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Author Topic: Is the church ready for the great tribulation?  (Read 2040 times)

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Billy Evmur

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The Great Tribulation is the end time persecution that Jesus warned us to expect. The root of the word tribulation is trouble. As when Jesus was born in Bethlehem and Herod was greatly troubled and all Jerusalem with him. Troublation comes from man, the picture is Jacob fleeing in great fear back to his homeland with Laban in hot pursuit and with meeting Esau who had vowed to kill him in prospect. But God was protecting Jacob.


Until you distinguish between the prophecies that deal with Israel's FALL and the prophecies that deal with Israel's RISE you will continue to jumble up prophecy.
Have faith in God
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Bladerunner

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The Great Tribulation is the end time persecution that Jesus warned us to expect. The root of the word tribulation is trouble. As when Jesus was born in Bethlehem and Herod was greatly troubled and all Jerusalem with him. Troublation comes from man, the picture is Jacob fleeing in great fear back to his homeland with Laban in hot pursuit and with meeting Esau who had vowed to kill him in prospect. But God was protecting Jacob.


Until you distinguish between the prophecies that deal with Israel's FALL and the prophecies that deal with Israel's RISE you will continue to jumble up prophecy.



So you are basing your salvation on a theory that GOD will save all ISrael, all those Jews who have lived....Does this include, Esau, Ishmael, etc...

Blade

Whatever "ALL" means it certainly doesn't mean only a 1/3rd. I am happy to let the Lord decide about Esau and Ishmael, I don't believe they are damned. On the other hand it is certain that Judas Iscariot was not saved, he is called the son of perdition.

Paul's statement "ALL Israel will be saved" is difficult to weigh.
« Last Edit: May 11, 2020, 03:25:44 am by Billy Evmur »
1 Cor 15:3-4.."For I delivered unto you first of all that which I also received, how that Christ died for our sins according to the scriptures; And that he was buried, and that he rose again the third day according to the scriptures:"

Acts 17:11.."These were more noble than those in Thessalonica, in that they received the word with all readiness of mind, and searched the scriptures daily, whether those things were so."

patrick jane

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Re: Is the church ready for the great tribulation?
« Reply #28 on: August 12, 2020, 07:19:18 am »
 ;D :D
Hearing, believing and trusting the finished work of Jesus Christ on the cross; His death, burial and resurrection for the forgiveness of sins and REPENTING, seals us with that Holy Spirit of Promise - EPHESIANS 1:10-14 KJV - The Lord is not slack concerning His promise. 2 Peter 3:9 KJV - 1 Corinthians 15:1-4 KJV - Ephesians 1:10-14 KJV - Romans 10:9-10 KJV - Romans 10:13 - Romans 10:17 - Ephesians 1:7 KJV - Colossians 1:14 KJV -


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Bladerunner

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Re: Is the church ready for the great tribulation?
« Reply #29 on: August 12, 2020, 11:13:56 pm »
The Great Tribulation is the end time persecution that Jesus warned us to expect. The root of the word tribulation is trouble. As when Jesus was born in Bethlehem and Herod was greatly troubled and all Jerusalem with him. Troublation comes from man, the picture is Jacob fleeing in great fear back to his homeland with Laban in hot pursuit and with meeting Esau who had vowed to kill him in prospect. But God was protecting Jacob.


Until you distinguish between the prophecies that deal with Israel's FALL and the prophecies that deal with Israel's RISE you will continue to jumble up prophecy.



So you are basing your salvation on a theory that GOD will save all ISrael, all those Jews who have lived....Does this include, Esau, Ishmael, etc...

Blade

Whatever "ALL" means it certainly doesn't mean only a 1/3rd. I am happy to let the Lord decide about Esau and Ishmael, I don't believe they are damned. On the other hand it is certain that Judas Iscariot was not saved, he is called the son of perdition.

Paul's statement "ALL Israel will be saved" is difficult to weigh.

God said He stated Esau. I doubt that He is saved.

Blade
1 Cor 15:3-4.."For I delivered unto you first of all that which I also received, how that Christ died for our sins according to the scriptures; And that he was buried, and that he rose again the third day according to the scriptures:"

Acts 17:11.."These were more noble than those in Thessalonica, in that they received the word with all readiness of mind, and searched the scriptures daily, whether those things were so."

Chaplain Mark Schmidt

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Re: Is the church ready for the great tribulation?
« Reply #30 on: August 12, 2020, 11:23:35 pm »
Matbe I am missing something, but I am really not concerned on who in the Bible or history that is saved and God will chose.  Beyond me and my family and friends like I have here, I worry about them and give guidance when asked.  If they are passed, nothing I can do to change there status. 

However, it is a great topic for discussion.   Do you really feel Judas is beyond saving, how about Caiaphas?  I mean there was no Christian religion at the time, so not sure how both of them can be condemed when they both had to play there parts for Christ to die for usand save us from sin.

Just courious on that part.   
« Last Edit: August 14, 2020, 01:11:23 am by Chaplain Mark Schmidt »
People sleep peaceably in their beds at night only because rough men stand ready to do violence on their behalf.

George Orwell

Billy Evmur

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Re: Is the church ready for the great tribulation?
« Reply #31 on: August 13, 2020, 05:29:19 am »
The Great Tribulation is the end time persecution that Jesus warned us to expect. The root of the word tribulation is trouble. As when Jesus was born in Bethlehem and Herod was greatly troubled and all Jerusalem with him. Troublation comes from man, the picture is Jacob fleeing in great fear back to his homeland with Laban in hot pursuit and with meeting Esau who had vowed to kill him in prospect. But God was protecting Jacob.


Until you distinguish between the prophecies that deal with Israel's FALL and the prophecies that deal with Israel's RISE you will continue to jumble up prophecy.



So you are basing your salvation on a theory that GOD will save all ISrael, all those Jews who have lived....Does this include, Esau, Ishmael, etc...

Blade

Whatever "ALL" means it certainly doesn't mean only a 1/3rd. I am happy to let the Lord decide about Esau and Ishmael, I don't believe they are damned. On the other hand it is certain that Judas Iscariot was not saved, he is called the son of perdition.

Paul's statement "ALL Israel will be saved" is difficult to weigh.

God said He stated Esau. I doubt that He is saved.

Blade
God says we must hate our mother and our father ... even our own life.


The statement simply means Jacob was preferred over Esau for the BLESSING not for salvation. Election is to be conformed to Christ, to be a blessing to the world, not unto salvation per se. Though of course we must be saved in order for that to happen.


... but it does not exclude anyone else from being saved.
Have faith in God

Billy Evmur

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Re: Is the church ready for the great tribulation?
« Reply #32 on: August 13, 2020, 05:34:01 am »
Matbe I am missing something, but I am really not concerned on who in the Bible or history that is saved and God will chose.  Beyond me and my family and friends like I have here, I worry about them and give guidance when asked.  If they are pasted, nothing I can do to change there status. 

However, it is a great topic for discussion.   Do you really feel Judas is beyond saving, how about Caiaphas?  I mean there was no Christian religion at the time, so not sure how both of them can be condemed when they both had to play there parts for Christ to die for usand save us from sin.

Just courious on that part.


My understanding has always been that WE are passed over from judgement into life, we are saved, already part of the new creation. Everyone else will be judged.


.... but in the last judgement we see sheeps as well as goats. And this judgement takes place AFTER the 1,000 years reign, AFTER the rapture. We will have reigned with Christ in heaven and the Jews will have reigned with Him on earth. 
Have faith in God

Bladerunner

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Re: Is the church ready for the great tribulation?
« Reply #33 on: August 13, 2020, 08:42:57 am »
Maybe I am missing something, but I am really not concerned on who in the Bible or history that is saved and God will chose.  Beyond me and my family and friends like I have here, I worry about them and give guidance when asked.  If they are pasted, nothing I can do to change there status. 

However, it is a great topic for discussion.   Do you really feel Judas is beyond saving, how about Caiaphas?  I mean there was no Christian religion at the time, so not sure how both of them can be condemed when they both had to play there parts for Christ to die for usand save us from sin.

Just courious on that part.

Hi. Mark, must have missed this post.   

First, what do you mean by "pasted" just wanted to know.

Second, Judas killed himself preventing any salvation. For after death there is no salvation until maybe the White Throne Judgment.

Caiaphas on the other hand did not change and did not lead His people to Jesus. I doubt very seriously if He was saved.

Pontius Pilate did suspect or Know that Jesus was the true Messiah of Israel. He wrote in three languages on the Name plate of Jesus at the cross, Jesus the Nazarine, King of the Jews. He also according to scripture does not appear to be surprised that Jesus would not and was not there after three days. I believe He will be one in Heaven, I will get Pontius Pilate to see.

 Blade



1 Cor 15:3-4.."For I delivered unto you first of all that which I also received, how that Christ died for our sins according to the scriptures; And that he was buried, and that he rose again the third day according to the scriptures:"

Acts 17:11.."These were more noble than those in Thessalonica, in that they received the word with all readiness of mind, and searched the scriptures daily, whether those things were so."

Bladerunner

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Re: Is the church ready for the great tribulation?
« Reply #34 on: August 13, 2020, 08:48:33 am »
Matbe I am missing something, but I am really not concerned on who in the Bible or history that is saved and God will chose.  Beyond me and my family and friends like I have here, I worry about them and give guidance when asked.  If they are pasted, nothing I can do to change there status. 

However, it is a great topic for discussion.   Do you really feel Judas is beyond saving, how about Caiaphas?  I mean there was no Christian religion at the time, so not sure how both of them can be condemed when they both had to play there parts for Christ to die for usand save us from sin.

Just courious on that part.


My understanding has always been that WE are passed over from judgement into life, we are saved, already part of the new creation. Everyone else will be judged.


.... but in the last judgement we see sheeps as well as goats. And this judgement takes place AFTER the 1,000 years reign, AFTER the rapture. We will have reigned with Christ in heaven and the Jews will have reigned with Him on earth.

Billy..  who is the WE that have been passed over....Your sins will be accounted for and judged unless you accept Jesus Christ as you Lord and Savior.

The White Throne Judgment is the last judgment. The Sheep and Goats are those people in those nations that befriended Israel or NOT! It takes place prior to the Millennium. Those Sheep will the the gentile nations that will live through the millennium. The goats will have been killed and thrown into Hell...to await another 1,000 years for judgment.

Your having a problem getting things in order where before you had no problems in this area. Are you OK!

Blade
1 Cor 15:3-4.."For I delivered unto you first of all that which I also received, how that Christ died for our sins according to the scriptures; And that he was buried, and that he rose again the third day according to the scriptures:"

Acts 17:11.."These were more noble than those in Thessalonica, in that they received the word with all readiness of mind, and searched the scriptures daily, whether those things were so."

Chaplain Mark Schmidt

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Re: Is the church ready for the great tribulation?
« Reply #35 on: August 14, 2020, 01:13:04 am »
I meant passed, as in passed away, note paste.  Sorry failed to proof read.
People sleep peaceably in their beds at night only because rough men stand ready to do violence on their behalf.

George Orwell

Billy Evmur

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Re: Is the church ready for the great tribulation?
« Reply #36 on: August 14, 2020, 04:32:10 am »
Matbe I am missing something, but I am really not concerned on who in the Bible or history that is saved and God will chose.  Beyond me and my family and friends like I have here, I worry about them and give guidance when asked.  If they are pasted, nothing I can do to change there status. 

However, it is a great topic for discussion.   Do you really feel Judas is beyond saving, how about Caiaphas?  I mean there was no Christian religion at the time, so not sure how both of them can be condemed when they both had to play there parts for Christ to die for usand save us from sin.

Just courious on that part.


My understanding has always been that WE are passed over from judgement into life, we are saved, already part of the new creation. Everyone else will be judged.


.... but in the last judgement we see sheeps as well as goats. And this judgement takes place AFTER the 1,000 years reign, AFTER the rapture. We will have reigned with Christ in heaven and the Jews will have reigned with Him on earth.

Billy..  who is the WE that have been passed over....Your sins will be accounted for and judged unless you accept Jesus Christ as you Lord and Savior.

The White Throne Judgment is the last judgment. The Sheep and Goats are those people in those nations that befriended Israel or NOT! It takes place prior to the Millennium. Those Sheep will the the gentile nations that will live through the millennium. The goats will have been killed and thrown into Hell...to await another 1,000 years for judgment.

Your having a problem getting things in order where before you had no problems in this area. Are you OK!

Blade
Hi Blade, I'm OK, a cooler cat than yesterday thankfully the temperature has dropped.


I've been saved for more than 40 years Blade. I will be judged as to works but my eternal home is heaven.


Your order of events is skew whiff, the GWT judgement is the final judgement after every single person to have ever lived will be raised. The sheep are awarded an inheritance, the goats eternal punishment.


... cannot possibly happen before the Mill ... no way possible.



Have faith in God

Bladerunner

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Re: Is the church ready for the great tribulation?
« Reply #37 on: August 14, 2020, 09:07:06 am »
Matbe I am missing something, but I am really not concerned on who in the Bible or history that is saved and God will chose.  Beyond me and my family and friends like I have here, I worry about them and give guidance when asked.  If they are pasted, nothing I can do to change there status. 

However, it is a great topic for discussion.   Do you really feel Judas is beyond saving, how about Caiaphas?  I mean there was no Christian religion at the time, so not sure how both of them can be condemed when they both had to play there parts for Christ to die for usand save us from sin.

Just courious on that part.


My understanding has always been that WE are passed over from judgement into life, we are saved, already part of the new creation. Everyone else will be judged.


.... but in the last judgement we see sheeps as well as goats. And this judgement takes place AFTER the 1,000 years reign, AFTER the rapture. We will have reigned with Christ in heaven and the Jews will have reigned with Him on earth.

Billy..  who is the WE that have been passed over....Your sins will be accounted for and judged unless you accept Jesus Christ as you Lord and Savior.

The White Throne Judgment is the last judgment. The Sheep and Goats are those people in those nations that befriended Israel or NOT! It takes place prior to the Millennium. Those Sheep will the the gentile nations that will live through the millennium. The goats will have been killed and thrown into Hell...to await another 1,000 years for judgment.

Your having a problem getting things in order where before you had no problems in this area. Are you OK!

Blade
Hi Blade, I'm OK, a cooler cat than yesterday thankfully the temperature has dropped.


I've been saved for more than 40 years Blade. I will be judged as to works but my eternal home is heaven.


Your order of events is skew whiff, the GWT judgement is the final judgement after every single person to have ever lived will be raised. The sheep are awarded an inheritance, the goats eternal punishment.


... cannot possibly happen before the Mill ... no way possible.

don't know where you are getting your Eschatology but your timelines are all wrong and this puts your salvation in jeopardy.

Blade
1 Cor 15:3-4.."For I delivered unto you first of all that which I also received, how that Christ died for our sins according to the scriptures; And that he was buried, and that he rose again the third day according to the scriptures:"

Acts 17:11.."These were more noble than those in Thessalonica, in that they received the word with all readiness of mind, and searched the scriptures daily, whether those things were so."

Billy Evmur

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Re: Is the church ready for the great tribulation?
« Reply #38 on: August 15, 2020, 03:58:15 am »
Matbe I am missing something, but I am really not concerned on who in the Bible or history that is saved and God will chose.  Beyond me and my family and friends like I have here, I worry about them and give guidance when asked.  If they are pasted, nothing I can do to change there status. 

However, it is a great topic for discussion.   Do you really feel Judas is beyond saving, how about Caiaphas?  I mean there was no Christian religion at the time, so not sure how both of them can be condemed when they both had to play there parts for Christ to die for usand save us from sin.

Just courious on that part.


My understanding has always been that WE are passed over from judgement into life, we are saved, already part of the new creation. Everyone else will be judged.


.... but in the last judgement we see sheeps as well as goats. And this judgement takes place AFTER the 1,000 years reign, AFTER the rapture. We will have reigned with Christ in heaven and the Jews will have reigned with Him on earth.

Billy..  who is the WE that have been passed over....Your sins will be accounted for and judged unless you accept Jesus Christ as you Lord and Savior.

The White Throne Judgment is the last judgment. The Sheep and Goats are those people in those nations that befriended Israel or NOT! It takes place prior to the Millennium. Those Sheep will the the gentile nations that will live through the millennium. The goats will have been killed and thrown into Hell...to await another 1,000 years for judgment.

Your having a problem getting things in order where before you had no problems in this area. Are you OK!

Blade
Hi Blade, I'm OK, a cooler cat than yesterday thankfully the temperature has dropped.


I've been saved for more than 40 years Blade. I will be judged as to works but my eternal home is heaven.


Your order of events is skew whiff, the GWT judgement is the final judgement after every single person to have ever lived will be raised. The sheep are awarded an inheritance, the goats eternal punishment.


... cannot possibly happen before the Mill ... no way possible.

don't know where you are getting your Eschatology but your timelines are all wrong and this puts your salvation in jeopardy.

Blade


You will read in Revelations 21 that the GWT judgement which is the same as the sheeps and goats follow the resurrection of the quick and dead and is the last judgement.


Somebody's view on eschatological matters does not affect their salvation. What a strange thing for you to believe.


It DOES have a great bearing upon the gospel message we preach.
Have faith in God

 

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