beginning the thread. If the figures in post #1 are in the ball park, then something like 7,127,172 new arrivals have checked into the fiery sector of hades since Sept 24, 2018.
_
Title: Re: Hell's Population Clock
Post by: Olde Tymer on January 21, 2019, 01:13:02 pm
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The apostle Paul expended quite a bit of time, energy, and writer's ink persuading Christ's believing followers that it's impossible to obtain heaven by means of compliance with the Ten Commandments. He didn't succeed; not with everyone. People still refused to believe him even though he claimed to have received his information straight from the horse's mouth.

● Gal 1:11-13 . . For I would have you know, brethren, that the gospel which was preached by me is not according to man. For I neither received it from man, nor was I taught it, but I received it through a revelation of Jesus Christ.

However, though it is impossible to obtain heaven by means of compliance with the Ten Commandments, it is essential to comply with them in order to stay in heaven; not just the Ten only, but all of God's commandments. And one's compliance cannot be spotty, it has to be consistent.

So; what's the secret to this apparent Catch-22?

The secret is found in a promise that God made to His people back in the Old Testament.

● Ezek 36:26-27 . . I will give you a new heart and put a new spirit into you: I will remove the heart of stone from your body and give you a tender heart; and I will put My spirit into you. Thus I will cause you to follow My laws and faithfully to observe My rules.

An "heart of flesh" would normally be regarded in modern Sunday school classes as a bad thing. Here in Ezekiel, flesh is juxtaposed with stone to indicate that God is talking about tenderness, gentleness, kindness, empathy, sensitivity, compassion, and deep affection; i.e. the warm, softer emotions.

A heart of stone is cold and dead, like those massive granite monoliths in Yosemite Valley. They feel not the slightest pity for climbers who lose their grip and fall. Nope, those big rocks just go on like nothing ever happened; silent, indifferent, unconcerned, non grieving, non compassionate, and unsympathetic; i.e. they feel nothing: nothing at all.

Bottom line: Seeing as how love is essential to proper compliance with the Ten Commandments; then the thoughtless, the callous, and the insensitive would be shut out of heaven forever and ever were it not for Ezek 36:26-27.

Watch as I deliberately paraphrase the following passages. Though the texts aren't verbatim quotes from the Bible; the message they convey is spot-on.

"I assure you: unless the inhumane are born again, they can never see the Kingdom of God." (John 3:3)

"Don't be surprised at my statement that people lacking the milk of human kindness must undergo a birth performed by the hand of God." (John 3:7)

Note that the birth performed by the hand of God, about which Jesus spoke, isn't optional; it's a must.


POP CLOCK UPDATE: 119 days have elapsed since beginning the thread. If the figures in post #1 are in the ball park, then something like 7,249,004 new arrivals have checked into the fiery sector of hades since Sept 24, 2018.
_
Title: Re: Hell's Population Clock
Post by: Olde Tymer on January 23, 2019, 12:37:41 pm
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● Lev 24:10-12 . . And the son of an Israelitish woman, whose father was an Egyptian, went out among the children of Israel: and this son of the Israelitish woman and a man of Israel strove together in the camp; and the Israelitish woman's son blasphemed the name of The Lord, and cursed.

. . . And they brought him unto Moses: (and his mother's name was Shelomith, the daughter of Dibri, of the tribe of Dan) And they put him in ward, that the mind of The Lord might be showed them.

That incident is a pretty good illustration of the current purpose of the fiery sector of hades. It's a place to hold people till the day when the mind of the Lord will be shown concerning them.

● Rev 20:13. . Death and hades gave up the dead that were in them, and each person was judged according to what he had done.


NOTE: Rev 20:13 is a record of things that the apostle John saw in the future; which means they're on the way, and only a matter of time now when they'll be seen in the present by everyone.

POP CLOCK UPDATE: 121 days have elapsed since beginning the thread. If the figures in post #1 are in the ball park, then something like 7,370,836 new arrivals have checked into the fiery sector of hades since Sept 24, 2018.
_
Title: Re: Hell's Population Clock
Post by: Olde Tymer on January 25, 2019, 11:40:49 am
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Rev 20:11-15 is commonly thought to be where everybody, the good and the bad, stand before God to determine their future.

But according to the text; only the dead will be called to account at the great white throne event. In point of fact; the dead are mentioned four times while the living aren't mentioned even once.

Not everyone alive is among the living. According to John 5:24, the living are defined as people who have eternal life. The dead, then, would be defined as people who don't have eternal life.


POP CLOCK UPDATE: 123 days have elapsed since beginning the thread. If the figures in post #1 are in the ball park, then something like 7,492,668 new arrivals have checked into the fiery sector of hades since Sept 24, 2018.
_
Title: Re: Hell's Population Clock
Post by: Bladerunner on January 25, 2019, 11:46:48 pm
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The apostle Paul expended quite a bit of time, energy, and writer's ink persuading Christ's believing followers that it's impossible to obtain heaven by means of compliance with the Ten Commandments. He didn't succeed; not with everyone. People still refused to believe him even though he claimed to have received his information straight from the horse's mouth.

● Gal 1:11-13 . . For I would have you know, brethren, that the gospel which was preached by me is not according to man. For I neither received it from man, nor was I taught it, but I received it through a revelation of Jesus Christ.

However, though it is impossible to obtain heaven by means of compliance with the Ten Commandments, it is essential to comply with them in order to stay in heaven; not just the Ten only, but all of God's commandments. And one's compliance cannot be spotty, it has to be consistent.

So; what's the secret to this apparent Catch-22?

The secret is found in a promise that God made to His people back in the Old Testament.

● Ezek 36:26-27 . . I will give you a new heart and put a new spirit into you: I will remove the heart of stone from your body and give you a tender heart; and I will put My spirit into you. Thus I will cause you to follow My laws and faithfully to observe My rules.

An "heart of flesh" would normally be regarded in modern Sunday school classes as a bad thing. Here in Ezekiel, flesh is juxtaposed with stone to indicate that God is talking about tenderness, gentleness, kindness, empathy, sensitivity, compassion, and deep affection; i.e. the warm, softer emotions.

A heart of stone is cold and dead, like those massive granite monoliths in Yosemite Valley. They feel not the slightest pity for climbers who lose their grip and fall. Nope, those big rocks just go on like nothing ever happened; silent, indifferent, unconcerned, non grieving, non compassionate, and unsympathetic; i.e. they feel nothing: nothing at all.

Bottom line: Seeing as how love is essential to proper compliance with the Ten Commandments; then the thoughtless, the callous, and the insensitive would be shut out of heaven forever and ever were it not for Ezek 36:26-27.

Watch as I deliberately paraphrase the following passages. Though the texts aren't verbatim quotes from the Bible; the message they convey is spot-on.

"I assure you: unless the inhumane are born again, they can never see the Kingdom of God." (John 3:3)

"Don't be surprised at my statement that people lacking the milk of human kindness must undergo a birth performed by the hand of God." (John 3:7)

Note that the birth performed by the hand of God, about which Jesus spoke, isn't optional; it's a must.


POP CLOCK UPDATE: 119 days have elapsed since beginning the thread. If the figures in post #1 are in the ball park, then something like 7,249,004 new arrivals have checked into the fiery sector of hades since Sept 24, 2018.
_


Have you considered that part of what you are saying is under the New Covenant with Israel?  Ezek 36:26-27

Blade
Title: Re: Hell's Population Clock
Post by: Olde Tymer on January 27, 2019, 01:37:35 pm
.
Jesus Christ had some pretty astounding capabilities. He could beef up withered limbs, cure cripples, cleanse leprosy, stop chronic bleeding, cure blindness, multiply food stuffs, calm storms, exorcise demons, restore dead people to life, and protect people from the wraith of God, etc.

In my estimation, a man who can do all that can just as easily do it in reverse; viz: wither people's limbs, cripple their legs, smite people with leprosy, make them bleed, cause them to go blind, cause famine, stir up storms, open people to demon possession and/or just outright assassinate them, and condemn them to hell; etc.

So, I'm sometimes curious why Christ's enemies weren't more afraid of him.


POP CLOCK UPDATE: 125 days have elapsed since beginning the thread. If the figures in post #1 are in the ball park, then something like 7,614,500 new arrivals have checked into the fiery sector of hades since Sept 24, 2018.
_
Title: Re: Hell's Population Clock
Post by: Olde Tymer on January 29, 2019, 09:43:03 am
.
I was brought up a Catholic youth. The extent of my Catechism classes was pretty elementary. They didn't inform me that Jesus Christ was returning some day to rule the world, so it wasn't till I was around 24 years old when a Protestant man asked me if I was ready for the Lord coming back.

Well; at first the man's question puzzled me because i wasn't aware of that aspect of the Earth's future. But then right away I became alarmed because I instinctively knew that if I had to face Christ, the outcome would not be favorable as I had a lot to answer for. I learned later that my instincts were right.

"As the weeds are pulled up and burned in the fire, so it will be at the end of the age. The Son of Man will send out his angels, and they will weed out of his kingdom everything that causes sin and all who do evil. They will throw them into the fiery furnace, where there will be weeping and gnashing of teeth." (Matt 13:40-42)


POP CLOCK UPDATE: 127 days have elapsed since beginning the thread. If the figures in post #1 are in the ball park, then something like 7,736,332 new arrivals have checked into the fiery sector of hades since Sept 24, 2018.
_
Title: Re: Hell's Population Clock
Post by: patrick jane on February 01, 2019, 01:32:45 pm
.
I was brought up a Catholic youth. The extent of my Catechism classes was pretty elementary. They didn't inform me that Jesus Christ was returning some day to rule the world, so it wasn't till I was around 24 years old when a Protestant man asked me if I was ready for the Lord coming back.

Well; at first the man's question puzzled me because i wasn't aware of that aspect of the Earth's future. But then right away I became alarmed because I instinctively knew that if I had to face Christ, the outcome would not be favorable as I had a lot to answer for. I learned later that my instincts were right.

"As the weeds are pulled up and burned in the fire, so it will be at the end of the age. The Son of Man will send out his angels, and they will weed out of his kingdom everything that causes sin and all who do evil. They will throw them into the fiery furnace, where there will be weeping and gnashing of teeth." (Matt 13:40-42)


POP CLOCK UPDATE: 127 days have elapsed since beginning the thread. If the figures in post #1 are in the ball park, then something like 7,736,332 new arrivals have checked into the fiery sector of hades since Sept 24, 2018.
_

Thinking of hell can lead to better behavior no doubt. I was Catholic too and asked my Nun Teacher if I was on my way to Confession and was hit by a car and killed in front of the church would I be forgiven? She said "No, you go to hell." I will never forget that.




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Title: Re: Hell's Population Clock
Post by: Bladerunner on February 02, 2019, 12:52:00 am
The Biblical Truth About Hell



What does the Bible say about hell? Is hell biblical? Do you want to know the truth about hell? Many people claim that Hell is the absence of God, but that is not what the Bible says.

If you look up the word Sheol in many Bible translations, you will find that it's often translated as “hell”, however, the modern concept of “hell” does not line up with the Biblical descriptions of Sheol. 

The word Sheol occurs sixty-five times in the Hebrew Bible. The King James Bible translates thirty-one of those occurrences as ‘hell’; another thirty-one as ‘grave’, and three occurrences as ‘pit’.

The word “hell” is used approximately fifty-four times in most Bibles, and is translated from several different words including "Sheol," "Hades," "Gehenna," and "Tartarus". All of these words have different meanings and usage in the Scriptures, and their collective translation as "hell" has caused major confusion about death.

The word Hell was derived from the Old English word "helle," and is related to the Old Norse goddess named "Hel". In its original use and etymology, the word Hell literally means "to cover, or conceal," and may have simply referred to the ground covering over the dead person. However, in many pagan cultures, it was believed that Hell (or Hades) was the underworld, and was ruled by the god of the dead.

The more popular modern version of this concept refers to a place of fiery torment, and is understood by many to be the home of Satan and his demons. It's believed that the unrighteous dead go immediately to hell to be tortured in flames for eternity. Many people also believe that Satan and his demons are in charge of actively torturing those damned souls. However, in spite of the fact that none of these ideas can be traced back to the Bible, they remain the popular mainstream view of hell today.

The Bible never says that Satan is in charge of Hell or even that he is currently living there, in fact, the Bible says that Satan will be cast into the lake of fire after the thousand year reign of the Messiah. 

The idea that Satan oversees Hell is rooted in the Greek belief in Hades as the god of the underworld.  When people say that Satan is in charge of Hell, they are rehearsing pagan mythology, and confessing Satan to be the god of the underworld, and participating in a modern “Christianized” version of the pantheon.

The Bible says that Satan will be bound in the bottomless pit during the thousand year reign of the Messiah, and that he will be released for a short time to deceive the nations before being cast into the lake of fire. The Bible also speaks of fallen angels who were imprisoned in Tartarus to be held for judgment.

The idea that Satan is the god of the underworld comes from various pagan religions including Ancient Egyptian, Babylonian, Greek, Persian, Roman, Germanic, and Celtic mythology, and is completely unbiblical.



15 minutes
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rvkgRy2KIdg&t=0s&index=9&list=WL





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Well, I guess all who hear this fellow will have to UNLEARN the LIES he is telling you. It is apparent that above author is living in the OT. where the good and the bad Souls went to HELL (Sheol, Hades).  ROC believes in a separated Hell and Perdition. Just about the same idea!

As we see beginning in Luke 16:19 and ending in Luke 16:31, a certain Rich Man clothed in Purple and fine linens  died and was buried. Lazarus (a beggar) die and the Angels carried him(his soul) to Abraham's Bosom.

Now we find out in verse 23 we find the rich man in HELL...(Sheol, Hades)....In verse 24, the rich man is being tormented by a FLAME? A flame in HELL....YES.....

In verse 23, the Rich Man sees Abraham afar off...WHERE---AFAR off?? Later Abraham describes Hell in totality...verse26... he tells us there is a gulf between Hell and the place HE is at (Abraham's Bosom). He also tells us that everyone of each area can see each other, talk to each other, etc.

So we have two boxes (areas) in HELL that are separate and provide different atmospheres within. Hell being a tormenting Flame and those in Abraham's Bosom, being comforted.   

Jesus answers certain questions we all have: The Rich man SOUL has all of His senses with him. He can taste, feel, see, hear, etc. His SOUL still has his mind with him as he tries to bargain with Abraham. He knows why He is in Hell and does not dispute it.

Hell ( a place of flames)is for the sinner of the OT through today.

Abraham's Bosom was for those that believed  in GOD (the Father) in the OT.

Abraham's Bosom was dissolved when Jesus was resurrected after He spent three days and nights in HELL (Abraham's Bosom). Jesus resurrected all those held within as OT Saints, and took them to Heaven where they call paradise. This is what Jesus said to the thief on the other cross beside him. Luke 23:43.."And Jesus said unto him, Verily I say unto thee, To day shalt thou be with me in paradise."

Other terms, I happen to disagree with the author of the video are as follows.

Hebrew- Sheol, (the place of the Dead) is used in the Bible to present both Hell the intermediate resting place of the sinning souls and to present Graves as the intermediate resting place for the bodies of the dead. While Sheol (plural for graves) and Sheol (singular for Hell) is seen in the Bible KJV.

The Greek Hades is divided into two separate places. The Greek thinking for Paradise (Elysium) and Tartarus, a dark place of punishment.

Tartarus represents the Bottomless pits. Tartarus is as far from hell as earth is from heaven,

Grave Yards are for the Bodies (only) of both Sinners and Believers

Gehenna is another story.. As  the above author correctly identified, it was originally the valley of Gai Ben-Hinnom - the valley of the sons of Hinnom - where at one time, children were sacrificed to the god Molech. Later, this area became a garbage dump and constantly being burned. Jesus refers to it as Hell or a place of constant Flames or as a Lake of FIRE and BRIMSTONE. (idiomatically)

Gehenna, in Revelation 20:14. Gehenna has no end; Hades, Hell are of this earth,Gehenna is outside the time dimension, Eternity.

Paradise is a place where the believing SOUL awaits resurrection with their Bodies. This paradise is in 3rd Heaven.

One last word, After the removal of Abraham's Bosom, Hell increased in size., apparently in anticipation of the multitudes of Sinners that will use it in the "end days"  Isa 5:14

You Soul does not sleep or rest in the Grave in either case , Heaven or Hell , only the mortal body.

Hell separates the Soul from the BODY and Gehenna separates the SOUL from GOD!

Blade







 
 
Title: Re: Hell's Population Clock
Post by: Olde Tymer on February 04, 2019, 12:36:17 pm
.
I recently watched a documentary on YouTube about Warren Buffet; the chairman and CEO of a very successful fund called Berkshire Hathaway. To date, he's like the third wealthiest man in the whole world; his net worth amounts to something like 84 billion dollars US.

Mr. Buffet identifies himself as an agnostic. Well; if traditional Christianity is correct, then we can expect that his afterlife situation will be the same as the wealthy man's depicted in Luke 16:19-31.


POP CLOCK UPDATE: 133 days have elapsed since beginning the thread. If the figures in post #1 are in the ball park, then something like 8,101,828 new arrivals have checked into the fiery sector of hades since Sept 24, 2018.
_
Title: Re: Hell's Population Clock
Post by: Bladerunner on February 04, 2019, 07:25:42 pm
.
I recently watched a documentary on YouTube about Warren Buffet; the chairman and CEO of a very successful fund called Berkshire Hathaway. To date, he's like the third wealthiest man in the whole world; his net worth amounts to something like 84 billion dollars US.

Mr. Buffet identifies himself as an agnostic. Well; if traditional Christianity is correct, then we can expect that his afterlife situation will be the same as the wealthy man's depicted in Luke 16:19-31.


POP CLOCK UPDATE: 133 days have elapsed since beginning the thread. If the figures in post #1 are in the ball park, then something like 8,101,828 new arrivals have checked into the fiery sector of hades since Sept 24, 2018.
_


I don't believe Warren Buffet is worthy of quoting for a Christianity spokesperson.

Blade
Title: Re: Hell's Population Clock
Post by: Olde Tymer on February 12, 2019, 12:44:57 pm
.
● Rom 12:12a . . Be glad for all God is planning for you.

Christians unsure of their afterlife destination cannot, in all honesty and a good conscience, comply with the above. For all they know, God has outer darkness planned for them. That's not something to be glad about.


POP CLOCK UPDATE: 141 days have elapsed since beginning the thread. If the figures in post #1 are in the ball park, then something like 8,589,156 new arrivals have checked into the fiery sector of hades since Sept 24, 2018.
_
Title: Re: Hell's Population Clock
Post by: Olde Tymer on February 19, 2019, 09:52:33 pm
.
● Rev 21:8 . . All liars; their part will be in the lake that burns with fire and brimstone, which is the second death.

How many murders must someone commit to become a murderer?

How many thefts must one commit to become a thief?

How many lies must one tell in order to become a liar?

Get my drift?


POP CLOCK UPDATE: 148 days have elapsed since beginning the thread. If the figures in post #1 are in the ball park, then something like 9,015,568 new arrivals have checked into the fiery sector of hades since Sept 24, 2018.
_
Title: Re: Hell's Population Clock
Post by: Bladerunner on February 19, 2019, 10:27:39 pm
.
The wrath of God is interesting. For example:

● Isa 13:9 . . Behold, the day of Christ comes-- cruel; with both wrath and fierce anger

The Hebrew word for "wrath" in that statement is 'ebrah (eb-raw') which indicates an outburst of passion. In other words: the wrath of God won't be weeping big wet crocodile tears while it's slamming the dead at the Great White Throne event depicted at Rev 20:11-15; no, they will be terminated with extreme prejudice; viz: their judgment will be administered with choler. (cf. Isa 63:1-6, Rev 19:15)

Webster's defines "fierce" as a behavior exhibited by humans and animals that inspires terror because of the wild and menacing aspect of fury in attack. Ferocity is an aspect commonly seen among roaring, snarling lions savagely attacking prey. There's neither sportsmanship nor sympathy in ferocity; only sheer terror, brutality, and blood lust.

"cruel" is defined as: disposed to inflict pain or suffering; viz: devoid of humane feelings

● Heb 10:27 . . A certain fearful expectation of . . . fiery indignation

"fiery indignation" is quite a bit more severe than ordinary indignation. It speaks of someone who is seriously ticked off; and so angry that they're actually red in the face.

There are people out there in pews all around the world who have been so coddled by sappy versions of Christianity that they have no concept of the magnitude of the lethal tsunami of rage and violence coming their way to get them.

Another interesting aspect of the wrath of God is the person appointed to administer it-- none other than the sweet little baby away in a manger.

● John 5:22-23 . .The Father judges no one, but has committed all judgment to the Son, that all should honor the Son just as they honor the Father.

● Acts 17:31 . . For God has set a day when he will judge the world with justice by the man he has appointed. He has given proof of this to all men by raising him from the dead.

● Rev 19:15 . . He shall rule them with a rod of iron: and he treads the winepress of the fierceness and wrath of Almighty God.


POP CLOCK UPDATE: 35 days have elapsed since beginning the thread. If the figures in post #1 are in the ball park, then something like 2,132,060 new arrivals have checked into the fiery sector of hades since Sept 24, 2018.
_


Olde Timer... Are these your personal post?

Blade
Title: Re: Hell's Population Clock
Post by: Olde Tymer on February 21, 2019, 11:58:28 am
.
Are these your personal post?

I don't use a robot, if that's what you mean. In point of fact, I wouldn't know how to use a robot even if I had access to one.

My hell comments nowadays are pretty much copy and paste from a big fat file of postings that I myself composed from scratch during the past twenty years beginning back in the days when Yahoo and Beliefnet had message boards.

You know, my writing style actually works against me. I don't know how many times I've been accused of plagiarism simply because my posts appear far too intelligent for a dumb old retired welder who barely finished high school. The really pathetic accusers are those who find my web site and then, not knowing I'm the author, say I stole from it; in effect saying I stole from myself (chuckle). Excuse me for laughing but you gotta keep a sense of humor on the internet or people will drive you to taking Prozac.
_
Title: Re: Hell's Population Clock
Post by: Olde Tymer on February 27, 2019, 09:06:24 pm
.
● Matt 25:41 . .Then he will say to those on his left: Depart from me, you who are cursed, into the eternal fire prepared for the Devil and his angels.

The Greek word for "angels" is aggelos (ang'-el-os) which is one of the Bible's many ambiguous words. It means messenger; and it isn't limited to spirit beings.

For example at Matt 11:10 it refers to John the Baptist. At Luke 7:24 it refers to John's disciples. At Acts 7:53 and Gal 3:19 it refers to divine apparitions in the form of voices, fire, smoke, earthquakes, and a human likeness. At Jas 2:25 it refers to the spies that hid out at Rahab's home. At Rev 1:20-Rev 3:14, the word aggelos refers to high-ranking church officers.

So, we have in view at Matt 25:41 not only spirit beings, but quite possibly also human beings who serve as messengers for the Devil, e.g. preachers, ministers, Sunday school teachers, deacons, missionaries, evangelists, cultists, etc; whose version of Christianity is a doctored version rather than Christ's.

● 2Cor 11:13-15 . . For such are false apostles, deceitful workmen, masquerading as apostles of Christ. And no wonder, for Satan himself masquerades as an angel of light. It is not surprising, then, if his servants masquerade as servants of righteousness. Their end will be what their actions deserve.

I have a personal interest in this matter. My eldest brother is a Friar; he and I are both now in our mid to late seventies. My brother has been spending his entire adult life obedient to Rome and propagating Catholicism. If it turns out that version of Christianity differs from Christ's, then my brother won't make it to safety when he passes on. His life's work will go up in smoke, and he'll be branded forever as one of the Devil's angels. That possibility does not set well with me.


POP CLOCK UPDATE: 156 days have elapsed since beginning the thread. If the figures in post #1 are in the ball park, then something like 9,502,896 new arrivals have checked into the fiery sector of hades since Sept 24, 2018.
_
Title: Re: Hell's Population Clock
Post by: Bladerunner on February 27, 2019, 10:36:50 pm
.
● Matt 25:41 . .Then he will say to those on his left: Depart from me, you who are cursed, into the eternal fire prepared for the Devil and his angels.

The Greek word for "angels" is somewhat ambiguous. It can refer to spirit beings and it can refer to human beings; it can also refer to phenomena like smoke, wind, fire, thunder, and earthquakes.

Angels are basically messengers, i.e. spokesmen, representatives and/or ambassadors. When human beings go through life in a way that works to the Devil's advantage; then they are his angels. It's unlikely that anyone with half a brain would knowingly assist the Devil so I'm guessing that quite a few of his people are doing so inadvertently.


POP CLOCK UPDATE: 156 days have elapsed since beginning the thread. If the figures in post #1 are in the ball park, then something like 9,502,896 new arrivals have checked into the fiery sector of hades since Sept 24, 2018.
_


Maybe you should try to teach everyone about Hell's Population clock by reviewing the Gospel of Jesus Christ in the NT. The Law of Moses does not pertain to Gentiles and Jews alike who are true believers in the Gospel of Jesus Christ (1 Cor 15:1-4).

Blade
Title: Re: Hell's Population Clock
Post by: patrick jane on May 14, 2019, 08:20:13 pm
Hey Old Tymer, did you finish the count? No more in hell? Great !!!















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Title: Re: Hell's Population Clock
Post by: Olde Tymer on May 15, 2019, 08:57:44 am
.
Hey Old Tymer, did you finish the count? No more in hell? Great !!!

I ran out of comments to accompany the clock. But if you don't mind a bit of testimony; then here goes.

I was baptized an infant into Roman Catholicism and subsequently completed enough catechism for First Holy Communion and Confirmation.

By the time I was twenty-four years old, I had resigned myself to a future in hell because by then I concluded that earning my way into heaven via Catholicism was hopeless. In order to do so I would have to comply with everything Rome teaches and stands for: the Commandments, the dogma, the rituals, the traditions, the Councils, the Bulls, the Encyclicals, the rites, the holy days of obligation, and the whole Catechism; plus the entire New Testament. That's a lot to remember, let alone put into practice.

Catholicism's requirements are just too demanding. You'd have to be divine in order to succeed, whereas I am only human; and that is a really big handicap.

It's easy to be human without even thinking about it because humanness comes natural to me. But it's not easy to be divine without thinking about it because divinity doesn't come natural to me. It's easier for me to think, feel, speak, and act like a termite than to think, feel, speak, and act like God.

And not only that; but Catholics can't slack off in heaven, i.e. they're not home free. In order to stay there, they have to continue complying with everything that Rome teaches and stands for; which includes Jesus' instructions.

"Everyone who listens to these words of mine but does not act on them will be like a fool who built his house on sand. The rain fell, the floods came, and the winds blew and buffeted the house. And it collapsed and was completely ruined." (Matt 7:26-27)

Council of Trent Session 6, Chapter 16, Canon16: If anyone says that he will for certain, with an absolute and infallible certainty, have that great gift of perseverance even to the end, unless he shall have learned this by a special revelation, let him be anathema.

Persevering to the end is one thing; but persevering throughout eternity? Is that even realistic?


POP CLOCK UPDATE: 233 days have elapsed since beginning the thread. If the figures in post #1 are in the ball park, then something like 14,193,428 new arrivals have checked into the fiery sector of hades since Sept 24, 2018.

NOTE: The entire global sky contains roughly six thousand stars visible to the naked eye. There's more than that out there of course, but not all are discernable as points of light without optics. However, we can't see all six thousand stars at once; only the ones that come out at night. So then; the most we can see in one night is, at most, somewhere around three thousand stars.

If we divide my latest pop clock figure by 3,000 we get something like four-thousand and thirty-one night skies of people who've passed on to the fiery nether regions since I began keeping track back in September.
_
Title: Re: Hell's Population Clock
Post by: Jesus Truth on May 15, 2019, 12:41:15 pm
Thank you Old Tymer.
Title: Re: Hell's Population Clock
Post by: Bladerunner on May 15, 2019, 09:58:02 pm
.
Hey Old Tymer, did you finish the count? No more in hell? Great !!!

I ran of comments to accompany the clock. But if you don't mind a bit of testimony; then here goes.

I was baptized an infant into Roman Catholicism and subsequently completed enough catechism for First Holy Communion and Confirmation.

By the time I was twenty-four years old, I had resigned myself to a future in hell because by then I concluded that earning my way into heaven via Catholicism was hopeless. In order to do so I would have to comply with everything Rome teaches and stands for: the Commandments, the dogma, the rituals, the traditions, the Councils, the Bulls, the Encyclicals, the rites, the holy days of obligation, and the whole Catechism; plus the entire New Testament. That's a lot to remember, let alone put into practice.

Catholicism's requirements are just too demanding. You'd have to be divine in order to succeed, whereas I am only human; and that is a really big handicap.

It's easy to be human without even thinking about it because humanness comes natural to me. But it's not easy to be divine without thinking about it because divinity doesn't come natural to me. It's easier for me to think, feel, speak, and act like a termite than to think, feel, speak, and act like God.

And not only that; but Catholics can't slack off in heaven, i.e. they're not home free. In order to stay there, they have to continue complying with everything that Rome teaches and stands for; which includes Jesus' instructions.

"Everyone who listens to these words of mine but does not act on them will be like a fool who built his house on sand. The rain fell, the floods came, and the winds blew and buffeted the house. And it collapsed and was completely ruined." (Matt 7:26-27)

Council of Trent Session 6, Chapter 16, Canon16: If anyone says that he will for certain, with an absolute and infallible certainty, have that great gift of perseverance even to the end, unless he shall have learned this by a special revelation, let him be anathema.

Persevering to the end is one thing; but persevering throughout eternity? Is that even realistic?


POP CLOCK UPDATE: 233 days have elapsed since beginning the thread. If the figures in post #1 are in the ball park, then something like 14,193,428 new arrivals have checked into the fiery sector of hades since Sept 24, 2018.

NOTE: The entire global sky contains roughly six thousand stars visible to the naked eye. There's more than that out there of course, but not all are discernable as points of light without optics. However, we can't see all six thousand stars at once; only the ones that come out at night. So then; the most we can see in one night is, at most, somewhere around three thousand stars.

If we divide my latest pop clock figure by 3,000 we get something like four-thousand and thirty-one night skies of people who've passed on to the fiery nether regions since I began keeping track back in September.
_


There will be many Catholics who recognize the Idolatry in the actions of praying to the Mother Mary or to any other Saint besides Jesus Christ.

I say there will be many from the RCC who have Salvation based upon the faith in Jesus Christ. The seven letters Jesus wrote to the Churches included the RCC and He made a promise to the over comers for salvation.

Until one dies, it is not too late change ones mind and make that all important decision.

As far as the RCC going to Hell and returning to heaven, I think NOT....

Blade
Title: Re: Hell's Population Clock
Post by: Olde Tymer on May 16, 2019, 08:46:21 am
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Right about the same time that I had resigned to a future in hell; a friend suggested that I buy a Bible and begin reading it for myself.

So I picked up a cheap one, and began soldiering thru it a little every day till I eventually came upon the passage below:

"I will give you a new heart and put a new spirit in you; I will remove from you your heart of stone and give you a heart of flesh. And I will put My spirit in you and move you to follow My decrees and be careful to keep My laws." (Ezek 36:26-27)

Bang!! That passage really made me sit up and pay attention because it was the spot-on remedy I needed in order to cure the very problem mentioned in post No.88 that was keeping me out of heaven, i.e. the problem of human nature.

But the promise was made to the Jews rather than to non Jews like myself. Would I have to convert to Judaism in order to take advantage of it? Apparently not. According to Eph 2:11-22 the promise has been made available to everyone regardless of their ethnic identity. And besides, according to Heb 8:13, Judaism is obsolete; so converting to it at this point in time wouldn't be useful.
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Title: Re: Hell's Population Clock
Post by: Bladerunner on May 16, 2019, 07:53:59 pm
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Right about the same time that I had resigned to a future in hell; a friend suggested that I buy a Bible and begin reading it for myself.

So I picked up a cheap one, and began soldiering thru it a little every day till I eventually came upon the passage below:

"I will give you a new heart and put a new spirit in you; I will remove from you your heart of stone and give you a heart of flesh. And I will put My spirit in you and move you to follow My decrees and be careful to keep My laws." (Ezek 36:26-27)

Bang!! That passage really made me sit up and pay attention because it was the spot-on remedy I needed in order to cure the very problem mentioned in post No.88 that was keeping me out of heaven, i.e. the problem of human nature.

But the promise was made to the Jews rather than to non Jews like myself. Would I have to convert to Judaism in order to take advantage of it? Apparently not. According to Eph 2:11-22 the promise has been made available to everyone regardless of their ethnic identity. And besides, according to Heb 8:13, Judaism is obsolete; so converting to it at this point in time wouldn't be useful.
_



Ezk 36: 26-27 is Jesus placing the spirit of the Lord within Israel... This is a forerunner of the mystery in the New Testament.

Blade

Title: Re: Hell's Population Clock
Post by: Olde Tymer on June 14, 2019, 12:24:45 pm
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Luke 23:39-40 . . One of the criminals who hung there hurled insults at him: Aren't you the Christ? Save yourself and us! But the other criminal rebuked him. Don't you fear God, he said, since you are under the same sentence?

There's a humorous incident in Dante's Inferno where these two guys are telling the other that they deserve Hell the most. It's comical because both are in Hell and it matters little who deserves to be there more than the other.


POP CLOCK UPDATE: 263 days have elapsed since beginning the thread. If the figures in post #1 are in the ball park, then something like 16,020,908 new arrivals have checked into the fiery sector of hades since Sept 24, 2018.

NOTE: The average thickness of a human hair is around .1 mm. So 16,020,908 human hairs laid side by side would spread out something like 1,602,090 mm, equaling 63,074 inches, or 5,256 feet: almost a mile.
_
Title: Re: Hell's Population Clock
Post by: Olde Tymer on June 19, 2019, 07:27:59 am
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Heb 9:13-14 . . For if the blood of goats and bulls and the sprinkling of a heifer’s ashes can sanctify those who are defiled so that their flesh is cleansed, how much more will the blood of Christ, who through the eternal spirit offered himself unblemished to God, cleanse our consciences from dead works to worship the living God.

Basically; one's conscience is sort of like a moral compass, i.e. it provides people with a sense of right, wrong, fairness, and justice. The conscience not only provides people with some guidance in those areas, but it has the rather annoying propensity to sit in judgment on its owner.

Rom 2:14-15 . . For when Gentiles who do not have the Law do instinctively the things of the Law, these, not having the Law, are a law to themselves, in that they show the work of the Law written in their hearts, their conscience bearing witness, and their thoughts alternately accusing or else defending themselves.

In it's current condition; the human conscience is unacceptable, and that's because of its source. We have to go all the way back to the beginning for that.

Gen 3:5 . . God knows well that when you eat of [the tree of the knowledge of good and evil] your eyes will be opened and you will be like gods, who know good and evil.

Was the Serpent's prediction true? Yes; to a certain extent.

Gen 3:22 . .Then the Lord God said: See. The man has become like one of us, knowing good and evil.

In other words; the Serpent neglected to inform Eve that the tree of the knowledge of good and evil has a side effect that alters people's conscience. But is the alteration an acceptable substitute for the people's original conscience; the one that came with them when they were created?

No, because now people are "like one of us" i.e. like supreme beings.

Ps 82:6 . .I said: You are gods

Along with their ill-gotten supremacy as beings came their ill-gotten supremacy in matters of right, wrong, fairness, and justice. In other words; the current condition of the human conscience is unacceptable because it was obtained by eating the fruit of a tree known to be unsuitable for human consumption. As a result; the current condition of the human conscience is diseased; hence the need to sprinkle it, so to speak, with Jesus' blood.

The sprinkling doesn't cure a human's diseased conscience. The sprinkling is actually for God's sake, i.e. it makes the human sense of right, wrong, fairness, and justice tolerable for God to endure whenever somebody approaches Him in prayer and/or worship. I don't think many fully appreciate that the human conscience is equally as repulsive to God as a case of full-blown leprosy is to us.

Anyway; In the Old Testament, it was necessary to sanitize the people's conscience each and every time they approached God; which back then meant either the Tabernacle or the Temple. But a sprinkling of Jesus' blood is necessary only once, and it's adequate for all time.


POP CLOCK UPDATE: 268 days have elapsed since beginning the thread. If the figures in post #1 are in the ball park, then something like 16,325,488 new arrivals have checked into the fiery sector of hades since Sept 24, 2018.
_
Title: Re: Hell's Population Clock
Post by: Olde Tymer on June 20, 2019, 11:47:01 am
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Christ's followers retain a guilty conscience; else the passage below would be unnecessary.

"If we claim to be without sin, we deceive ourselves and the truth is not in us. If we confess our sins, He is faithful and just and will forgive us our sins and purify us from all unrighteousness. If we claim we have not sinned, we make Him out to be a liar and His word has no place in our lives." (1 John 1:8-10)

It appears to me that Christ's followers have two consciences: there's the conscience they obtained via their natural birth, and there's the conscience they obtained via the Spirit birth about which Christ spoke at John 3:3-12. The "born again" conscience i.e. the new man's conscience, is of course totally free of guilt.

"No one who is born of God practices sin, because His seed abides in him; and he cannot sin, because he is born of God." (1 John 3:9)

One morning in Sunday school class several years ago, a man asked our speaker about the status of unconfessed sins? Do they follow us into the afterlife?

Unfortunately the speaker ignored the man's question and continued with his lesson plan. But later at home I pondered that man's inquiry because it seemed to me something very important to think about.

Well; as it turns out, the old man and the new man don't share a common conscience. By means of a mysterious procedure performed by the power of God, the new man is its own person distinctly separate from the old man.

"In him you were also circumcised with a circumcision made without hands, in the removal of the body of the flesh by the circumcision of Christ" (Col 2:11)

So then, I think we can safely assume that when his followers' body of the flesh passes away, their natural-born conscience passes away right along with it, and they go into eternity with only their Spirit-born conscience, which of course is not responsible for the old man's sins. Neato!
_
Title: Re: Hell's Population Clock
Post by: Olde Tymer on July 04, 2019, 09:16:54 pm
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There's a variety of negative opinions about God all across the internet. Some say He's cruel, sadistic, heartless, unjust, unfair, unkind, a despotic bully, a monster, sexist, and just a general all around jerk.

Well, it matters little whether He's all that, and more. It's futile to criticize God and rake Him across the coals because God can't be stopped no matter what His faults.

There's very little to be gained by a man on the gallows with a noose already around his neck turning to the executioner and saying: Your breath stinks. Well; maybe it really does stink but the condemned man is still going to get his neck stretched regardless. He will have the satisfaction of getting in a parting shot but pointing out the executioner's faults won't stop him from doing his job.


POP CLOCK UPDATE: 283 days have elapsed since beginning the thread. If the figures in post #1 are in the ball park, then something like 17,239,228 new arrivals have checked into the fiery sector of hades since Sept 24, 2018.
_
Title: Re: Hell's Population Clock
Post by: Olde Tymer on July 13, 2019, 09:59:31 am
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John 5:24 . . I assure you, those who heed my message, and trust in God who sent me, have eternal life. They will never be condemned for their sins, but they have already passed from death into life.

The reason they will never be condemned for their sins is because Christ was raised again for their justification. (Rom 4:25). The Greek word is dikaiosis (dik-ah'-yo-sis) which essentially means acquittal-- a legal term that can be roughly defined as the act of adjudicating that a person is not guilty, i.e. an acquittal is a legal declaration of innocence.

According to 1John 1:8-10, Christ's followers are never 100% sinless in this life; but that's no longer a legal issue for his sheep seeing as how according to 2Cor 5:19 God is no longer keeping a record of their sins as an indictment to hold against them at the great white throne event depicted at Rev 20:11-15.


FAQ: If it's true that people in Hell are destined to be stuck there forever, then wouldn't it be accurate to say they have eternal life seeing as how they will never cease to exist?

A: Eternal life has practically nothing at all to do with longevity.

Eternal life has to do with God's basic nature, i.e. the very core of His divine being; whereas human life has to do with a human's basic nature, i.e. the very core of a created being.

People in Hell live and move and have their being with human nature; whereas people in Heaven live and move and have their being with divine nature. (2Pet 1:4)

If people in heaven really and truly do have divine nature rather than human nature, then just imagine how easy it is for them to please God not just some of the time, nor even most of the time; but all of the time.

The tree of life in the garden of Eden would've extended longevity indefinitely for as long as the people kept nourishing themselves with its fruit and using its leaves for remedies (Gen 3:22, Rev 22:2). So that goes to show that it isn't necessary for humans to have eternal life in order for them to exist a long, long time. There are other ways to keep human life going. I suspect that God has quite a few tricks up His sleeve about which we are thus far unaware.


POP CLOCK UPDATE: 292 days have elapsed since beginning the thread. If the figures in post #1 are in the ball park, then something like 17,787,472 new arrivals have checked into the fiery sector of hades since Sept 24, 2018.
_
Title: Re: Hell's Population Clock
Post by: Bladerunner on July 14, 2019, 09:45:31 pm
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John 5:24 . . I assure you, those who heed my message, and trust in God who sent me, have eternal life. They will never be condemned for their sins, but they have already passed from death into life.

The reason they will never be condemned for their sins is because Christ was raised again for their justification. (Rom 4:25). The Greek word is dikaiosis (dik-ah'-yo-sis) which essentially means acquittal-- a legal term that can be roughly defined as the act of adjudicating that a person is not guilty, i.e. an acquittal is a legal declaration of innocence.

According to 1John 1:8-10, Christ's followers are never 100% sinless in this life; but that's no longer a legal issue for his sheep seeing as how according to 2Cor 5:19 God is no longer keeping a record of their sins as an indictment to hold against them at the great white throne event depicted at Rev 20:11-15.


FAQ: If it's true that people in Hell are destined to be stuck there forever, then wouldn't it be accurate to say they have eternal life seeing as how they will never cease to exist?

A: Eternal life has practically nothing at all to do with longevity.

Eternal life has to do with God's basic nature, i.e. the very core of His divine being; whereas human life has to do with a human's basic nature, i.e. the very core of a created being.

People in Hell live and move and have their being with human nature; whereas people in Heaven live and move and have their being with divine nature. (2Pet 1:4)

If people in heaven really and truly do have divine nature rather than human nature, then just imagine how easy it is for them to please God not just some of the time, nor even most of the time; but all of the time.

The tree of life in the garden of Eden would've extended longevity indefinitely for as long as the people kept nourishing themselves with its fruit and using its leaves for remedies (Gen 3:22, Rev 22:2). So that goes to show that it isn't necessary for humans to have eternal life in order for them to exist a long, long time. There are other ways to keep human life going. I suspect that God has quite a few tricks up His sleeve about which we are thus far unaware.


POP CLOCK UPDATE: 292 days have elapsed since beginning the thread. If the figures in post #1 are in the ball park, then something like 17,787,472 new arrivals have checked into the fiery sector of hades since Sept 24, 2018.
_


So far heaven is just a holding area for those who have died and are awaiting...   

Blade
Title: Re: Hell's Population Clock
Post by: Olde Tymer on July 18, 2019, 10:15:45 am
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I'm sometimes very curious why seemingly normal foods are hazardous to so many people, i.e. salt, fat, sugar, gluten, peanuts, dairy, red meat; etc.

Ps 69:22 . . May their table before them become a snare;

I don't know if the above is supposed to be arbitrary, but it sure seems to be because health issues related to nourishment are everywhere regardless of race, gender, age, or religious preference.


POP CLOCK UPDATE: 297 days have elapsed since beginning the thread. If the figures in post #1 are in the ball park, then something like 18,092,052 new arrivals have checked into the fiery sector of hades since Sept 24, 2018.
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Title: Re: Hell's Population Clock
Post by: Olde Tymer on July 23, 2019, 09:11:07 am
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"A voice rings out; Proclaim! Another asks; What shall I proclaim? All flesh is grass, all its goodness like flowers of the field: Grass withers, flowers fade when the breath of the Lord blows on them. Indeed, man is but grass: Grass withers, flowers fade" (Isa 40:6-8)

Man is but perishable fruit like peaches, pears, strawberries, cantaloupe, avocado, and oranges; no amount of refrigeration will keep him fresh. Regardless of the amount of rest, fresh air, good diet, and exercise; man begins to wither right around the age of 32 or 34.

Youngster's can't really appreciate their expiration date as three brief decades: to them, 32 or 34 years seems long and way out in the distance. As a result, the withering process often sneaks up and takes them by surprise like starting a frog off in cool water and slowly bringing it up to a boil. Of a sudden, one day it swats them in the face like a rolled up newspaper that they're "old school" replaced by a young, hip generation wherein they've been accustomed to thinking all along was themselves.

The aging process, once it starts, is relentless. Its personality is sort of like that of the robot in Arnold Schwarzenegger's movie "The Terminator" which is a machine that can't be bargained with, it can't be reasoned with, it doesn't feel pity or remorse or fear, and it absolutely will not stop-- ever! -- until you are dead.

The aging process is a cold as steel wake-up call that your tenure on this planet is rapidly winding down to a close; and one day, it will be like you were never here.


POP CLOCK UPDATE: 302 days have elapsed since beginning the thread. If the figures in post #1 are in the ball park, then something like 18,369,632 new arrivals have checked into the fiery sector of hades since Sept 24, 2018.
_
Title: Re: Hell's Population Clock
Post by: Olde Tymer on July 31, 2019, 06:52:09 pm
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Matt 28:18 . . Jesus came to them and said: All authority in heaven and on earth has been given to me.

Acts 1:9 . . He was taken up before their very eyes, and a cloud hid him from their sight.

Dan 7:13-14 . . In my vision at night I looked, and there before me was one like a son of man, coming with the clouds of heaven. He approached the Ancient of Days and was led into His presence. He was given authority, glory and sovereign power; all peoples, nations and men of every language worshiped him. His dominion is an everlasting dominion that will not pass away, and his kingdom is one that will never be destroyed.

Rev 5:11-12 . . I looked and heard the voice of many angels, numbering thousands upon thousands, and ten thousand times ten thousand. They encircled the throne and the living creatures and the elders. In a loud voice they sang: Worthy is the Lamb, who was slain, to receive power and wealth and wisdom and strength and honor and glory and praise!

Acts 1:10-11 . .They were looking intently up into the sky as he was going, when suddenly two men dressed in white stood beside them. Men of Galilee-- they said --why do you stand here looking into the sky? This same Jesus, who has been taken from you into heaven, will come back in the same way you have seen him go into heaven.

Rev 1:7 . . Look! he is coming with the clouds, and every eye will see him


POP CLOCK UPDATE: 310 days have elapsed since beginning the thread. If the figures in post #1 are in the ball park, then something like 18,883,960 new arrivals have checked into the fiery sector of hades since Sept 24, 2018.
_
Title: Re: Hell's Population Clock
Post by: Bladerunner on August 04, 2019, 07:44:31 pm
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Matt 28:18 . . Jesus came to them and said: All authority in heaven and on earth has been given to me.

Acts 1:9 . . He was taken up before their very eyes, and a cloud hid him from their sight.

Dan 7:13-14 . . In my vision at night I looked, and there before me was one like a son of man, coming with the clouds of heaven. He approached the Ancient of Days and was led into His presence. He was given authority, glory and sovereign power; all peoples, nations and men of every language worshiped him. His dominion is an everlasting dominion that will not pass away, and his kingdom is one that will never be destroyed.

Rev 5:11-12 . . I looked and heard the voice of many angels, numbering thousands upon thousands, and ten thousand times ten thousand. They encircled the throne and the living creatures and the elders. In a loud voice they sang: Worthy is the Lamb, who was slain, to receive power and wealth and wisdom and strength and honor and glory and praise!


POP CLOCK UPDATE: 310 days have elapsed since beginning the thread. If the figures in post #1 are in the ball park, then something like 18,883,960 new arrivals have checked into the fiery sector of hades since Sept 24, 2018.
_


still counting I see

Blade
Title: Re: Hell's Population Clock
Post by: Olde Tymer on August 20, 2019, 09:39:13 am
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Years ago when I underwent recruit training in the US Army, we were processed in alphabetical order; consequently I was at the back of the line for just about everything except chow because my last name begins with W --very few guys' names began with X, Y, or Z.

If perchance the great white throne event depicted at Rev 20:11-15 is scheduled to be done in alphabetical order, it would quite possibly be centuries before my turn came to face the music were I among those in line to be called forward.

Let's say, for example, that the pop clock update below represents one hour in court per person. No doubt that's an extremely conservative amount of time allotted to evaluate every little detail in peoples' lives but we're just being hypothetical here so it doesn't matter.

Well; 20,102,280 hours equals 837,595 days of twenty-fours hours each; which adds up to 2,295 years if the great white throne event is scheduled to run non-stop, day and night, 24/7


POP CLOCK UPDATE: 330 days have elapsed since beginning the thread. If the figures in post #1 are in the ball park, then something like 20,102,280 new arrivals have checked into the fiery sector of hades since Sept 24, 2018.
_
Title: Re: Hell's Population Clock
Post by: Bladerunner on August 22, 2019, 09:35:55 pm
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Years ago when I underwent recruit training in the US Army, we were processed in alphabetical order; consequently I was at the back of the line for just about everything except chow because my last name begins with W --very few guys' names began with X, Y, or Z.

If perchance the great white throne event depicted at Rev 20:11-15 is scheduled to be done in alphabetical order, it would quite possibly be centuries before my turn came to face the music were I among those in line to be called forward.

Let's say, for example, that the pop clock update below represents one hour in court per person. No doubt that's an extremely conservative amount of time allotted to evaluate every little detail in peoples' lives but we're just being hypothetical here so it doesn't matter.

Well; 20,102,280 hours equals 837,595 days of twenty-fours hours each; which adds up to 2,295 years if the great white throne event is scheduled to run non-stop, day and night, 24/7


POP CLOCK UPDATE: 330 days have elapsed since beginning the thread. If the figures in post #1 are in the ball park, then something like 20,102,280 new arrivals have checked into the fiery sector of hades since Sept 24, 2018.
_


don't want to be a part of that White Throne Judgement...Bad vibes

Blade
Title: Re: Hell's Population Clock
Post by: Olde Tymer on September 10, 2019, 10:28:37 am
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Something I've been curious about for some time now is why the rich man in Luke's narrative arrived in a place of flame and torment while the poor man was taken to a place of comfort.

Well; one thing I strongly suspect is that at the time of the incident recorded in Luke 16:19-31, Christ was not yet born in the land of Israel; so then, there was not yet a gospel to believe in the New Testament.

Abraham mentions the Old Testament's law and its prophets; which apparently the rich man had not studied, nor taken seriously; consequently he was impious and a complete failure at complying with the covenant that Moses' people agreed upon with God as per Exodus, Leviticus, Numbers, and Deuteronomy. Well, if so; then that was a fatal error.

● Deut 27:26 . . Cursed is the man who does not uphold the words of this law by carrying them out.

The grammatical tense of that curse is present tense rather than future, indicating that the curse is instant, i.e. no delay and no waiting period; ergo: scofflaws are walking dead men; and if they cross over into the next life as dead men, then their fate will be just as solidly sealed as the rich man's fate.

● Luke 16:27-31 . . I beg you, father, send Lazarus to my father's house, for I have five brothers. Let him warn them, so that they will not also come to this place of torment.

. . . Abraham replied: They have Moses and the Prophets; let them listen to them. The man replied: No, father Abraham; but if someone from the dead goes to them, they will repent. Abraham said to him: If they do not listen to Moses and the Prophets, they will not be convinced even if someone rises from the dead.

Abraham was a prophet (Gen 20:7) which means he was an inspired man. As such, he would be privy to information that's normally unavailable to the average rank and file pew warmer. However prophets aren't meant to keep what they hear from God to themselves; they're messengers, e.g. Abraham was a teacher/mentor. (Gen 18:19)

So then, I think it's fairly safe to assume the information that Abraham passed on to the rich man came to Abraham via inspiration; which, if so, means that our reaction to his remarks should be very different than the rich man's. He brushed aside what Abraham told him; but we, I should hope, are wiser than that impious dunce because we know that a prophet's teachings are the voice of God.

I think it's pretty safe to assert that if people won't listen to Abraham, then neither will they listen to Christ.


POP CLOCK UPDATE: 351 days have elapsed since beginning the thread. If the figures in post #1 are in the ball park, then something like 21,381,516 new arrivals have checked into the fiery sector of hades since Sept 24, 2018.
_
Title: Re: Hell's Population Clock
Post by: Bladerunner on September 12, 2019, 09:49:37 pm
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Something I've been curious about for some time now is why the rich man in Luke's narrative arrived in a place of flame and torment while the poor man was taken to a place of comfort.

Well; one thing I strongly suspect is that at the time of the incident recorded in Luke 16:19-31, Christ was not yet born in the land of Israel; so then, there was not yet a gospel to believe in the New Testament.

Abraham mentions the Old Testament's law and its prophets; which apparently the rich man had not studied, nor taken seriously; consequently he was impious and a complete failure at complying with the covenant that Moses' people agreed upon with God as per Exodus, Leviticus, Numbers, and Deuteronomy. Well, if so; then that was a fatal error.

● Deut 27:26 . . Cursed is the man who does not uphold the words of this law by carrying them out.

The grammatical tense of that curse is present tense rather than future, indicating that the curse is instant, i.e. no delay and no waiting period; ergo: scofflaws are walking dead men; and if they cross over into the next life as dead men, then their fate will be just as solidly sealed as the rich man's fate.

● Luke 16:27-31 . . I beg you, father, send Lazarus to my father's house, for I have five brothers. Let him warn them, so that they will not also come to this place of torment.

. . . Abraham replied: They have Moses and the Prophets; let them listen to them. The man replied: No, father Abraham; but if someone from the dead goes to them, they will repent. Abraham said to him: If they do not listen to Moses and the Prophets, they will not be convinced even if someone rises from the dead.

Abraham was a prophet (Gen 20:7) which means he was an inspired man. As such, he would be privy to information that's normally unavailable to the average rank and file pew warmer. However prophets aren't meant to keep what they hear from God to themselves; they're messengers, e.g. Abraham was a teacher/mentor. (Gen 18:19)

So then, I think it's fairly safe to assume the information that Abraham passed on to the rich man came to Abraham via inspiration; which, if so, means that our reaction to his remarks should be very different than the rich man's. He brushed aside what Abraham told him; but we, I should hope, are wiser than that impious dunce because we know that a prophet's teachings are the voice of God.

I think it's pretty safe to assert that if people won't listen to Abraham, then neither will they listen to Christ.


POP CLOCK UPDATE: 351 days have elapsed since beginning the thread. If the figures in post #1 are in the ball park, then something like 21,381,516 new arrivals have checked into the fiery sector of hades since Sept 24, 2018.
_


I see your still counting lost souls

Blade
Title: Re: Hell's Population Clock
Post by: Olde Tymer on September 13, 2019, 10:05:54 am
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Internet forums are a cruel venue. Participants write their academic comments about hell as if we're all members of a Jane Austen book club casually discussing a chapter of Pride And Prejudice.

But the numbers that I post on this thread from time to time are not fiction; they represent real people whose lives have culminated in unspeakable tragedy. I'd much prefer eternity in a looney bin, soling my pants and drooling all over myself like a stroke victim, than be where those unfortunates are in residence now.

● Luke 16:27-28 . .The rich man answered: "I beg you, father, send Lazarus to my father's house, for I have five brothers. Let him warn them, so that they will not also come to this place of torment."

The rich man knew something about hell that apparently many of us online seem unable to fully appreciate. The time to be thinking about the hereafter is while we're in this life, now, before it ends, rather than the next when it will be too late to do anything about it.


POP CLOCK UPDATE: 354 days have elapsed since beginning the thread. If the figures in post #1 are in the ball park, then something like 21,564,264 new arrivals have checked into the fiery sector of hades since Sept 24, 2018.
_