patrick jane forums

Quote from: Bladerunner on May 03, 2020, 07:04:01 pm

Quote from: Billy Evmur on May 03, 2020, 05:41:30 am

Quote from: Jesus Truth on May 03, 2020, 05:13:54 am

I have to agree with Blade, Billy Boy.

That's ok.


Blade and I have a history of disagreement but I hope we are still friends.

Of Course we are, but I am going to keep trying to get you to see the pretrib theology....


Blade

It is a modern doctrine, Jesus said "after the tribulation of those days ... they shall see the Son of Man coming in the clouds" after means post.


Darby's interpretation was thrown out by British theologians so he took it to America. It is a lie.

Billy.....Mat 24:29 starts out with your words.."Immediately after the tribulation of those days" Yet, you are forgetting the context of the previous verses that Jesus is speaking of...

Starting in Mat 24:15, Jesus is telling us about the AoD that will take place and He warns people to flea Judiah immediately.   

The in Mat 24:21, His words should jar the teeth of all humanity....(KJV).."For then shall be great tribulation, such as was not since the beginning of the world to this time, no, nor ever shall be."

This "Great Tribulation" is the same as  'Jacob's Trouble' spoken by Jeremiah 30:7.

And then Jesus speaks of something unrealistic in Mat 24:22.."And except those days should be shortened, there should no flesh be saved: but for the elect's sake those days shall be shortened."  What would cause an earthly catastrophe that would kill all life on earth....Could this be Nuclear War?
It could not have been thought of in the 1860. a musket would /could not kill the whole world.

I regress,the context of your verses Mat 24:29-30..specifically Verse 29 starts out with "Immediately after the tribulation of those days" Yes, immediately after the "Great Tribulation" where 2/3 of the Jewish Nation will die and 1/3 of them will become the Remnant of all Israel.

Yes, this is the second coming of Christ as prophecy has foretold.

YET, Jesus is speaking to the Jews of the time...His Church had not even started at this time.... He was telling the Jews what was going to happen to them specifially.....Later in Acts 2, the Church is born and those who believe in His Gospel will be spared the horrors of Daniel's 70th  containing "the Great Tribulation/ Jacob's trouble.

Billy, If you are in Christ totally, then you will not have to live through this time period. You and I will watch it from the Messinine of Heaven.

Darby did not interpret "that Lie" as you call it.....for it was taught prior to 1800's.

I found this in the Koinonia house archives: Grant Jeffrey has found an ancient citation from a sermon ascribed to Ephraem of Nisibis (306-373 a.d.), which clearly teaches that believers will be raptured and taken to Heaven before The Tribulation (The citation was found in a footnote in Paul J. Alexander's The Byzantine Apocalyptic Tradition, University of California Press, Berkeley, CA, 1985, p. 210. Dr. Paul Alexander is probably the most authoritative scholar on the writings of the early Byzantine Church. )

Ephraem of Nisibis was the most important and prolific of the Syrian church fathers and a witness to early Christianity on the fringes of the Roman Empire in the late fourth century. 

This sermon is deemed to be one of the most interesting apocalyptic texts of the early Middle Ages. The translation of the sermon includes the following segment: (The English translation of the Latin text in C.P. Caspari's Briefe, Abhandlungen und Predigten aus den zwei letzten Jahrhunderten des kirchlichen Altertums und dem Anfang des Mittelater (Christiania, 1890, pp. 208-20) was provided by Cameron Rhoades, instructor of Latin at Tyndale Theological Seminary, Ft. Worth, TX. )

    "For all the saints and Elect of God are gathered, prior to the tribulation that is to come, and are taken to the Lord lest they see the confusion that is to overwhelm the world because of our sins."



Billy, I ask you,...there are all kinds of proof that the Rapture was preached back to Paul's days....FoDO you really doubt the WORD of JESUS that much?

 It is worth saying again.:Ephraem of Nisibis did NOT doubt. Again a part of His sermon in the fourth century (300s)..,

"For all the saints and Elect of God are gathered, prior to the tribulation that is to come, and are taken to the Lord lest they see the confusion that is to overwhelm the world because of our sins"

Blade