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Author Topic: Pre-Conception Existence - an intro  (Read 7736 times)

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Mr E

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Re: Pre-Conception Existence - an intro
« Reply #91 on: June 29, 2021, 07:05:56 pm »
Very.... umm.... Calvinist.

Do you have a Christian Reformed background for your beliefs?  I ask because they are the most likely to get hung up on "election."
My goodness, what have you gone thru that the mere mention of the word election triggers such a knee jerk response???


I have no Calvinist background. I deplore the obvious inadequacies of Calvinist theology that led him into such blasphemous doctrines as UNconditional election.


If you should ever get out of your memories and relook at Calvinism again,  you will quit equating me with them...you do yourself no favours with such a blatant disregard for my true pov.


Election is a fact. it has meaning. It affects our life.
Calvin botched it royally. I've spent 12 years dening Calvisit election publically.
Others botched it too but at least they don't always delve into blasphemy.


Dealing with your ad hominem disparagements is tiring...sigh.


lol.... okay Tedster... we can do it your way.

What I've "gone through" is some of your posts.  Apparently with the misconception that you might actually want to have a conversation about some of the ideas you posted.  I'm curious as to what you think are 'ad hominen attacks.'  How about you post/quote those instances so I might apologize to you.


First-  likely I wasn't clear, but I was thinking that it was Calvinism you are railing against, not believing in.  I wasn't entirely sure, so I asked if perhaps you have had some sort of background experience in dealing with Calvinists.  Asked and answered.

Since Calvinist thought concerning unconditional election where God simply chooses whom He pleases is anathema to you, I wondered if then perhaps you were a proponent of Armenian theology and the idea of conditional election, where "God knows" what it is you are going to choose at some future point in time so He chooses you because you 'are going' to choose Him.  It seems you don't abide this idea either, so now maybe we can get to the point where you might present what it is you hold to, rather than discussing the things you dislike.... I was trying to establish some kind of baseline for a conversation with you...

But-

I'm actually becoming less and less interested in having that conversation because I'm discovering you to be rather prickly and unpleasant and quick to take some kind of offense at almost anything I might ask.  I'm happy to take the discussion of such things elsewhere if you prefer (that means with other people instead of you).  Just say the word.

Ted T.

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Re: Pre-Conception Existence - an intro
« Reply #92 on: June 30, 2021, 02:59:13 pm »
Mr. E, the description of my thoughts on our fall after our election but before the creation of the physical universe is forth coming.



Verse supports are available for all parts:



ImCo:
GOD first created ALL the spirits in HIS image ie, capable of being a suitable Bride for HIM, with a free will with an equal ability and opportunity to choose to put their faith in HIM or to reject HIM and HIS heavenly purpose.When this created society matured, HE proclaimed to all HIS divinity and HIS purpose of the heavenly marriage with them, including the heavenly rewards and the dangers of hell and that salvation from sin was found only in the Son by faith, an unproven hope, in Him.

HE promised anyone who put their faith, their unproven hope, in HIM and the Son would be elected, chosen, to be HIS heavenly Bride and saved from all sin and those who rejected HIM by faith, ie, and unproven hope that HE was a liar and a false god, would be damned forever. 

The response to this proclamation separated all of creation into three groups: the holy elect, the eternally sinful reprobate and the sinful elect. The fall of some of the elect came about because some only accepted HIM so they could be free from the dangers of hell but were planning to then go their own way no matter what HE wanted from them.

Since HE is a GOD who cannot abide evil and must destroy it as soon as possible, HIS first command was to set up the judgement day to come about.  HE commanded all HIS elect to “come out from among the reprobate,” that is, to repudiate their friendships or even love for these who must be condemned because he knew some were harbouring idolatrous thoughts about the reprobate that the judgement was too harsh, too unloving and too unnecessary to be accepted. Most complied, some didn’t, becoming enslaved to sin themselves, HIS sheep gone astray into sin, needing redemption.

The next command was for HIS elect to then come out from among their elect but now sinful friends and to leave them to HIS mercy...which most accepted but some did not.

By repeated calls for those not yet sinful to come out for among the sinners HE found the level of willingness to sin (ie, their lack of willingness to be holy) in every person in creation from Satan to the least sinful person in existence including the holy elect angels who never sinned.

Then the physical universe was created which proof of HIS divinity and power ended everyone’s free will decisions about these choices, setting our self chosen fates into motion.

Satan, his demonic angels and the fallen elect were all flung into Sheol in the centre of the earth to live together in the world as the best method of bringing to holiness HIS sinful elect, Matt 13:29-30, the parable of the sower, especially considering Jesus’ explanation of the parable, Matt 13:36-39.
« Last Edit: June 30, 2021, 03:01:11 pm by Ted T. »
Wheat are NOT reborn / regenerate tares !!!

Matt 13:36-43  ...Declare unto us the parable of the tares of the field.

38 the field is the world
good seed are of the kingdom sown by the Son of man
tares are of the wicked one 39 sown by the devil


Who hath ears to hear, let him hear.

Mr E

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Re: Pre-Conception Existence - an intro
« Reply #93 on: June 30, 2021, 04:05:42 pm »
Got it.

Thanks

Bladerunner

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Re: Pre-Conception Existence - an intro
« Reply #94 on: June 30, 2021, 05:57:43 pm »
Mr. E, the description of my thoughts on our fall after our election but before the creation of the physical universe is forth coming.



Verse supports are available for all parts:



ImCo:
GOD first created ALL the spirits in HIS image ie, capable of being a suitable Bride for HIM, with a free will with an equal ability and opportunity to choose to put their faith in HIM or to reject HIM and HIS heavenly purpose.When this created society matured, HE proclaimed to all HIS divinity and HIS purpose of the heavenly marriage with them, including the heavenly rewards and the dangers of hell and that salvation from sin was found only in the Son by faith, an unproven hope, in Him.

HE promised anyone who put their faith, their unproven hope, in HIM and the Son would be elected, chosen, to be HIS heavenly Bride and saved from all sin and those who rejected HIM by faith, ie, and unproven hope that HE was a liar and a false god, would be damned forever. 

The response to this proclamation separated all of creation into three groups: the holy elect, the eternally sinful reprobate and the sinful elect. The fall of some of the elect came about because some only accepted HIM so they could be free from the dangers of hell but were planning to then go their own way no matter what HE wanted from them.

Since HE is a GOD who cannot abide evil and must destroy it as soon as possible, HIS first command was to set up the judgement day to come about.  HE commanded all HIS elect to “come out from among the reprobate,” that is, to repudiate their friendships or even love for these who must be condemned because he knew some were harbouring idolatrous thoughts about the reprobate that the judgement was too harsh, too unloving and too unnecessary to be accepted. Most complied, some didn’t, becoming enslaved to sin themselves, HIS sheep gone astray into sin, needing redemption.

The next command was for HIS elect to then come out from among their elect but now sinful friends and to leave them to HIS mercy...which most accepted but some did not.

By repeated calls for those not yet sinful to come out for among the sinners HE found the level of willingness to sin (ie, their lack of willingness to be holy) in every person in creation from Satan to the least sinful person in existence including the holy elect angels who never sinned.

Then the physical universe was created which proof of HIS divinity and power ended everyone’s free will decisions about these choices, setting our self chosen fates into motion.

Satan, his demonic angels and the fallen elect were all flung into Sheol in the centre of the earth to live together in the world as the best method of bringing to holiness HIS sinful elect, Matt 13:29-30, the parable of the sower, especially considering Jesus’ explanation of the parable, Matt 13:36-39.

You said:"HE promised anyone who put their faith, their unproven hope, in HIM and the Son would be elected, chosen, to be HIS heavenly Bride and saved from all sin and those who rejected HIM by faith, ie, and unproven hope that HE was a liar and a false god, would be damned forever.  "

This would make Him a reactionary GOD....Plus this is unbiblical....

Blade

1 Cor 15:3-4.."For I delivered unto you first of all that which I also received, how that Christ died for our sins according to the scriptures; And that he was buried, and that he rose again the third day according to the scriptures:"

Acts 17:11.."These were more noble than those in Thessalonica, in that they received the word with all readiness of mind, and searched the scriptures daily, whether those things were so."

 

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